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What's your role in a group?

  
 
Saturn's nod
08:35 / 19.04.06
I've been thinking recently about how people choose their role in group situations.

Each of us was first shaped in a family of origin - we had particular roles in relation to parent(s) or other carer(s), siblings and/or extended family maybe.

I think I'm starting to see that the role I took up in my family of origin in something I've acted out in many situations since, in educational, professional and social situations. I think I can see that the role I was shaped into has had quite a few advantages but at the same time leads to some hurt. I'm hoping I can reshape my behaviour to take up a role that brings me more fun and less hurt, and I'm experimenting with some magical techniques: affirmations, visualisation, mirror work, dance, to see if I can start growing in that direction.

Irvin Yalom, the existentialist psychoanalyst writes very movingly about group therapy, in which people recreate their "preferred" role in a group even through the limited interactions of a group therapy setting. I put "preferred" in scare quotes because I think especially if the person's in serious therapy, the role's not actually one that's helping them have a happy successful life working joyfully towards the sustainable future. It's the role "preferrerd" by the person's system, and not necessarily serving their current aspirations.

This is a thread to discuss the roles we see we might have taken on, and what we've done about it. Have you managed to reshape your childhood "role"? How did you do that? How has your childhood "role" benefited you?
 
 
Unconditional Love
10:43 / 19.04.06
I can adopt a variety of roles, i find it a useful skill, but i think they are done in a way that is very much me. I tend to see alot of the roles i adopt as self parody, i cant quite take what i am 100% seriously, but perhaps that just softens the blow of what i can become.

I think their are strong emotional complexes, habits that we find more comfortable than others, i like being cared for, as if i am this useless person that needs alot of proping up. Its a useful prop but it is based on a real fear of whats other to me as well. So perhaps it doesnt need to be removed but understood for its value, but understood also for the trouble it can cause when its out of my control, ie its become too habitual, an unconscious behaviour.

I dont think i can actually change them entirely, and i am not sure i want to, ive found that even the most commonly understood as negative character traits have their uses, when given conscious attention and application.

I am also fond of the sound dodgy geezer, the crazy poet, the honest chap that cant quite get it right, the man child, the screaming angry bastard(thou he gets me in trouble), the mystical guru, the artist, the con man, the disciple of kung fu, the layed back relaxed tai chi player and look how big and scary i am stay away from me guy.

Their are plenty of others kicking around in me as well, i think i had the idea that it would be a good idea to role play at real life once, what a mistake i now have a headful of characitures of aspects of myself, hence the selves parody.

It reaches a point where you begin to question the very notion of self, especially the idea of self in the singular, which can then lead to looking at the internalised social and educational structures that prop up the one self myth. This can then lead to questions about sexual identity, politics, and the other areas people use to construct identity. Its possible to discover that you may contain 2 or more elements that conflict in society but actually sit okay inside of you, you can then begin to focus on interaction of these elements socially and begin to see how you relate and shape yourself according to the relationships you percieve.

It can be a useful form of selves exploration or it can become a self indulgent ego trip, but it can also become a useful tool for selves deconstruction or selves adjustment.

Once the knack for selves creation is discovered it highlights just how much of communicative expression is performed in the singular, imagine thinking like that all the time, you might be mistaken for thinking that your only capable of being who you are.

Identity politics especially starts to present a weird set of faces, it seems sometimes to me to be about limitation, ie if i set myself up to identify as this, this in turn puts me in conflict with the percieved opposite or socially enforced confrontation of that identity, ie it can at its most basic create a them and us and then perpetuate that situation. Its not just identity politics but anything that plays with the idea of a fixed definition of self/selves, rather than say a fluid or transitory expression of conditions that create self/selves expressions for the moments those conditions are prevalent. I have found buddhism offers a good alternative to most western thinking that presents humans with the choice of a self, mainly because it rests identity upon the premise of conditions, so in order to effect a change in identity it is possible to change the surrounding and inner conditions rather than combating the idea of a self.

This can leave you in a position of selves conscious actor when addressing a multitude of differing situations, which i think is why it is also necessary to practice being these selves, just as i unconsciously practiced at being who i thought i was before hand.

Joining various chat boards with a variety of personas is one way to build up an internal frame for selves, but they also need expression in what is considered to be real life to give them a sense of solidity when they come to be worn.

I think i must state thou that changing deeply intrenched traumas is something that can take a life time if not more, but also that they can change in a profound moment of insight.
 
 
illmatic
05:21 / 20.04.06
Fascinating topic, And one I can see of being of no small relevance. I think psychonalytical models of the self still have a lot of relevance, and we are hugely shaped and affected by our childhoods.

