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"We decided not to be invisible any more": ¡Aquí estamos! ¡Y no nos vamos!

15:27 / 11.04.06

I took the title, "We decided not to be invisible anymore" from the Wash Post story today about the massive marches that have been occuring, and getting bigger across the US in response to proposed immigration reform. Congress is divided between politicians who want guest worker programs and legalizing of persons currently here illegally, and those who want to build stronger boarders and punish boarder crossers more severely than we already do.

The Spanish, which means, "We are HERE, and WE'RE NOT GOING AWAY!" is from the slogan being shouted. See the report here by Los Angeles Independent Media on the LA marches. Here's more from Indymedia.

What's particularly exciting about this movement, is that it is nationwide. According to the New York Times, the biggest march was in Dallas, TX, with 500,000 people! Somewhere I read 3,000 people marched in Garden City, Kansas, which has a meat packing plant that hires many Latino workers. People marched in those hotbeds of liberalism that are Boise and Birmingham.

Some reports have linked this movement to a new movement of the working poor in this country, seeking living wages (here's NPR's story on a new law to that effect being passed in LA recently) and better health care.

!Si Se Puede! They shout. Can they--make a real difference?

nyarlathotep's shoe horn

07:11 / 12.04.06

this is very encouraging, considering the trend towards reasonable leaders, more like representatives, in South America.

However, looking at the labour situation in the U.S. - the country with the most of its citizens incarcerated (of those who reported their numbers) - I fear what opposition labour activists, particularly "illegal" workers from Mexico and elsewhere will encounter from the State.

The word "illegal" is what I find frightening when put together with this and the Civilian Inmate Labor Program.

My most cynical thoughts see a potentially dark future for those caught up in the U.S. legal system.

--nj

Disco is My Class War

13:49 / 12.04.06

It seems pretty awesome to me. Waaaay encouraging.

14:01 / 12.04.06

Yeah, I started hearing about this movement on Cesar Chavez Day, which is a government holiday in California; it sounds really neat! People making noise is the only way we're going to get some positive change going.

Wish I'd known about the Boise march in advance, though; guess I'd better start looking these sorts of things up and seeing when they're scheduled for, so I can go to the next one!

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

15:56 / 12.04.06

I read the linked articles, and there is one thing I am a little unclear on.

Do the protesters want it to be easier for non-citizens living and working in the states to be given citizenship, or do they want them to be given the same rights as a US citizen without being one?

As someone who had to jump through a pile of hoops to get citizenship so I could work legally, I approve of the first one, but am a bit undecided about the second.

I love that the young people in our country are getting interested enough in a cause to march about it, and I am glad they arent resorting to the rampant desctruction of the high profile anti capitalist protests. It already seems way more effective.

16:55 / 12.04.06

Two days ago, Immigrant/workers' rights demonstrations completely shut down rush hour traffic in downtown Boston. Read about it here.

This subject is near and dear to me because I work in an industry (construction) and in a state (Massachusetts) with a rapidly growing South American (particularly Brazilian) population. Inadequate pay for immigrant workers affects the whole construction industry negatively (as well, I'm sure, as other industries where South Americans find jobs). I would love to see a crackdown on contractors paying immigrants (legal or not) below the living wage, because they're getting away with murder, getting rich off the backs of their subs, and it trickles down to everyone who works in skilled labor. Unfortunately some blame the problem on the immigrant workers (there was a small anti-immigrant protest in Framingham, which has the highest Brazilian population in MA) but they seem to be in the minority around here. I think it's wonderful to see the way immigration reshapes our communities - for example, the predominantly white (if that's not an understatement) high school I attended is now considering running bilingual courses to better accomodate the growing Brazilian population there. As the protesters said, they're here and they're staying - it's time for the rest of us to stop ignoring them and start integrating them into our communities.

16:58 / 12.04.06

Do the protesters want it to be easier for non-citizens living and working in the states to be given citizenship, or do they want them to be given the same rights as a US citizen without being one?

