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President Fire Thunder of the Oglala Sioux of Pine Ridge

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06:01 / 23.03.06

From here:

When Governor Mike Rounds signed HB 1215 into law it effectively banned all abortions in the state with the exception that it did allow saving the mother’s life. There were, however, no exceptions for victims of rape or incest. His actions, and the comments of State Senators like Bill Napoli of Rapid City, SD, set of a maelstrom of protests within the state.

Napoli suggested that if it was a case of “simple rape,” there should be no thoughts of ending a pregnancy. Letters by the hundreds appeared in local newspapers, mostly written by women, challenging Napoli’s description of rape as “simple.” He has yet to explain satisfactorily what he meant by “simple rape.”

The President of the Oglala Sioux Tribe on the Pine Ridge Reservation, Cecilia Fire Thunder, was incensed. A former nurse and healthcare giver she was very angry that a state body made up mostly of white males, would make such a stupid law against women.

“To me, it is now a question of sovereignty,” she said to me last week. “I will personally establish a Planned Parenthood clinic on my own land which is within the boundaries of the Pine Ridge Reservation where the State of South Dakota has absolutely no jurisdiction.”

I expect this will trigger attacks on indigenous tribal sovreignty by anti-choice elements. Bloggers are calling for donations towards this effort to be sent to the tribe, and also for general donations towards the tribe's needs. I think the latter is a particularly good idea in light of my concern that anti-choice activists will launch an expensive although hopefully doomed attack on tribal sovreignty.

08:36 / 23.03.06

I imagine they'll go after what little Federal money goes into the reservations first.

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16:46 / 23.03.06

Some have called this an ironic move, considering the history of Native women being forcibly sterilized by the US government as recently as the late 1970s. Discussion?

And yeah, assayudin, you're probably right. It sounds like there's going to be a mess, in any case.

18:40 / 23.03.06

Pine Ridge has a history with the Feds which makes it unlikely they'll cave to any pressure.

Tuna Ghost: Pratt knot hero

18:52 / 23.03.06

Napoli suggested that if it was a case of “simple rape,” there should be no thoughts of ending a pregnancy.

Do you think he knew how this comment would go down and went ahead with it anyway, or was he just clueless?

Thumbs up to Pine Ridge and President Fire Thunder. Judging by the article, I doubt caving is a question. I hope they're alright on the funds.

Tryphena Absent

20:40 / 23.03.06

Do you think he knew how this comment would go down and went ahead with it anyway, or was he just clueless?

I don't think it matters, anyone who believes in the sanctity of life over basic humanity and potential psychological trauma and is in a position of power is dangerous in spite of their motivations.

Fire Thunder is like a ray of light shining through storm clouds. I think I'm going to have to email her and let her know she's an international hero.

00:14 / 24.03.06

Pine Ridge has a history with the Feds which makes it unlikely they'll cave to any pressure.

I knew I recognized it from somewhere! Shuold've registered when I saw the tribe. Yeah I doubt they will cave. I also wonder if any other tribes will pick up the idea, what with TN and MS looking to pass similar legislation soon (and they have the votes to do it). I doubt it here in the South, but maybe out West.

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03:11 / 24.03.06

Some have called this an ironic move, considering the history of Native women being forcibly sterilized by the US government as recently as the late 1970s.

I thought I should go ahead and supply one or two references for this.

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03:55 / 24.03.06

And another thing:

And what about our Head Start programs that all got canceled because of lack of funding? What about the old people freezing to death because they can't get any propane? What about the hunger, the alcoholism, the disease? None of that is less important than this clinic. What is she doing about those issues? Has she done anything yet that might indicate that she can pull this idea off?

Regarding possible misuse of donated funds: I recommend that you read Testimony for the Innocent by Charmaine White Face, which I admit is difficult to find, but very much worth reading for many reasons if you can find it.

Regarding Cecilia Fire Thunder's credibility: Cecilia Fire Thunder, for all of her good intentions, recently survived impeachment which was attempted because she ignored the sovereignty of her own people.

From here.

14:09 / 24.03.06

As a note, "simple rape" is a legal term for the category of crimes where the attacker is known to the victim or the victim is incapable of defending against the assailant -- it'd include being assaulted while unconscious, I think, but not an assault in a parking lot by a stranger. I don't know whether statutory rape is a simple rape. So the guy was speaking precisely, not belittling rape as a crime.

The name (I think) comes from "simple assault," which is an assault without weapons.

22:50 / 25.03.06

Are you sure, grant? About his motivations, I mean. Have you read anything else he's said?

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/law/jan-june06/abortion_3-03.html

" FRED DE SAM LAZARO: Napoli says most abortions are performed for what he calls "convenience." He insists that exceptions can be made for rape or incest under the provision that protects the mother's life. I asked him for a scenario in which an exception may be invoked.

BILL NAPOLI: A real-life description to me would be a rape victim, brutally raped, savaged. The girl was a virgin. She was religious. She planned on saving her virginity until she was married. She was brutalized and raped, sodomized as bad as you can possibly make it, and is impregnated. I mean, that girl could be so messed up, physically and psychologically, that carrying that child could very well threaten her life."

and

"FRED DE SAM LAZARO: Much of what she fears as an assault on basic rights Senator Napoli sees as a return to traditional values.

BILL NAPOLI: When I was growing up here in the wild west, if a young man got a girl pregnant out of wedlock, they got married, and the whole darned neighborhood was involved in that wedding. I mean, you just didn't allow that sort of thing to happen, you know? I mean, they wanted that child to be brought up in a home with two parents, you know, that whole story. And so I happen to believe that can happen again. "

The above suggests to me that even if he is aware of a legal distinction between simple and aggravated rape (or whatever), he still wants to stress that merely being raped isn't reason enough. He apparently also thinks that couples who get pregnant (and I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt by assuming that he is referring to couples, although a rapist can also be a young man who "got a girl pregnant out of wedlock") should be forced to marry.

Anybody want to guess whether he thinks gay couples should be allowed to marry, or whether a husband can rape his wife? I mean, I have my guess.

03:48 / 26.03.06

Oh, I'm pretty sure the guy's motives are whacked as hell, I just assume that he's got some legal experience and is saying something that's not exactly what the reporter thought he was saying.

11:56 / 27.03.06

For those interested, Pine Ridge was the subject of a pretty amazing photo essay. Brett Lundstrom, killed in Fallujah, was honored as a Marine and as a Lakota warrior.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

14:15 / 27.03.06

Can you really be impregnated through being sodomised?

15:18 / 27.03.06

I've just been reading about Cecilia Fire Thunder and she sounds like an amazing woman. She's a former nurse and domestic violence program director.

Those pictures are really interesting Grant, thanks.

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17:14 / 27.03.06

Lady: No. If you can get pregnant, it's not sodomy.

15:17 / 05.04.06

Of course you can get pregnant through sodomy, it's just not as likely. Without getting too graphic, "liquids" can flow from one area to the other.