For instance, with myself, I'm aware that one of the big components of my own identity has been shaped by the fact that my mum was a schoolteacher, who taught for a while in the school I went to. This made me very defintely shaped my attitudes towards authority and I still find myself indulging in adolescent "rebellious" behaviour from time to time. It's changing as I get older but is still there.

Similarly my racial background has hugely shaped my taste in music, and culture. I'm very defintely a modernist and it takes a real effort of will on my part to appreciate any art/cultural products produced before the end of the nineteenth century - especially those I associate with "Britishness" - I reach for something more exotic every time. When I was really young, this even shaped my choice of friends.

Have you managed to change your 'role' much since childhood, and if so, how did you do it?

That's such a hard question to answer. I think simply being conscious of any childhood "formations" is a big help. An awareness of how you act, and what attitudes might underlie this is, is a process that anyone with an ounce of self-awareness is engagaed in continually. One can address in really simple ways like diary work - however, I suppose you're asking for what has led to lasting change. I have some ideas about techniques in mind, but I'll come back to this later on. I have to balance out theory with how much I want to disclose and have to be honest about how successful I think it's been!
 
 
illmatic
14:12 / 21.04.06
Coming back to this, and bumping...

One method I've used is looking at myself and others in the light of the various models Reichan character types, and seeing if there's any patterns I can notice. I found them useful categories of thought, if not 100% "real" or accurate - but it's still an interesting process. Being aware of these had led me to perhaps reflect more on how I react in certain situations, helped in terms of general seeing patterns self-awareness, but I can't say I've taken this as far as one might do.
 
 
Benny the Ball
19:12 / 21.04.06
Always the side kick, never the lead...

Always been the way, just being on the outskirts of groups, trying to remain invisible - adopting too many copied traits from others until your true slef becomes lost, and you find yourself having to step outside of what is happening and try to trace yourself back to your true self - and so, always the sidekick, supporting role, the friend of someone else, that guy that someone knew through someone, the son of someone etc etc
 
 
Unconditional Love
20:58 / 21.04.06
Hey benny i can relate to that, but one day i had no one to be side kick too, so i had to change and be the best side kick i could be to myself, being the side kick and the leading man thou is something of a challenge, but eventually you work out that your up to it.

But then i am not to bad at being alone, i spent my years at play school with my back to the other children playing with lego and such in a corner, i still use that strategy somedays.

My other strategy is climbing fences, the fences had to be made taller in the garden when i was 2 or 3, but still no matter how tall they were made i climbed over them, i find that useful as well, i hate,intensely, being bound to anything that is not of my choosing. Those memories remind me that i am capable of freeing myself from anything.

I found the reason i could never lead the way was confidence and assertiveness, being a sidekick allowed me to bath in the glare of someone i percieved to be more confident than me, often these people want to keep you where you are, but not always, there power comes from your need for them, it makes them feel powerful, that can give you power for a while but in the long run, learning to stand on your own 2 feet becomes nessecary eventually.

Sometimes these leading people act as surrogate father /mother or brother/sister type feelings.

Its worth looking at what qualities you admire in the leading person and then trying to develope them yourself rather than relieing on them to be there all the time, because it can be quite a blow when thay are not.
 
 
pangloss
04:07 / 04.05.06
I guess my role in a group is usually as the doubting thomas, poking holes into everything until it finally works. Also, since I tend to get obsessively interested in things that other people find boring, I'll often end up as the group expert in some obscure but important area. Don't know what parts of my childhood this is connected to, but I'll certainly be thinking about it.

But what is the next step, beyond simply identifying our roles in a group and where they come from? Do we just want to be more aware of our position, and use that as a route to doing it better? In my case that might mean learning how to grumble positively, without getting people down.

But it must be more interesting to play with group roles, and choose which one to wear at any time. I remember one scene in the Invisibles where they draw lots for roles in the group, based on the elements. I like that idea, although I'm not convinced that four elements give you enough roles, or the right roles. What other variants are there on this idea?

[Also, thanks to everybody for saying such interesting things. I've learnt something from every post in this thread]
 
 
SteppersFan
11:46 / 04.05.06
It's been a while since I was active in a magical group, but then and now I like being second in command. The shift has been that I've gone from being an initiator / conceptualiser to a completer / finisher. Used to be I'd be not the leader, but the schmoozer / talker; now I'm the do-er / worker.

In terms of childhood experience I think it's a lot to do with having a "great man" type of dad who was always away... draw your own conclusions...
 
  
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