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Tanks in Thailand

  
 
grant
14:45 / 19.09.06
I'm seeing reports on the TV news that tanks are rolling into Bangkok. Not actual pictures of tanks, just reporters describing them.

The prime minister is in New York right now, visiting the U.N.

Who would be doing this? Why? Would it be linked to Muslim forces in southern Thailand? (I know there's been what they're calling an "Islamic insurgency" behind recent arson & bombings, and they're right near Indonesia, big Muslim nation with a history of bombings.) Why not?

Is it more against election hinkiness that sees the prime minister postponing the popular vote?
 
 
nighthawk
16:05 / 19.09.06
It seems to be an intra-elite tussle at the moment, not linked to the south. From a BBC article:

Thai media say that two army factions appear to be heading for a clash, with one side backing the prime minister and the other side backing military commander Lieutenant General Sonthi Boonyaratglin.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
17:48 / 19.09.06
People have been talking about the possibility of a coup for months, ever since Thaksin stepped back up as Caretaker Prime Minister. The Nation (BKK English language newspaper) is reporting the military statement here -- it seems fairly clear that the military is not supporting Thaksin, which is a plus. On the other hand, who knows which section of the military this is, and what they're after. Witnesses are talking about several hundred troops, so it's not huge.

It looks like foreign TV stations and radio have been taken off the air, though, which is more scary.
 
 
grant
17:53 / 19.09.06
It's a coup, loyal to the king, but not necessarily authorized by him.

The stock market (US) has just tanked, and there's a sell-off in Asian currencies.

Hmmmm.
 
 
Axle
03:20 / 20.09.06
Here's an interesting take on the current coup:

The first comment is from a Thai in the capital reporting on what is happening.

23:25 Sep 19 local time... All local television channels are shut down. Tanks are rolling in the city. The capital has been completely taken over by the MILITARY coup, facing no resistance. Cellphones have also been cut. It is also rumored that some government representatives have been held captive.

No blood shed so far. Streets are dead quiet.

Of course, their biggest mistake is forgetting about the Internet.
 
 
We're The Great Old Ones Now
07:27 / 20.09.06
From the BBC this morning: But contacted by Associated Press news agency, [ousted PM Thaksin] said: "We have to accept what happened. We are not coming back soon."
[...]
It is the first coup attempt in 15 years in a country where they used to be commonplace. There were 17 of them between 1932 and 1991.

The consensus at the moment is that this has, so far, been a successful coup. Everyone's boxing clever and waiting to see what happens next. Apparently a Prime Minister will be chosen in two weeks.

Fingers crossed, I suppose.
 
 
pointless & uncalled for
08:49 / 20.09.06
Of course, their biggest mistake is forgetting about the Internet.

Not really forgotten about, but more likely come to the accurate conclusion that attempts to control the internet are largely futile unless you control the most advanced technical capacity. Unilkely that they will and thus would be redundant to expend resources in this area.
 
 
Triplets
08:52 / 20.09.06
Ousted PM Thaksin enroute to London sez BBC News.
 
 
pointless & uncalled for
09:18 / 20.09.06
The official statement issued to the press by General Sonthi.

Dear fellow countrymen and women, the Administrative Reform Group Under the Democratic System with the King as the Head of State, has successfully seized the administrative power.



As a result, the constitution of the Kingdom of Thailand , the Senate, the House of Representatives, the Cabinet, and the Constitution Court have ceased to exist.

In this connection, the Administrative Reform Group Under the Democratic System with the King as the Head of State - comprising the supreme commander and commanders of the armed forces and the National Police Bureau - has the opinion that the administration of the country by the caretaker government has created severe division unprecedented in Thai society.

The practices of corruption and malfeasance and nepotism are apparently rampant within the bureaucracy.

Moreover, there is interference with independent organizations to the extent that they are unable to perform their duties or resolve problems of the country.

If the situation is allowed to continue, national stability and economy will be affected as a whole.

Occasional political activities could have affected the dignity of His Majesty the King - the beloved monarch of the Thai people.

Therefore, the Reform Group Under the Democratic System with the King as the Head of State has the necessity to seize the administrative power in order to control and rectify the situation and bring normalcy to the country and quickly restore the people's unity.

In so doing, the Reform Group Under the Democratic System with the King as the Head of State wishes to reaffirm that it has no intention to become the administrator of the country itself, and it will return the democratic administrative power with the king as the head of state to the Thai people as soon as possible.

The group has pledged to maintain peace and order and preserve the stability of the beloved nation of the Thai people. We hereby request our fellow countrymen and women to stay calm and support our noble aspirations.

Thank you.

Hardly the ranting of a power hungry usurping despot and apparently respectful of Thailand's tradition of monarchy. Naturally I'm uneasy about miltary policing of democracy butI guess we will have to see how and when national control is relinquished. Certainly it would be less worrying if the appointment of a non-military head of state is subject to swift democratic ratification.

