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Everyday Rudeness

07:53 / 31.03.06

Whilst this is a general thread, I want to give you the details of the situation that's prompted me to write it.
Your cuddly god of the night and material things is a bike rider. Anyhow, yesterday I went to visit a friend who lives in a house divided into various flats. There are no railings outside his property, and bringing a bike into the communal hallway of his place would totally block the passage for everyone coming in or going out. So I start locking it to the railings of the house next door, when the door opened and a short, red-faced little man comes charging out, demanding to know why I'm there. The conversation goes something along the lines of:

Guy: "What are you doing here?"
Me, taken aback: "Excuse me?"
"You heard me, what are you doing here?"
"Visiting a friend."
"Get that fucking bike off my property."
Brief pause whilst I recover from the shock.
"It's only for a short while."
"Don't care, it's my fucking house."
"What's the problem? It's on the pavement, not your land, and there's nowhere else to lock it for a good distance around. It's not doing any damage, and I'll be done in half an hour."
The guy then starts screaming that it's his property and he'll destroy the bike if I leave it there. There's nothing I can do except walk the bike a long way up the road to find another suitable mooring post.

Sure, the railings were part of his property, but some people really do just seem to be intolerant arseholes, and more than a little petty when it comes to things they perceive as their property.
Looking back, the thing that angers me most was that I was too shocked to actually do anything other than take the bike and find somewhere else (which also had to be a house railing, given the total absence of any bike lock bars, and the overly fat nature of the lamposts).

Since I can't imagine I'm the only one who sometimes encounters these idiots, how do you deal with the everyday rudeness of some people? Ignore them? Meet aggression with aggression? Apologise profusely?

08:10 / 31.03.06

Usually apologise profusely and then get annoyed at myself later for not standing up for myself.

Bikes do tend to drive people to apoplexy. I had a guy berating me recently for standing on the pavement with my bike. A quiet and wide pavement - i wasn't blocking anything. "Bikes should be on the road!!" he roared. Well, yes, when I'm riding it, agreed, but I'm just standing here. "Bikes should be on the road!!!"

You can't win. And people are very, very odd about their property.

08:28 / 31.03.06

You can't win. And people are very, very odd about their property.

That's exactly it. I wasn't for a moment implying that his property was for public use, but I don't think it was unreasonable to just lock a bike there for a short time. It was on the pavement, after all.

I've noticed people do seem to get furious with bike riders at times. Numerous times I've been walking along a pavement with my bike and received nasty looks or muttered comments, generally, I have to honestly say, from young mothers who find the passage of junior's pram is marginally reduced due to my bike.

ONLY NICE THINGS

08:31 / 31.03.06

Well, yes. Your bike is a road vehicle. Their pram holds a baby. If your bike is on the pavement, and that menas that their pram has to go onto the road, then their baby is danger of being hit by a car.

It's not logical, necessarily - there may be space for both - but it's not entirely incomprehensible.

Jack The Bodiless

09:55 / 31.03.06

They're hardly likely to push their pram into the road, even if Tez' bike is taking up too much room for both of them. They're not tsking at him because their baby is in danger, they're tsking because he's taking up room they'd like to take up. It's two people competing for space on a pavement, that's all. Mother has an overinflated sense of entitlement because She Has A Bay-bee, You Heartless Bike-riding Monster, and gives Tez a withering look to put him in his place.

09:57 / 31.03.06

As a pram-pusher myself I can say that you do develop a heightened awareness of potential danger, and it may be as Haus suggests that this is more to do with a perception of danger rather than inconvenience.

I think also that certain things do raise hackles, often irrationally - a bike on the pavement regardless of danger or inconvenience will push certain people's buttons, just as some people will get irritated by my boys' bulky all-terrain 3-wheeler double buggy even if it's not taking up most of the pavement.

I gather that some people in customer-facing jobs get trained on how to deal with rudeness; anyone here have that training ? What did it involve ?

ONLY NICE THINGS

10:02 / 31.03.06

That's true - it's really about who has to stop and let the other past rather than who has to, as the Undertaker might say, spin the wheel. Like I said, not logical.

