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Underground > Temple >

Build a virtual Qabalah

16:33 / 06.05.06

I've been in the midst of creating a database on my computer, based on advice from Old Man Crowley. Badly paraphrased, "When you have studied the correspondances, even a walk to the streetcorner will seem full of resonance and holds keys to the mysteries." (Or something along those lines. I'll look it up soon.)

Between thinking of all this data manipulation in the form of working with a database, and recently reading about this, which is essentially programming text adventure-style programs in basic english, it occurred to me to consider a overly ambitious concept. A text adventure-style Qabalah. Climbing the tree, following paths, just to explore different strata of reality.

Another term for text adventures (as some of you may know) is 'interactive fiction,' which might not be too distant from reality itself. But before I trundle down that ontological road, I though I'd bring this idea up to one of the few internet communities who might express interest.

It's just a seed of an idea right now. Feel free to steal it, do it yourself, if you prefer. Or maybe a collaborative effort, using this thread as at the very least a contact point and meeting place? I don't know. This concept is in Malkuth. What will it be like when it is brought to Kether?

19:27 / 09.05.06

I'm just giving my own thread a bump here. Though I know there've been a few attempts at collaborative magical information on Barbelith, I can't get this concept out of my head, and I'd love to hash the idea out with people who have a similar concept. A text-adventure, or interactive fiction, Qabalah

Just imagine:

"You are standing at the entry to Yesod, straight along the path from Malktuth. Everything is tinted blue. The soil beneath your feet is black and rich, fertile places for idea-seeds that drop from the Sephiroth above. This is the last step before these ideas are harvested and made manifest in Malkuth. You see a path leading to Yesod's room of Correspondences. Idea-seeds are all around you on the ground, as well as a spade."

"What do you do?"

>

16:30 / 10.05.06

Like flyboys text-based adventure game in a way, or the attempt at a narrative hypersigil we tried a while back- I'll try to find the links later.
I like the idea, but multiple authors cause trouble. An overview would be the first step so the contributors could agree on their understanding of what's what- Promethea would be a good start I think as it's accessible.
Multiple players are also difficult, one person wants to follow Judgement while another wants The World. I think the best would be one teller, one protagonist, other posters playing the roles of the entities you meet (NPCs to you roleplayers) if they want to join in.

Isn't this just a type of pathworking though?

Ian Livingstone is putting on a 'How to write fighting fantasy' workshop at the Brighton festival next week, maybe I'll pop along.

18:44 / 10.05.06

That Inform 7 looks ace, I'm going to download it. Fancy having an Interactive-TreeofLife-Short story competition over the next few months?
Otherwise, we could split one- I'll do the paths, you do the Sephira or somesuch. We might be able to add it to the narrative hypersigil site Elseware made...

19:36 / 10.05.06

A virtual-Qabalah competition? Yeep! I don't think I'm ready for such pressure!

Seriously, I've got a lot going on right now (directing a play, working during the day, writing a few comics scripts) to be able to actually do the pathwork to make an accurate, or at least resonant, Qabalah. Not that I'm ruling it out, or even that other people couldn't start making one.

I was hoping for assistance/brainstorming regarding the design of it. Grand debates about the general description of a Sephiroth, so when we get into detail about it, there's a foundation to start from. For example, one question: Should we use the paths just as connections between Sephiroth, or should they be details in their own right?

Once we've got stuff like that decided, we could start splitting up tasks.

09:43 / 11.05.06

For sure. It was a hollow threat, I barely have time to cut my hair never mind undertake another project.

I'd make ten locations (plus a secret one of course) and make the paths explorations of the relevant Major Arcana, so you can dawdle between the nodes if you want. Then make Da'ath accessible only through a tricky puzzle, so there's thirty-five nodes if you include the Fountain and the Beggar as the broken paths to Da'ath, 36 if you have the Abyss seperately, 72 if you include the Qlippothic side...

I wrote an article with a choose-your-own structure based on the tree for Gen Hex, I'll send it to you if you like (although it's not all that good tbh).

17:04 / 11.05.06

Please do send the article. I'm referencing 777 and Dion Fortune's Mystical Qabalah mostly, as well as Moore and Williams III's Promethea, but I am hungry for more research material.

Couple of things I'm fuzzy on, which is partially the reason for doing this: the secret location, I'm assuming that's Daath? I kind of got lost in this: thirty-five nodes if you include the Fountain and the Beggar as the broken paths to Da'ath, 36 if you have the Abyss seperately, 72 if you include the Qlippothic side...

But only because I'm still learning the lingo. I've got the major concepts down, now it's time to work the detail.

17:35 / 11.05.06

Just an idea.

A different way to create it instead of text-based adventure games in which you could have way more interaction on designing it if cooperation is what you are aiming for, is using a webpage and a Wiki system. Of course, the drawback is the complexity could really go down (though I don't know how complex Wikis can get, so don't trust me on that, they just seem to be state-less)

23:46 / 11.05.06

HyperSigilWiki take a look, I'll bump the old thread that spawned it when I find it. I think a wiki is the ideal format, but I can see the advantages of Inform.

Numbers wise, there are ten sephira and twenty two paths (+=32) but if you include Da'ath and the two hypothetical paths that's 35. The Qlippoth is the dark reflection of the tree (simplistically speaking) so you'd double the number (70).
You could get away with just doing the Qlippoth of the spheres and not the paths though, and keep it down to 42 nodes (22+10+10) or 46 if you include Da'ath twice (what's the Qlippothic side of Da'ath? Moore has it as a hole in the tree so it has no flip side, but I don't know) and the Beggar and Fountain.

14:58 / 12.05.06

Can you give a bit more information regarding the hypothetical paths? Are they pathways to Daath?

As for wiki versus IF, in one sense, this isn't quite so collaborative a project, at least so far, (we've only got three different people posting here!) but the goals here are twofold: 1) entering in all of the data and programming of the Tree should do pretty well for ingraining the Qabalah into me (or anyone who is involved.) 2) Creating a system that is entered as it's own application (not visited dthrough a web browser) creates what I hope would be an organic experience of this system.

21:56 / 12.05.06

Paths- yeah, Alan Moore has Promethea travel to Da'ath and they see two broken paths, defunct Tarot trumps (which would make the total 23+ 0, the fool). They are the Beggar which has implications of the king passing among his people as a beggar, but also is an old Tarot card from the 16th century. And the Fountain, which is very like the three of cups, IIRC echoing the Norns/fates/triple goddess.

Hmm. Am thinking about this, I think you're right about the format. I might start writing Tarot path descriptions as a start, because I enjoy it anyway.