Still, not sure how democratic an election can be if one of the candidates has the backing of the people with all of the guns.
 
 
grant
14:34 / 20.09.06
So what's the deal? Why'd they do it?
 
 
pointless & uncalled for
14:40 / 20.09.06
Caretaker governance following a nullified election was acting in a nepotistic and self-serving fashion causing large social rifts that were harmful to society according to the head of the military who decided that it was about time something was done about it in the interests of the monarch and the people of Thailand.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
14:43 / 20.09.06
Yes, by the sounds of things a proper democratic election would probably have seen him out on his arse anyway- there just didn't seem much chance of one happening.
 
 
grant
16:03 / 20.09.06
I thought one was slated for November...
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
16:09 / 20.09.06
It was the "proper" part, rather than the "democratic" part, I think the plotters were concerned with.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
16:10 / 20.09.06
That said, I know bugger all about Thai politics other than what I read in the papers last night. That was certainly the impression I got, however. Also his opposition to enterprise while having become a millionaire off the back of an enooormous telecoms sell-off seems to have given the impression he was a man not to be trusted.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
01:24 / 21.09.06
The elections had already been postponed from October to November, and it is fairly unlikely that they would have been 'legitimate' or 'democratic'. As well as the tax evasion problem, Thaksin has been allegedly committing election fraud for almost as long as he's been in office. The protests against him in February didn't unseat him permanently. Both the Thai Electoral Commission and the Constitutional Court had failed to actually prove wrong-doing, or get him thrown out -- even though they dissolved the government and declared the election result void back in May. Thaksin has also been making thinly veiled hints that he wanted to get rid of the monarchy altogether: in July he made a comment about a 'charismatic leader' being unconcstitutional and harming democracy, by which everyone took him to mean the king. Not a popular move.

So, I'd hazard that the timing of the coup was probably dictated by some kind of deal made between various sections of the military to act. General Sonthi is now promising elections in November 2007. That article also reports that the Shinawatras have been moving assets out of Thailand for weeks, so I guess they were expecting this to happen.

(It's nice to actually know a bit about the background, instead of feeling completely ignorant.)
 
 
Disco is My Class War
04:49 / 21.09.06
There's a blog about the coup here, with links to some more photos and much more detailed information than what's being run by the global media.
 
 
Disco is My Class War
04:53 / 21.09.06
There's a post a little bit down about some confusion over blue and yellow ribbons... Yellow is the royal colour, blue in one of the colours of the Thai flag. It seems that while most of the tanks were displaying yellow ribbons on the 19th, yesterday some blue-ribboned tanks were seen, leading to fears the blue ribboners might be supporting Thai Rak Thai (Thaksin's party). But no. They were just a different lot of troops. And they've been ordered to display yellow ribbons to avoid confusion.

Seems like the troops are just for 'peace keeping'.
 
 
pointless & uncalled for
07:31 / 21.09.06
It certainly would appear so with the absence of bloodshed as yet.

A number of ranking politicians and civil servants have been taken into custody, a phrase used to imply pending legal charges rather than pending execution for being inconvenient.

Sonthi has seen fit to dissolve the Thai constitution, which is possibly the most dodgy move in the whole affair. While it seems a little insignificant in comparison to flooding the streets of the capital with armed soldiers, on a national scale the presence of a constitution has a lot of ramifications, such as demanding a form of conduct from the embodiment of the judiciary.

He's saying that a new constitution will be written and this seems to be implicated in the delay of one year before any form of democratic elections will be take place. This in itself is not unreasonable as a consitution is not something that should be knocked out in an afternoon over a couple of beers.

The thing with General Sonthi is that despite his actions there seems nothing ignoble about him. He is, in a simplistic sense, using the powers available to him to do something about what he sees as being fundamentally wrong with his coutry and that cannot continue.

It's interesting to note that the "international response" has been worded in extremely careful ways.
 
 
grant
14:37 / 21.09.06
(It's nice to actually know a bit about the background, instead of feeling completely ignorant.)

For which I thank you.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
14:40 / 21.09.06
moi aussi
 
 
pointless & uncalled for
14:15 / 22.09.06
BBC Article

It is worth bearing in mind that coup leaders have a long track record of not coming up with the goods that have formed the platform from which they have staged their overthrow of the incumbent administration. Exceptions, such as Mali's now legitimately democratically elected leader, are considered notable.

The real conflict of interests that is occuring here is that General Sonthi is claiming to be acting upon the wishes and interests of the Thai people, and indeed the king if recent news is to be believed, and at the same time is exercising very strict control over the media. How then are the wishes and interest of the people of Thailand to be properly formed if their access to news is so inhibited?
 
  
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