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Unwanted information?

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17:06 / 13.06.06

I've noticed on sections of the board, mostly Comics and Film & TV, that there are certain people who post lots of updates from outside sites (usually from entertainment gossip and geeky fansites). Now, in moderation this is okay when it's relevant but a few people have taken it upon themselves to post, it seems, every single update that comes out about a new movie or comic. What this leads to, from my point of view, is a very clogged thread, gunged up with lots of updates and not a lot of actual dialogue, analysis or conversation.

It turns the thread into little more than a bulletin board, I feel. In an average case this means you will see one or two posts from various board members on a page interspersed tween 10 or more copy & paste jobs from a single person. Does it feel this way to anyone else? Sometimes it's like wading through pages adverts in a comic to get to the real story.

And surely if people were interested they would spend two minutes on Google searching for updates themselves? It's not herculean effort to dig up the latest rumours on Project X.

Should we step in and say to certain posters "hey, buddy, ease up a little"?.

18:16 / 13.06.06

I have mixed feelings about this since similar kinds of links to the ones you describe are pretty much the main starting point for discussions in the Switchboard...

18:42 / 13.06.06

I have posted updates from sites before, mostly from Chud.com, but I always post the tiniest fraction of the article, and the most salient bit.

I disagree that it's negative most of the time. Sure it can be excessive, but what isn't excessive about the Internet/Barbelith? Badger jokes? I mean really.

Most of the time, they produce discussion. Case in point, the release of the original trilogy of Star Wars onto DVD was discussed and debated in two separate threads.

19:05 / 13.06.06

I have mixed feelings about this since similar kinds of links to the ones you describe are pretty much the main starting point for discussions in the Switchboard...

i know what you mean.
one of the things about switchboard, though, is you have to choose your sources well.
it's not quite the same with comics, where often the first google hit will be all you need.

i've no idea how many points that translates to on the good idea/bad idea swingometer, mind.

19:08 / 13.06.06

it occurs as i read back that the objection seems more aimed at the wholesale copy and pasting of chunks than the posting of links and salient points, though...

i dont know.
i always err on the side of posting less of the article, more of the links.

Regrettable Juvenilia

08:08 / 14.06.06

I don't mind actual news, or say comics preview art (posted or linked), or links to/quotations from interviews in which people involved with the project give actual information about it. What bugs me is when people don't seem to be able to recognise that something is just a puff piece... There's not many people who do that however.

09:48 / 14.06.06

I have posted updates from sites before, mostly from Chud.com, but I always post the tiniest fraction of the article, and the most salient bit.

Which is fine and what I said I had no problem with.

I disagree that it's negative most of the time. Sure it can be excessive, but what isn't excessive about the Internet/Barbelith? Badger jokes? I mean really.

Two different things, dude. I'm talking about copy and pasting articles (often a lot of articles) from other sources, not people posting too many badger jokes which are usually contained to a single thread anyway. Besides, who can have too many badger jokes?

Most of the time, they produce discussion. Case in point, the release of the original trilogy of Star Wars onto DVD was discussed and debated in two separate threads.

I know and as I said - and Flyboy specifies - it's rumours and gossip getting posted that gets on my tit. A seriously annoying type of that behavious is that sort of thing getting posted, then no-one responding to it, then the poster keeping on posting/pasting/paosting the same sort of thing. That annoys me.

I realise it's an effort on behalf of the paoster to add something to the discussion but it doesn't. I'm wondering if anyone else sees this as a problem with Barbelith's quality and should moderators be dealing with it?

All Acting Regiment

09:58 / 14.06.06

Maybe we can start having two threads for each subject- a pre-release rumour thread and then a post release proper discussion thread?

10:17 / 14.06.06

Please, let's not do that.

Although a general rumour thread mighn't go astray?

I think that there's something specific in the wiki about copy and pasting large amounts of text from other websites. I agree that linkage is the way to go and that it lends, usually, to a greater level of discussion.

ONLY NICE THINGS

11:14 / 14.06.06

Please, let's not do that.

I'm not sure that this is necessarily a bad idea - you'd have to lock the rumours thread once the thing was actually released, but it would let you start fresh discussing the actual film, whether it was any good - that sort of thing.

