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Brick

 
  

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Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
16:39 / 03.02.06
Indy filme noir set in a California suberb.

Preview is Here.

It looks like it could be really good, or terrible, but I am looking forward to getting a bootleg copy, since in Albuquerque, New Mexico we don't get all those fancy indy flics.
 
 
matthew.
02:49 / 04.02.06
Fuck I want to see this flick. The above description doesn't quite do the story justice. It's a film noir, but all the archetypes have been transported to high school, and it's not tongue-in-cheek. It's not parody. It's apparently a loving tribute to film noir. (Unless what I just wrote is bullshit. Prove me wrong...) Here's a taste of the poster art:



This is just one of the numerous character one-sheets. Click here for the others.
 
 
Phex: Dorset Doom
03:27 / 04.02.06
Elijah, the link in your post leads to a picture of somebody, you might want to Edit Post to direct it to the right place.
 
 
matthew.
13:08 / 04.02.06
Not just somebody, but The Elijah Company himself...

Official Site that doesn't seem to work on my browser.

Brick's IMDB page

Trailer hosted by Apple
 
 
Phex: Dorset Doom
22:43 / 04.02.06
Thanks for posting the trailer, I'll definitly check that out when it plays over here. Noir set in a highschool seems a great idea, so much so that I can't believe that nobody has thought about it before (correct me if I'm wrong, and before you ask, no 'The Faculty' does not count. Neither does 'Heathers').
 
 
e-n
11:37 / 05.02.06
The trailer looks incredibly noir, it looks like they haven't diluted any of the characteristics of the genre.

I loved the "hard bteen detective-high schoolers" line of shaking things up followed by the knotting of the other kids straw.
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
13:47 / 06.02.06
heh, dont know what i did to that link, must have been posting here at the same time as the picture thread.

stupid cut and paste mishap.
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
16:51 / 24.05.06
Ok, so this movie DID make it to Albuquerque, for a week, but that was long enough for me to see it.

I gotta say, this is one of the best movies I have seen in years. I have always been a huge noir fan, and the whole thing just felt right.

It took about 10 minutes of the dialogue before I forgot the people on screen were supposed to be in high school. The way the story unfolded reminded me of films from The Killers to The Big Sleep and the timing was perfect.

I honestly can not think of any movie that might come out later this year I will enjoy more then I enjoyed this one.
 
 
Michelle Gale
17:47 / 24.05.06
It took about 10 minutes of the dialogue before I forgot the people on screen were supposed to be in high school. The way the story unfolded reminded me of films from The Killers to The Big Sleep and the timing was perfect.

The script and the execution of thing was well done, but I kind of struggled with the "point" of having the story set in a highschool, there's the novelty factor but other than that??

It also reminded me of a play that kid in Rushmore might do.
 
 
nimue
17:53 / 24.05.06
i really enjoyed brick a lot-- a lot more than i expected to. i, too, struggled with the "why" of the high school setting, but i wonder if these might be some possible explanations:

brick is an utterly pitch-perfect film noir. there is a great degree of futility, maybe, in trying to do such a thing today without steeping it in total irony. placing it in a high school setting effectively creates one of the only ways you can make nearly incomprehensible language and almost inane melodramatics believeable. so, in a sense, it could just be a way to, funny as it sounds, get people to take a real film noir seriously...

another possible explanation is that it's really playing on the melodramatics of being that age-- where everything seems so damn important, everything is a matter of life and death. so i guess it's a nostalgic film, then: nostalgic for the heyday of the misanthropic detective, and nostalgic for the heightened emotional state of being a teenager.
 
 
lonely as a cloud...
09:44 / 25.05.06
I went to see this at the weekend, knowing pretty much nothing about it - and I really liked it. The slang the kids used took a little getting used to, though.
 
The high-school setting was a little odd, though, alright. It made for some good comic moments - like when Brendan and the Pin are sat down discussing business, and the Pin's mother is wandering around the kitchen asking him if he'd prefer apple juice or soda...
 
