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Meditation: Let's Talk Shop

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14:30 / 08.08.06

Perhaps setting that time aside is useful, but i think unless its a part of your daily life as well its in danger of becoming dettached from or unearthed from everyday life.

One of the remarkable things I've found about meditation is that, even without any real effort on the part of the practitioner, it tends to seep out of one's practice into one's everyday life.

15:49 / 08.08.06

I think we're giving the idea of a formal meditative practice short shrift here. Asking how it differs from playing chess, or daydreaming, or whatever, is like asking how a training regimen for competitive weightlifting differs from employment as a furniture mover. In fact, the analogy doesn't go far enough. The systematic and focused training in mindfulness and concentration that I get from my meditation is orders of magnitude beyond anything else I've done in a similar vein, certainly beyond quotidian activities which just happen to involve concentration. I've only been at it daily for a few weeks, and I can already feel the ways in which my mind is different. And of course the effects go beyond the time I spend sitting; they permeate my life the same way that improved physical health from an exercise regimen goes beyond your time in the gym. Ev has enumerated some of these effects, and my experiences line up with his.

Unconditional Love

16:15 / 08.08.06

I have meditated on and off since 17 i am now 35, i can definately see the benefits you are talking about, but i do like to question that process, especially the role one takes as a meditator, because it is an assumed role with time it becomes a well constructed one but it still remains as a mask/role. Their is a whole underlying set of cultural connotations to practicing meditation that can create a sense of hypnosis in the practioner to the role they are assuming rather than actually meditating, they become a meditator, rather than a person that employs the skill of meditation in there life.

Rather than breaking the hypnosis through the act of meditation and learning to decondition, another just as conditioned persona is created through the process of becoming the yoga practitioner, the martial artist.

Which is why i think the emphasis on daily life is important, this is where the most readily avalible conditioned actions are taking place all the time, to bring a sense of mindfulness into these situations allows a greater awareness of habits to be encountered and hopefully with time knots to be undone.

I dont discount the sitting entirely or the research, but i think it can actually become a stumbling block, that creates a self constructed false perception of what is happening, you are the meditator no longer meditating, just being the meditator, buddhist etc etc. Settling for the being rather than the process of relating openly.

16:25 / 08.08.06

I completely agree. Reminds me of something that happened with my meditation recently. I'd been sitting in lotus during my practice until I received a knee injury which made this impossible, at least for the near future. I had to start meditating in a chair, and I hated it. Noticing this taught me a lot. It forced me to realize that I'd become attached to lotus, and that I was conflating the meditation with the trappings of meditation--the incense, my preliminary refuge mantra, the mystical-looking posture, etc. There's a real danger in getting caught up with this stuff and forgetting that point of meditation, which is to change your mind and your life for the better. So I think it's a great idea to try and break up those misconceptions by integrating meditation into daily life through a variety of eclectic methods.

17:13 / 08.08.06

I can already feel the ways in which my mind is different.

What ways? That's what I'm getting at, there is an effect it has that is different to the effect of rest, or listening to music or anything else. The experience differs from person to person and practice to practice, but what is the common factor?

17:31 / 08.08.06

I can't really speak on a common factor, as the only experiences I can really draw from are my own. But the qualities often mentioned are the ones you probably know about: feelings of increased peace, tolerace, and overall contentment. These are more pervasive than the happiness I get from reading a good book, or having a good think, or playing my guitar; they also feel less specifically anchored in the activity that produced it. I think this comes partly from greater insight into my own nature and the way it interacts with the reality surrounding me. More concretely, the positive feelings may also come from the fact that focused attention has at least some basis in the processing of the neurochemicals norepinephrine and dopamine, which also produce an antidepressant effect, i.e., developing focused attention makes you happier. But that's just speculation based on very little information and even less formal scientific training.

Other effects I've noticed in myself include better cognitive functioning. Nothing extreme, but it's clear to me that my memory is slightly better than before and my insights into problems and situations are sharper (the goings-on in Policy notwithstanding). I notice more details in my sensory experience. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I no longer suffer from insomnia. None of these changes are mind-boggling in their scope, but then again, I've been meditating daily for maybe a month. I'd be interested in hearing more from some folks with greater experience.

17:34 / 08.08.06

To summarize, I'd say the primary effects of meditation are (1) a decrease in mental "scatteredness" and the amount of stream-of-consciousness chatter in one's mind, (2) an increased ability to focus or concentrate, (3) an increased sense of calmness, (4) an increased sense of non-attachment, and (5) a feeling of contentment.

I believe that some if not all of these effects are closely interrelated. I also believe they're qualitatively different than the effects of, say, resting or listening to music.

* * *

All of this discussion about meditation reminds me of an excerpt from Crowley's "The Psychology of Hashish"

My dear Professor, how can you expect me to believe this nonsense about bacteria?

Come, saith he, to the microscope; and behold them!

I don’t see anything.

Just shift the fine adjustment — that screw there — to and fro very slowly!

I can’t see —

Keep the left eye open; you’ll see better!

Ah! — But how do I know? ...

Oh, there are a thousand questions to ask!

Is it fair observation to use lenses, which admittedly refract light and distort vision?

How do I know those specks are not dust?

Couldn’t those things be in the air?

And so on.

The Professor can convince me, of course, and the more skeptical I am the more thoroughly I shall be convinced in the end; but not until I have learned to use a microscope. And when I have learned — a matter of some months, maybe years — how can I convince the next skeptic?

Only in the same way, by teaching him to use the instrument.

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