I am almost certain it is the former, rather than the latter. However, most of us on the pro-immigration side of the fence do believe that whether you are here "legally" or "illegally" you deserve to be treated as a human being, which it seems many people would characterize as "giving the same rights as US citizens."

Most thinking people on both (or, better, "all") sides understand that immigration issues are not simple or straightforward. But many of our de facto and explicit public policies do not treat undocumented workers as fully human (e.g., policies that directly result in the denial of medical attention, work safety regulations, and other basic human needs to undocumented workers). My perception is that most people on the strongly anti-immigrant side of the fence at some level view treating "illegal immigrants" as subhuman as a legitimate strategy for driving them out.

However, I do strongly believe not only that it is deeply unethical to treat these workers as subhuman, it is also inefffective as a mode of discouraging the immigration of impoverished Latinos (which is primarily who is targeted here), and ultimately more harmful to our society as a whole than the presence of these workers, on whom so much of our current economy depends.

Y, por eso, ¡Viva la revolucion!

(¿Who can resist the upside-down exclamation point/question mark?)

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

18:57 / 12.04.06

That was what I was assuming alas, but I wanted to have some clarification.

I think the problem would become moot if A) the people hiring undocumented workers were punished in a more damaging way and B) The migrant workers currently in the US were given either resident alien status or full citizenship, depending on their intentions of staying in the country.

You would think more documented workers = more tax dollars, which would be a good thing for the economy.

*

19:07 / 12.04.06

trashing the "Gays first, then illegals" stance:

We march because immigrants are among the most politically vulnerable, underpaid, and exploited communities in the country and are asking for basic human rights, including the right to live free from torture and exploitation, and the right to work.

We march because we recognize the connections between the state attacks on immigrant and LGBT communities, and that LGBT immigrants in particular are disproportionately affected by much anti-immigrant legislation.

We march because we oppose the heightened policing and criminalization of immigrant communities, including the increased militarization of the border, as mandated by HR 4437 and Senate bills.

We march because we oppose indefinite and mandatory detention of noncitizens--as well as the mass incarceration of people-of-color communities in the U.S. more broadly--and envision a society that ensures the safety and self-determination of all people, regardless of national origin, race, class, gender, or sexuality.

We march because we oppose the guest worker proposals, which would continue the exploitation of many low-wage workers. We march because we demand the repeal of the HIV ban.

We march because our sexualities have been historically criminalized by this country, and we understand that law and justice are not the same thing.

Tryphena Absent

21:56 / 12.04.06

This is a little off topic but I really just really wanted to say HURRAY!

Everytime I see this kind of thing it makes a little bubble of hope burst in my cold anti-US government heart that one day it's going to be full of flowers and bunnies and fairies like Tinkerbell and happy people wandering around on the street clothed in marvellous, humanitarian, civil rights legislation after a bloody battle for the worker's souls being recognised by the... I'll just shut my commie mouth now.

Disco is My Class War

05:23 / 13.04.06

It's maybe worth pointing out here that the 'pro-immigration'/'anti-immigration' distinction is not really a good one to use to frame these events. No matter how 'anti-immigration' conservative/neocon/racist discourses are out there, migrant labour is necessary to keep the US state running. But to get the best surplus-value from migrant labour, it's necessary to keep migrant workers rightless -- ie, under threat of deportation, working for low wages, with no security or medical benefits. The 'informal economy' of migrant workers actually benefits the state and corporations: it helps to keep everyone else's wages down by constantly offering work to people who are forced to do it for less money.

So in a way, these protests are not just important because they're about migration and opening the borders, but they're also important insofar as they relate to the economic conditions of all workers in the US. If migrant workers had to be paid a living wage, then that 'wedge' enforcing substandard conditions on everyone else would disappear. The distinction between 'migrant' worker and 'non-migrant' worker would disappear. This is also why it's worth being suspicious of a 'guest worker' system (which is, nonetheless, what may end up happening): as guest workers, migrant workers will have less rights, will probably be paid less money, and will still be forced into a position as the 'wedge' that sustains anti-migrant sentiment and keeps wages low.