10:06 / 31.03.06

Mother has an overinflated sense of entitlement because She Has A Bay-bee

I doubt if that's the whole story. If I as a pedestrian with a pram with babies in it am in competition for space on a pavement with someone with a bike I feel that I *am* entitled to the pavement all things being equal. Is that overinflated?

10:10 / 31.03.06

I learnt this really amazing thing about rudeness and queueing once from a behavioural scientist. It's all to do with agendas. If you're queueing in a bank your agenda is to get to the front of the queue as soon as possible, but then once you're being served by the cashier your agenda changes. Then your agenda is to complete your transaction to your satisfaction, and time and queueing become of no relevance anymore. But all the people in the queue still want to get to the front quickly, so they get angry with the person at the cashier for what they perceive as taking too long, and angry with the cashier for being slow.

It's worst for the cashier because he or she never stops being aware of the queue even though each person he or she serves no longer cares about it themself.

The point is that no-one's agenda matches throughout the whole bank queueing cashier interaction.

It's no wonder bank queues always feel fraught and resentful.

10:27 / 31.03.06

I'm generally very polite and just ignore garden variety rudeness, and always automatically say sorry when bumped into as though it were my fault, try to be as quick as possible when being served and try not to get in people's way when shopping, queueing (sp?) etc. Just ingrained I suppose. And though rudeness and lack of consideration for other people's space annoys the shit out of me, I will just rant about it later rather than saying anything to the person.

However if someone starts yelling at me then I will give it straight back. I am the soul of politeness up to a point but once I get pushed too far then I switch to self-righteous fury.

11:23 / 31.03.06

However if someone starts yelling at me then I will give it straight back. I am the soul of politeness up to a point but once I get pushed too far then I switch to self-righteous fury.

I wish now I had done, but was honestly too shocked at the time to do anything, which is something I suspect happens to us much more than we'd care to admit.

And in my defence re: the bike/pavement issue, I should point out that I'm extremely considerate, and actually feel quite embarrassed, when having to wheel my bike along a pavement, and try to do it as little as possible.
What I resent isn't necessarily the implication of some pedestrians that they automatically have more right to the pavement than I, but that they have the right to be downright rude as a result.
The other problem there is, of course, tolerance whilst on the road. Some drivers are fantastic, but others really do seem to think that having an engine gives them superiority over anything on the road, be it bicycle or crossing pedestrian, that doesn't.

To return to the more general topic at hand, could part of the problem be a sense of personal space, and a perception that that space is being - or is likely to be - invaded by someone?

11:41 / 31.03.06

I've certainly found that to be the case.

Suprisingly though, I've found Cabbies are remarkably considerate when I'm on my bike.

Daemon est Deus Inversus

13:33 / 31.03.06

Flip it over.

Rude Woman: You are drunk, sir.
Dr. Johnson: You are ugly, madam. Tomorrow, I will be sober. You shall still be ugly.

Except if they're so rude they don't deserve a reply.

ONLY NICE THINGS

13:40 / 31.03.06

Winston Churchill, actually. Allegedly. To be honest, more likely:

She: Sir, you are drunk.
Churchill: GwwahhhhhhFUGGGOFFFF!

13:43 / 31.03.06

I can't remember the actual quote but I believe Somerset Maugham was sitting on the couch and someone told him he was drunk. He replied that he wasn't as drunk as the bloke lying on the floor behind the couch. His guest looked around and saw that the person lying there was Winston Churchill.

13:46 / 31.03.06

I wish now I had done, but was honestly too shocked at the time to do anything, which is something I suspect happens to us much more than we'd care to admit.

I should add that it takes me a fair bit to lash out. I am generally not very confrontational and will put up with a fair bit of crap in the interests of maintaining the peace. But if someone keeps pushing me, particularly if I feel it is unjustified then I will eventually go bezerk and throw it right back plus a bit more on the top.