Having said that, though, I do agree with nimue there - the fact that the characters are all teenagers does inject more believability into the melodramatics and whatnot. Didn't occur to me when I was watching, but - yeah. Anyway, any film where Sister Ray plays over the end credits is ok by me.
 
 
Blake Head
19:49 / 09.01.07
Just saw this tonight: it really is very good. It’s played dead straight, slick and stylish in all the right places, and hard when it needs to be. And funny. The scene where setting and genre clash most visibly clash in the principal’s office is hilarious, and works… just. That said, not knowing what to expect, I spent the first ten minutes wondering if I was going to walk out – it seemed at first to be being clever for its own sake. I agree with the thoughts above about the setting being a really functional way of conveying both the heightened melodrama of both that age and the genre, and using that to make them seem significant. The vocabulary and idioms struck me as a brave choice in that they are slightly impenetrable, and helps the viewer understand that this is a world removed from our own rather bland consensus reality view of high school as witnessed in most teen dramas. Made me think of (successful) modern theatre adaptations actually. Great physical acting from the lead as well. Highly recommended all round really.
 
 
TeN
20:10 / 09.01.07
my two cents:
the cinematography and editing was top notch. it was a gorgeous film. I was completely taken away with the look of it.
unfortunately though, I felt the dialogue ruined it. I didn't feel as if it was a homage, I felt as if it was a parody, even if that wasn't the intention. it didn't bother me so much that kids would never talk like that... what bothered me was that NO ONE would talke like that, not even in movies, not even in film noir. and I think I could have even gotten past that, if it didn't get in the way of the narrative. I missed several key plot points simply because I couldn't figure out what the hell everyone was saying.
gotta say though, the lamp in the back of the car was a brilliant touch haha
 
 
Blake Head
20:49 / 09.01.07
I see what you’re saying TeN, and there were places I was struggling, but it mainly made me want to see it again. I think if the dialogue was lifted straight from traditional film noir it would feel too static, and then it would be like a parody. As it was the dialogue felt natural, even when in places it was incomprehensible, precisely because it felt like the secret coded language not of teens just now, but an evolving dialect of teens as a concept (alongside that of the criminal underworld) where it’s always somewhat private and ridiculous and exclusive to some hypothetical viewer. Know what you mean though.
 
 
kowalski
22:38 / 09.01.07
TeN, I spent the whole film wishing I and everyone in my life did talk that way. Without the cant, I wouldn't have found it nearly as entertaining and intellectually interesting.

I'll second the modern theatre adaptation comment, except that for me watching Brick has the same sort of joy as reading Shakespeare, that joy of discovering a slightly offset world of magically twisted language. That experience doesn't come through quite as well for me when hearing Shakespeare, because of the extra step of having to decode the old English, but Brick's modern english is perfect for cant and lovely to listen to.
 
 
The Falcon
00:17 / 10.01.07
"D'you ever read Tolkien?"

"Huh.. yeah."

"I love the way he describes things."

Off memory, that, so probably a grievous messup, but I really loved the film; in particular the above exchange and the principal's office scene.
 
 
PatrickMM
01:33 / 10.01.07
I wasn't a big fan of the film. People about the idea of high school noir as a major novelty, but this is basically the same themes and plot of Veronica Mars season one compressed into a feature film. While this may be more stylized, I think VM is just as good at transferring the noir archetypes to high school, and giving you the same joy you'd get from a classic noir. Plus, since Brick already went a ways with the dialogue, why not do more visual stylization to really capture the feel of vintage noir, maybe even shoot in black and white.
 