Take a look at the "Superman Returns" thread. Before the film has come out, it's stretched to ten pages over two years. Some of those pages are just one person copying and pasting articles from Comics2film into the thread, over and over again, with no intervening response. If you've seen the film and want to talk about it, you already know who is playing Lori Lemaris, and you might not want to have to flick through the later pages trying to find the seam at which point it actually became a thread about the film you saw.

Regrettable Juvenilia

11:36 / 14.06.06

I wasn't going to be the meanie who said the name 'FinderWolf', but then I saw this, which isn't even about the film at all, FFS, and I though... why not, eh? Why not.

Mind you, if it wasn't for Wolfie, we wouldn't know that Brandon Routh's "Last name [is] pronounced like south", and where would we be then, eh? Where.

Joking aside, it's not even the stream of 'tidbits' that bothers me in those threads - it's the people dedicated to reviewing the film not only before it's been released, but in some cases before it's even been made - the announcement is made, the thread is started, and somebody informs us "this will suck". These people, I have learnt, get very very upset when you suggest they should wait until the film has been released, and ideally until they've seen it, before they pass judgment. It's this behaviour that makes a separate rumour/news thread and then a thread to talk about the actual film once it's out seem like a necessary evil.

13:27 / 14.06.06

hey there - whatever you all would like or decide about posting news on the threads discussed here, I will abide by. I know I post tons of clipped news/bits about projects, esp. films & comics...I totally understand if the moderators here feel they'd like to limit the clippings/random updates about such things. I post such things because I like to help keep people informed who may not have time to go to all the news sites but read this board and it often fosters discussion; if it's a problem I'll gladly stop. I posted the stuff about the Superman faux-soundtrack because I thought it was fun; I can hold off on that stuff in the future if mods feel it's clutter. (or perhaps that post would have been more appropriate in Music rather than Film)

I agree about not 'reviewing' a film before it comes out, ...people post things like "Hmmm, I wonder how this will be" or "Maybe it doesn't look so good" but beyond that, anything about the content should of course wait for the film's release itself. As for threads about films getting really long, I know some people don't see a problem with and others feel it's clutter...both have valid points (one hand, what's the harm, and the build-up discussion is often fun for some; on the other, I could see why it would be seen as clutter). It's sort of a potato/poh-TAH-to thing and I'll abide by whatever decision is reached, if a decision is reached.

I know in the past there's been the whole 'huge long thread for build-up discussion and then starting a fresh new thread once the movie's actually come out for discussion of the film itself' idea, which makes sense too.

Cheers!

13:47 / 14.06.06

I know I've been a bit obsessive about posting clips and likely a bit excessive as well

...I'll tone it down.

ONLY NICE THINGS

14:05 / 14.06.06

I know in the past there's been the whole 'huge long thread for build-up discussion and then starting a fresh new thread once the movie's actually come out for discussion of the film itself' idea, which makes sense too.

Yeah, I think that's a good argument - everything up to the trailers goes in one thread, and then when the film comes out that gets locked and a new thread starts. I don't have a huge opinion on the posting of links and snippets - although if you're posting ten times in a row to a thread it's worth considering that you might be repeatedly bumping a thread to the top of the page which nobody else wants there.

I think we can probably apply the same sort of thing to Comic Books - there's an element of common sense there - some run-ups will just be four posts saying "whoo!", and then into the content...

21:54 / 14.06.06

Yeah, okay, I was probably a little hasty with dismissal of the idea. Two threads on the same film/comic washing about just seemed a bit superfluous but it would make things run alot more smoothly for discussion upon actual release. If we are going to implement this in the future, if it wasn't obvious, each thread will have to be marked distinctly to differentiate them and ideally in the topic heading e.g "X-3 Rumours" so as to avoid accidental posting in either.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

09:50 / 15.06.06

When V For Vendetta was released I did put through a summary change request that would indidcate to people where the change from discussion of the film pre-release to post-release occurs. Maybe doing something like that for the films is a way to deal with the issue?

Regrettable Juvenilia

10:01 / 15.06.06

But you still have threads with a dozen pages of nothing but pre-lease blather and (usually) bitching. Which it seems unfair to require people to read if they want to talk about the film they've seen, and yet I'd like to preserve the "read the thread before you post to it" principle.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

12:21 / 15.06.06

I don't see the problem with having a pre-release thread and a post-release thread at all. The pre-release one'll likely sink after the post-release one does, and those who didn't catch the movie but are waiting for (say) the DVD can still go back to the earlier one if they want to speculate with others in the same situation.