This is why I'm so glad that alas phrased it a a 'new poor people's movement'.... Makes me feel all fuzzy and warm-hearted and want to shout embarrassingly Marxy things like, 'Solidarity, Compas!'

Shiny: Well Over Thirty

07:56 / 13.04.06

Hmmmm, another poster here wanting to express glowing happy lefty feelings of solidarity with these protests. By far the nicest news I heard coming out of the US in some time and by extension one of the best bits of world news as well. Here’s hoping these protests can develop into a real sustained movement and really change something. What with this and the France situation it’s turning out to be a pretty interesting and potentially very good few days for workers globally.

09:14 / 13.04.06

10,000 people marched in Downtown Memphis on Monday.

They started at the National Civil Rights Museum. For those of you who don't know the NCRM used to be the Lorrraine Motel where Dr. King was shot speaking to garbage workers on strike. I get teared up thinking about it.

¡Uelga!

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

13:22 / 13.04.06

Interesting fact that came up over Passover dinner last night:

With the current state of outsourcing likely to continue migrant workers may not have jobs in 20 years as tens of thousands of call center employees will be willing to do just about anything to keep any food on the table.

thoughts? or should i start a new thread?

15:36 / 13.04.06

neocons and other greedy capitalists are stuck on this one. on the one hand, they have to maintain their redstate racist base, on the other hand, they need cheap labor and someone to breed poor 18yrolds for the military.

if the US had a minimum wage increase sometime in the past decade, and if the busboys cleaning up our trash earned the tips that we pay to the pretty waiters instead of an hourly wage that wouldnt fund a WASP's daily bagel fix, a lot of this "low wage worker" stuff wouldnt be as relevent.

i'd prefer that the US creates a viable economy for its average citizen before it actually institutionalizes a lower class of worker. because i dont trust the US leaders to not take advantage of that lower class of workers.

ideally, the fact that nonUScitizens were able to organize this quickly and this strongly will encourage actualUScitizens to start complaining en masse as well. workers of the US unite, indeed. maybe we can all climb on the backs of our new melting pot brothers and sisters, eh?

20:25 / 13.04.06

This is also why it's worth being suspicious of a 'guest worker' system (which is, nonetheless, what may end up happening): as guest workers, migrant workers will have less rights, will probably be paid less money, and will still be forced into a position as the 'wedge' that sustains anti-migrant sentiment and keeps wages low.

Thank you for this, M. Disco. I always knew there had to be something wrong with the guest worker program, but I couldn't quite figure out what the angle was. Now I see.

Elijah, "blue collar" or skilled and unskilled labor jobs cannot be outsourced because they're done on site in the US. This would include farming, contruction, cleaning, restaurant/service, and driving jobs. "White collar" jobs can be outsourced if they can be done remotely via phone or computer.

20:46 / 13.04.06

Elijah, "blue collar" or skilled and unskilled labor jobs cannot be outsourced because they're done on site in the US. This would include farming, contruction, cleaning, restaurant/service, and driving jobs. "White collar" jobs can be outsourced if they can be done remotely via phone or computer.

this is incomplete. a large number of blue collar jobs are outsourced, specifically factory work. but you're right about the other ones. but whats critical about those jobs is that they were traditionally jobs that not only provided work for the average person, they also essentially served to build american cities. steel and auto factory workers lost jobs to overseas operations.

04:25 / 17.04.06

Disco has it right: the "immigration" bill is not a route to citizenship for illegal workers. Its primary purpose is the same as anything the current crop of Republicans touch: to enrich corporations by providing a stable pool of workers with no rights. The US government doesn't have one jot of the social consciousness of European governments, and even though guest workers in Europe don't have it easy, here it would be a euphemism for slave labor.