 
Spaniel
14:31 / 10.01.07
The point, and I can't stress this enough, is that Brick isn't a proper genre hybrid, it's a noir movie crowbarred into high school setting, without much of the high school. There is nothing of the teen movie in there, nothing of any real substance anyway, instead what we get is a bunch of teenagers spouting stylised dialogue for no discerible reason, other than, you know, it's a bit novel.
Ultimately I think Brick was a victim of it's budget: they couldn't afford to do the school thing properly so they couldn't develop the hybrid angle . Sure, it wasn't awful, some of the dialogue was nice, some of the acting was good, but I went in expecting something on a par with Heathers - a real genre mash up - and got something more like Bugsy Malone. Frankly, I was bored.
 
 
Haus of Mystery
19:10 / 10.01.07
Hated hated hated it.

Two words people;

Bugsy Malone.

But without the redemptive power of a custard pie fight.
 
 
Haus of Mystery
19:11 / 10.01.07
Bastard Boboss - you nicked that off me and I didn't read your post properly.
 
 
symbiosis
19:49 / 10.01.07
The question is, can you suspend your disbelief? Some people aren't going to be able to, and that goes for just about every thing you could possibly write.

No high school students have a lingo this deep or poetic, nor are they capable of plot intrigues this complex.

But you can't deny that the language is beautiful in this movie, that the images themselves are beautiful. It reminded me a lot of 'Deadwood' actually, or that Leonardo Di Caprio remake of Romeo and Juliet. Whether or not you like it, this movie shows our civilization like it is, big parking lots, dead yards, concrete everywhere. And everyone knows that the only two places you can get decent criminal connections are high school and prison.

Why demand realistic characters from a noir anyway? Do we really think that kings like Macbeth or spoiled princes like Hamlet are going to be poet masters either? The story is there, it looks good, something is happening, it took a lot of effort to make, I'm going to give them a lot of points.

I second the comment above about it being written by the kid from Rushmore(hilarious) and the kudos for the lamp in the van(also hilarious)

If you're going to watch it, get the rewind and volume up/down button ready, that's the only other thing I'd say to someone who was considering watching it. You should see this movie, anything that sparks such a discussion like this one has something to it.
 
 
TeN
20:27 / 10.01.07
"The question is, can you suspend your disbelief? Some people aren't going to be able to, and that goes for just about every thing you could possibly write."
I stress this over and over again but no one seems to listen: since when did it become the audience's responsibility to suspend their disbelief? The way I always understood it, it has always been the author's responsibility to make the audience suspend their disbelief. If you don't do a good enough job, you fail as a writer.
I think Brick falls short mainly because it does just that - fails to suspend my disbelief. Comparing it to other things that failed to do so yet have been declared great (Shakespeare) isn't going to save it. Shakespeare had other things going for it that Brick didn't have... you can't simply say "well Shakespeare didn't have realistic dialogue, but everyone loves Macbeth, ergo, everyone should love Brick." it's an extremely flawed argument.

I agree with you about the visuals though - "big parking lots, dead yards, concrete everywhere."
to respond to PatrickMM's question "why not do more visual stylization to really capture the feel of vintage noir, maybe even shoot in black and white", I think they did do a lot with the visuals. I think that's where they suceeded in capturing the noir style and updating it for the modern world. had they done it in a more traditional noir style - black and white, etc. - I think it would have come off as even more of a parody.
 
 
Elijah, Freelance Rabbi
21:19 / 10.01.07
I got the DVD as a gift recently and watched it. I think it holds up really well to a second viewing, and going into it with a better knowledge of the dialect in use made it more enjoyable the second time.

I do agree that certain aspects of it seem to be problematic. As example is the girl in the drama department. It felt somehow wrong that she was always at the theater of the school when she was on screen. I also noticed that all the actual 'high school' moments happened off screen (The principal looking for the main character, Brain talking to various people in class). The only real teen moments that we see are the fight in the parking lot and the conversation in the principals office. These are the only moments the characters act even remotely like teenagers, the rest of the time they are forced into a super stylized adult world (so a noir film I suppose).