14:09 / 31.03.06

I gather that some people in customer-facing jobs get trained on how to deal with rudeness

The ruder they get the nicer you should become. The nicer you are the ruder they get. They eventually get fucking infuriated and stomp off; you keep the moral high ground.

Either that or you firmly say: "you are a very rude person and I'm not going to deal with you any more," and walk off. Only seen that happen once, though it was very effective.

14:21 / 31.03.06

As someone who once worked as a bill collector, I have had more than my fair share of rudeness sent my way. The best to handle it was always to remain calm and collected. It's possible to take a hard stance (as you have to when trying to convince someone to pay their bills) without being as equally rude or condescending. That's only necessary if you expect extended contact with the person, though. There were times when I reached the point of return and would engage in equally rude behavior. Nothing, and I mean nothing, was ever solved that way. Sometimes you just need to blow off some of some steam.

14:59 / 31.03.06

cry.
cry as though you have been wounded in the brain, and act as fearful of their anger as you can.
not many people will keep shouting at a cashier or a clerk after they make them cry, and those who do would shout at you no matter what you say or do.

that, and screaming "take the money! just dont kill me!" are sure fire winners for making people back off a bit.

16:48 / 31.03.06

Murder them, I say. Murder them all!

Sorry, I can't help it.

I usually go for the extremely polite tatics, speaking slowly and adressing them as "sir" or "madam", with a welcoming smile (in the bike example, I'd say: "Sir, I aknowledge your right to set the rules in your property. However, do you not find that it would be best to explain the rules before resorting to cursing and shouting. If you ask me again to leave in a nice way, I'll be mor ethan happy to abbide). This can cause two reactions: a) they get disarmed, relax, and start being polite. It can lead to actuallty nice conversation, and, who know, even a ne friendship, or b) they go utterly insane, Hulk-style, and resort to physicial violence-not a very smart idea when dealing with me, modestly. Either way, I win.

And Lula, your example of bank qeues is sooooo true. Also, I find that, the more angry you get in the queue, the higher the chance the cashier will say: "Actually, sir, this invoice is to be paid in another bank...". Works everytime with me.

All Acting Regiment

17:53 / 31.03.06

I find there's two kinds of rudeness. The first, which I call Point-Based Dickhead-Being, is where you yourself have actually done something that might give them cause to be a dickhead. Therefore you're obliged to at least do your part to keep it civil and redress whatever imbalance you're both involved in.

Then you get Being A Dickhead. Which in a perfect world where people weren't so much bigger than you all the time would mean you had every right to ignore them, but, well, often you can't.

08:13 / 01.04.06

My job involves people phoning me up and being rude to me all the time, which I can understand if a mistake's been made, but I fail to see how shouting at a phone-monkey who had nothing to do with said mistake is constructive. It really bugs me as I just have to take the abuse and remain polite or I lose my job, so basically they're acting like a bully relying on the fact that I am powerless in order that they can act like a cock. This job is gradually destroying my goodwill towards humanity and I find myself thinking unpleasant elitist thoughts, which annoys me even more.
So in response to the question, I guess I deal with the rudeness of people really badly.
As for training given to me, the best they could come up with is the "stuck record" technique, where you repeat yourself over and over till the customer gets bored and goes away. %Genius, I could have never come up with that advice%.

Mysterious Transfer Student

16:27 / 01.04.06

As another member of the global sodality of faceless phone-monkeys, I find I have the reverse problem. Most of the people who call me are disarmingly, bordering on cringingly polite; it's me who gets rude, shouty and tactless, especially when faced with wave upon wave of moronically greedy people who six months ago couldn't wait to sign anything that was shoved in front of them so they could get their hands on a brand-new Renault Clio, only to discover that an 18.9% APR hire purchase agreement is something to object to before, and not after, putting pen to paper. The only thing I can say in my defence is that I'm a lot better than I was five or six years ago, when cutting off angry calls and throwing away letters of complaint was just something I did to pass the time. (Not in the same job I'm in now, I should add.)

If there's any chance that anyone reading this has ever called a company looking for help and heard me answer the phone, I'd just like to say that I'm really, really sorry.