The "citizenship" parts are so exclusively defined, they're not going to apply to the most exploited illegals for the most part. (Residency over five years: can get in line for a green card. residency between two to five years, can go back to the home country and apply for a green card from there. Totally absurd. The nature of being undocumented is that you try NOT to leave any tracks that you're living here. And who's got the money to go jaunting around the Americas so they can file the paperwork from the right place?)

What really touched off the mass protests was the attempt to criminalize just being an undocumented foreigner in the US. There was also language that would have made it a felony to give emergency medical care to illegal aliens, to teach their kids in school, and so on. Doctors were supposed to let them die in the fields, I suppose. It was truly outrageous. That was the bill that passed the lower House (House of Representatives). By the time it reached the Senate, the demonstrations had started, the whole stupid bill started looking like an election year disaster, and now it's hanging fire. Officially, the senators will continue dealing with it once they return from recess to their home states. I shall watch their future progress with considerable interest.

07:54 / 17.04.06

There was also language that would have made it a felony to give emergency medical care to illegal aliens
That's fucking disgusting.

What's interesting is Bush got 45% of the Latino vote in 2004, which I read was a 7% increase from 2000. Latinos also represent a large number in battleground states like New Mexico, Arizona, and Florida.
more here
Couple this with the fact that the administration has had horrid approval ratings this term and it seems like the republicans are just shooting themselves in the foot on this issue.

Disco is My Class War

16:32 / 17.04.06

The US government doesn't have one jot of the social consciousness of European governments

What, like the Netherlands? Germany?

Elijah, Freelance Rabbi

18:10 / 17.04.06

Elijah, "blue collar" or skilled and unskilled labor jobs cannot be outsourced because they're done on site in the US. This would include farming, contruction, cleaning, restaurant/service, and driving jobs. "White collar" jobs can be outsourced if they can be done remotely via phone or computer.

This is just what I meant ibis. Once all of the tech and call center jobs are outsourced there will be a huge pool of unskilled workers (or workers who are very skilled in fixing AOL but not much else) who will need work. At this point either A) US unemployment numbers will be insane, or B) the former phone jockeys will need to take jobs in construction, farming and other areas which, at this time, are done by undocumented workers.

In either case the economy will be thrashed.

20:02 / 17.04.06

There was also language that would have made it a felony to give emergency medical care to illegal aliens

The uk's attempts to introduce an ID card would make this implicit when it is required to obtain medical treatment, to make sure that poeple are 'entitled' to it.

Not so much a problem with USA as with capitalism

Sorry if not all of me is on topic

04:15 / 21.04.06

Mister Disco: Sure. Netherlands, Germany. (I mean modern, of course. The Dutch in Indonesia were not exactly role models.) And, yes, I am aware of the racist political movements in those countries. I'm not as familiar with Greece and Italy, but, hell, I suspect they're miles ahead of the US too. I'd say it was the Third World here, except that so much of the Third World has pulled ahead, I don't know what comparison to make anymore. Maybe you have to live here to really get the picture, because so many parts of it are missing overseas.

09:51 / 02.05.06

Yesterday about a million immigrant workers held a nationwide protest called A Day Without Immigrants. I think they were hoping for a higher turnout, ideally enough to financially shut down the country for a day, but given their illegal status a lot of potential participants were too afraid to skip work or school. Still, over a million protesters was definitely enough to be noticed, and certain neighborhoods & public transportation lines were described as empty and "ghost towns" for a day without their immigrant populations. (There was plenty of press coverage - the CNN link above is a general overview.)

Tryphena Absent

13:59 / 02.05.06

The BBC news site features a bunch of people being sick puppies about the protest Ibis is referring too if we had to do things properly than why can't you? Waaah waaah etc. etc.

Disco is My Class War

19:30 / 02.05.06

That comment thread just makes me want to be Godzilla and crush (most of) them with my left little toe.

alejandrodelloco

22:39 / 02.05.06

What was really interesting to me was the immigrants *against* a boycott in fear of pissing folks off. I remember hearing about a DJ in LA who was trying to get people to go to work but join the protests. It's not a "Hey I don't like illegals" but a "How is this constructive?" kind of thing.