Overall, still like it a lot, second viewing did display a few faults, but still brilliant in my book. I have yet to watch it with any commentary, thats a lazy weekend project due soon though.
 
 
Spaniel
14:56 / 11.01.07
Bastard Boboss - you nicked that off me and I didn't read your post properly.

I did nick that off you, but it's sooooo true.
 
 
Blake Head
16:21 / 11.01.07
There is nothing of the teen movie in there, nothing of any real substance anyway, instead what we get is a bunch of teenagers spouting stylised dialogue for no discernible reason, other than, you know, it's a bit novel.

No high school students have a lingo this deep or poetic, nor are they capable of plot intrigues this complex.


I dunno, it might be a while for some of us, but I’m a bit tired of the assumption that teenagers are a shapeless mass lacking individuality and poetry and wit. Not all of them at any rate. I thought that it was incredibly refreshing that we weren’t presented with the usual stock characters from your typical teen movie, and who weren’t concerned with the things we’re told typical teenagers care about.

While it might have a perhaps not unproblematic element of wish-fulfilment, the main character’s often successful reliance on bluff and calculated violence felt perfectly suited to the noir genre, and felt more “real” than the traditional interaction of archetypes like jock and geek, because that’s all those titles are – archetypes. I don’t know what difference it would have made if they weren’t teenagers, but as said above, I don’t see why the fact that the characters are teenagers makes the dialogue more ridiculous, and I think it adds to both the slightly unreal nature of the film and the exaggerated melodrama of that age. The confidence and cool assessment of the main character actually made me think of the GM quote about art being made for consumption by the hypothetical hyper-intelligent 14 year-old. Which I think to some degree this is, with a twist of noir. Which I think is pretty cool personally.

Also, and this might or might not be a British thing, but the absurdity of teenagers running around selling drugs and constructing convoluted schemes doesn’t seem that far from my idea of reality. The stylisation obviously is to some degree, but my conception of the American West Coast is surreal enough that it doesn’t take more than a nudge for me to believe in most of the events of the film as plausible, and while the idea of drug-dealers targeting ever younger kids and there being a reciprocal increase in teenagers being involved in the drug trade (while retaining teenage characteristics) seems really strange to me, it also doesn’t sound like it doesn’t happen, and I think the film goes some ways as to addressing that. That might be different for other people with different viewpoints of course.
 
 
Spaniel
17:11 / 11.01.07
No high school students have a lingo this deep or poetic, nor are they capable of plot intrigues this complex.

Blake, I think it's a shame you've lumped my comment in with this complete and utter nonsense. For the record, I think there is a fantastic movie waiting to be made that melds high school drama with noir, I just think that Brick wasn't it, because Brick is far more concerned with being a noir than it is with being a high school movie, and tbh I'm not sure it was a particularly good example of noir. There was certainly very little that was original about the plot.

I suppose it depends what you're after.
 
 
TeN
17:28 / 11.01.07
"I dunno, it might be a while for some of us, but I’m a bit tired of the assumption that teenagers are a shapeless mass lacking individuality and poetry and wit."
but there's a difference between being witty or poetic and going around talking like you're Tracer Bullet (only more over the top).
 
 
Blake Head
17:57 / 11.01.07
Fair enough. I don't think I went into Brick expecting it to be an equally weighted hybrid of noir and high-school drama, and I'm not entirely sure that's what they were going for either. For me it struck more or less the right balance between stylisation and plausibility of setting. Genuinely I'm curious about what a full hybrid would look like, and how it would avoid the appearance of implausibility - or is what you're thinking of something that would embrace the incongruity of the two themes?

And comparatively, I would take its perhaps flawed attempt at wit and poetry over the complete absence of such in the admittedly easy target of most popular teen films.
 
 
Spaniel
18:08 / 11.01.07
...and I'm not entirely sure that's what they were going for either.