After all, wild speculation is what the internet's for. Or is it porn? I forget.

14:21 / 15.06.06

I'm definitely for it, as mentioned in the X3 thread.

04:27 / 16.06.06

I don't think I've ever posted in a movie thread here at barbelith precisely because we haven't had a pre-release separate from post-release.

All Acting Regiment

17:44 / 18.06.06

There's a trailer for the new Wicker Man film on the net. What should we do with it?

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

21:21 / 18.06.06

It's already in the pre-release thread, I think.

All Acting Regiment

21:47 / 18.06.06

I was hoping we would burn it utterly, but okay.

...how the fuck do you fit a crow inside a school desk? It should be a beetle, fucking idiots...

Regrettable Juvenilia

21:17 / 21.06.06

Nnngh.

ONLY NICE THINGS

17:39 / 22.06.06

Does that mean there's another bleed thread, Flyboy?

I think we need to police this, by extension, by locking preview threads when the film comes out, and moderating the titles to say (PREVIEW THREAD), as the ones at present are purposed as general discussion threads...

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

19:47 / 22.06.06

Are we still allowed to get excited about unreleased records?

I have nothing against that, personally.

I also have nothing against it with movies, comics, shoes or new shades of green, other than the spoilerage thing.

I LOVE the speculation. Most of the time, it's more fun than the film/whatever itself. And when it isn't, it's loads of fun to go back and read the completely wrong speculation in light of having actually seen the thing (read the Who season 1 thread for loads of FUN!!!).

I'd like some differentiation, though.

And yes, Fly, a lot of the speculation does get really, really, pointless and anal- I totally agree on that one... but how do you stop that without also stopping the enthusiastic fun shit? I don't know.

Regrettable Juvenilia

21:34 / 22.06.06

Haus: Spidey 3 and Transformers threads, in which most recently we have learnt about rumours or reports that a teaser trailer for each may be forthcoming.

Don't get me wrong, it's not that I don't like FinderWolf, I do, I really do, I just also need him to. Fucking. OH GOD. PLEASE PLEASE STOP.

17:47 / 24.06.06

*laughs* okay, okay, point taken.....but I remember a time in which news of a first teaser trailer for a highly-anticipated comic book movie was cause for celebration!! However, it does make sense that someone like myself should hold off his itchy posting trigger finger until said theoretical trailer becomes reality and is actually available, and on that I will hold off in the future. I did think it was worth letting people know that the Spidey teaser will be attached to many prints of Superman Returns, however...there's an Aint It Cool News [text] description of the Spidey teaser out which I held off linking to because I'm in my new 'exercising more restraint' phrase. [insert joke about 'If THIS is Finder being more restrained...' here

]

I'll exercise further restraint in the future.

All Acting Regiment

19:38 / 24.06.06

Apologies for bitching about the crow in the desk, too. I'm a dick when it comes to stuff like this.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

15:28 / 28.06.06

Have we actually agreed on locking pre-release threads when the movie's out? Cos I'd still quite like to get excited about looking forward to Superman Returns, which isn't out over here for another fortnight, and it seems a bit rubbish that I can't just because the Americans got it first.

I thought the idea was that the rampant speculation didn't spoil it for those who'd seen it, and the spoilers didn't ruin it for those who hadn't.

ONLY NICE THINGS

15:34 / 28.06.06

I see your point, Stoats. Hmmm. Maybe we should change the name and leave them unlocked - although I think that would probably mean people posting randomly to whichever thread was up top...

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

15:36 / 28.06.06

Just means a touch more intrusive modding, and posters showing some restraint (okay, that's the funny part), like happened with the Season One Who threads.

ONLY NICE THINGS

15:38 / 28.06.06

You mean, we'd delete and repost posts that spoiled in the pre-release, or speculated in the post-release thread?

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

15:46 / 28.06.06

Yes. Or yelling at people.

Or possibly both.

15:52 / 28.06.06

Best thing to do is create the post release thread, unlock the other and hope for the best? It might not be as nightmarish as imagined if the threads are clearly marked... even in the topic name rather than just the abstract.

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