No, neither am I, but that's what I was expecting after reading its press coverage. As for what a genuine hybrid would look like, well, as I said earlier I think Heathers points the way, I also think Donnie Darko helped show what's possible - how far things can be pushed.
 
 
symbiosis
19:24 / 11.01.07


I'm just saying, if you watch the last scene of this movie where the hero lays out the antogists plan with all of the details, cutting a kilo of heroin with poison to misdirect everyone so that....and so that....and then she....and it results in his ex-somewhat-girlfriend getting killed, her exact intention all along.

I mean, art is allowed/supposed to be hyperbolic, but I really don't think it's 'utter nonsense' to say that this isn't high school behavior. Possibly not anyone's really. People don't hatch plans this complex. Post a link to some articles if stuff like this is out there I've been missing. (I'm but a humble midwesterner, it's very possible)

Even so, I am willing to suspend my disbelief because i want to see action, fantastic things, people pulled out of their element, magical characters with capes/canes, etc. I'm not sure about what was said above, where the suspension should be automatic. Could you ever enjoy a cartoon or buck rogers if you had to be immediately convinced without consideration to believe it's possible?
 
 
TeN
22:01 / 11.01.07
i didn't say 'automatic.' what i said was that it's the writer's responsibility, not the audience's. so "it's not the writer's fault you can't suspend your disbelief" or something like that is not a valid defense against poor/implausible writing.

and all this that's been brought up about the genre-hybrid thing... I don't even have a problem with it not being a very good hybrid. my only problem is with the dialogue. even the plot isn't too unbelievable, but the dialogue and the dialogue alone is enough to turn the whole thing into parody.
 
 
kowalski
23:06 / 11.01.07
I think that some people wilfully choose not to suspend their disbelief in order to have the pleasure of being unconvinced by the fiction in front of them, and so occupy a place outside those who were convinced and did happily "believe" throughout the course of the two hours they spent in darkness. Much like people who attend magic shows in order to be unconvinced by the illusions.

I think a film's supposed failure to suspend your disbelief is pretty piss-poor grounds for criticism, when it was after all your decision to watch that film, and when many other viewers seem to have happily allowed themselves to be enveloped in the metamorphic cant and the impossible circumstances.
 
 
TeN
00:08 / 12.01.07
but that's what makes criticism an issue of opinion
perhaps there are people who do go to films to be not convinced, but I certainly wouldn't like to meet any of them... they sound like a miserable bunch

I suppose that when I talk of suspending disbelief, I don't mean a steadfast commitment to reality. of course there is a place for fantasy. but a work has to stay true to ITSELF. it can't contradict itself.
perhaps Brick does stay true to itself, and so maybe suspension of disbelief isn't the best term.
but Brick is trying to live in a world that has already been created - the world of film noir. of course it has it's own spin on that world, but the world of Brick has its roots firmly in that world. so when the dialogue comes of as a parody of that world, rather than as something that works naturally within it, it's obvious and off-putting.
 
 
Spaniel
13:14 / 12.01.07
Symb, compare this

No high school students have a lingo this deep or poetic, nor are they capable of plot intrigues this complex.

With this

but I really don't think it's 'utter nonsense' to say that this isn't high school behavior

You are asserting different things. I took issue with the first batch of assertions. I have a little bit more sympathy for the second. Only a little bit, mind.
 
 
Ticker
14:28 / 15.01.07
we watched it the other night and I loved it. I had a hard time following all the dialogue so I suspect a second viewing is in order. I felt it had some of the elements of Rushmore mixed with Lynchian noir absurdity (the lamp in the Pin's van for example).

There were a few holes that bothered me (why did the guy attack Brandon if the Pin was hiring him?) yet overall I enjoyed it. It felt like more of an heir of Lynch's style than directly classic Noir... perhaps saying it was filtered through would be a better way of framing it.

Much of the pleasure in viewing it for me was the glimpses of noir sterotypes & patterns and the sheer fun of the dialogue.
 
  

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