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Brian Jonestown Massacre

13:32 / 15.12.05

Recently watched DiG!, I thought it was a pretty entertaining documentary. For those who've not heard about the film, it tracks, over a 7 year period, the "rise and fall" of the Dandy Warhols and The Brian Jonestown Massacre, two bands from the same music scene.

I'm a moderate Dandy Warhols fan, so I felt motivated to track down some BJM songs. There wasn't much out there in Soulseek land, so I (rather predictably it turns out) bought "Tepid Peppermint Wonderland: A Retrospective". Pretty much made for the *indie* masses who've just watched DiG! and want to listen to BJM.

Anybody else ventured down this garden path? Or perhaps any people on here who were BJM fans before DiG! was released?

in DiG! Courtney Taylor of the Dandy Warhols keeps on about how much of a genuis Anton Newcombe (lead BJM) is, but I dunno, after listening to "Tepid…" it doesn't come across as very ground breaking. At the moment the only standout songs for me are "Who?" and "Nevertheless".
Rather unimpressed at the moment I'm afraid.

Is it just me?

Do I need a extensive 60's musical appreciation to recognise Newcombe's genius? Should I need to?

Comments?

Suggestions?

Album recommendations? (perhaps "Tepid..." is a bad place to start?")

Evil?

15:48 / 15.12.05

There wasn't much out there in Soulseek land

Every Brian Jonestown Massacre record is actually available for free download on their website...

Is it just me?

I think so.

I really like 'Strung out in heaven'. It has some great songs on it. I heard some of their recent ep last night as well, which was pretty good - and miles away from the garage rock sound shown in that documentary.

09:40 / 16.12.05

Every Brian Jonestown Massacre record is actually available for free download on their website...

Oh that's very good. Thanks.

I think so.
I really like 'Strung out in heaven'. It has some great songs on it. I heard some of their recent ep last night as well, which was pretty good - and miles away from the garage rock sound shown in that documentary.

Will listen to "Strung Out..." before I can say any more on that. But listening to "Tepid..."(disc 2) this morning in the throws of a mild hangover, I did find it a bit catchy. Nevertheless IS a good tune.

It just doesn't come across as "genius". Well I don't suppose I would know a "genius" musician if they came up and bit me on the ass.

This term is bandied about way too much in the music industry, I think, but when it IS used I expect to hear something that makes me think, "Shit this stuff is awesome!". BJM just sounds pretty ordinary.
It's like when my friends rave about "White Rose Movement", I'm like "?".

Different strokes for different folks I suppose.

I'll keep trying to "get" it though.

lord nuneaton savage

10:08 / 16.12.05

There is nothing to get. Brian Jonestown Massacre are a bog average strummy indie band. No more exciting than the hordes of retro-wannabe, Lennon worshippers who flung themselves after Oasis's trajectory, only to end up in the dung heap at the back of Paul Weller's outhouse, at the beggining of the 90s.

They are "genius" (which is, let's face it, a pretty meaningless word anyway), in the same way that any cack handed tosspot who lumps a jangling guitar is considered genius; ie, they say it about themselves so much that people actually start believing them.

I mean, come on, anyone who that fuck widget from the Dandy cunting A-holes says is a "genius" (in that excruciatingly annoying drawl, which I'm sure he thinks makes him sound louche and bohemian, but which actually makes him sound like he's had a seizure) is a prime candidate for connonisation (as in "fired out of a fucking cannon into a tent full of mustard gas").

These people (and others like them, yes YOU NME) are the reason that the word "genius" has become so meaningless.
"He writes songs on an acoustic Guitar and has delusions of grandeur.", "Really? Genius!".
"He can turn water into wine and heal the sick.", "Really? Genius!"
"He was the first person on his block to wear an ironic trucker hat.", "Really?, what a cunting genius!"

I have nothing against Anton Newcom personally (although I know people who do) and I'm glad that he finally seems to be sorting his shit out - There is no doubt that he has had a hard time of it, through his own design or not - but his band are so assinine that if it were possible to bottle their essence you could use it to clean toilets.

They present themselves as Psychedelic saviours, they are in fact Northern Uproar with phaser pedals.

11:10 / 16.12.05

That's a bit harsh.

I mean, yeah, they're not 'genius' any more so than any other bunch of retro hipsters with a studied disinterest in anything that's happened since 'Aftermath', but they're alright.

They've had a handful of killer tunes over the years, their guitars usually sound lovely, they look damn cool on stage and - as demonstrated by some of the live footage in the movie - they can drum up a hell of a Velvets-style wall of chug when they put their minds to it.

Which I should imagine on their own terms = musical success.

Certainly preferable to the "bog-standard indie" you liken them to anyway, but then maybe that's just cos I'm a gullible '60s geek...

lord nuneaton savage

11:42 / 16.12.05

But Riz, I'M a gullible 60s geek. I am a freakin' 6Ts psych FANATIC and BJM do not have one iota of the inspiration, oddball charm or reckless creativity that I associate with that period. They are the living embodiment of the "psych as a guitar sound" approach; strummy strummy indie music which thinks is it more exciting than the average shite becaue it puts washes of guitar sound over everything. Inspirationless dreck. Boring.

They're a bit of a pet hate of mine, actually. Can you tell?

Haus of Mystery

12:24 / 16.12.05

Calm down Mother, and take your pills.

DIG! was pretty entertaining though wazznit? The bit where he turns up selling his own records in longjohns and roller-boots at a Dandy's concert was ace. Humourless cunts that they are.

lord nuneaton savage

12:30 / 16.12.05

Yeah, admittedly Dig is a really good film.

The Return Of Rothkoid

23:16 / 18.12.05

Methodrone is a brilliant album, and their last one, ...And This Is Our Music is good too.

Their self-sabotage is perhaps the most annoying part of them, not their music. Anton's actually a lovely man one-on-one, curiously, and very honest about what he's doing, which puts him one up on a lot of people in music.

01:03 / 29.12.05

The last time I saw the BJM, their opening band blew them out of the water. Admittedly, it was Anton's birthday (a bad thing), and their van,w ith all their equipment was stolen (very bad).

However, if you like the BJM, the Morning After Girls are everything the BJM were meant to be, only better looking, with great shoes.

21:37 / 01.01.06

A coworker saw Dig and asked for a Jonestown CD. I put together a mixtape of my favorite of their songs.

Anenome is my all time desert island number one. Even though it's not Anton singing. Maybe because it's not Anton. Maybe because the first time I heard the song I was driving alone and was more tired than I should have been and didn't become aware of the song until halfway through it.

Beyond that, the tracklist was:

Just For Today
Open Heart Surgery
Super-Sonic
Not if You Were the Last Dandy on Earth
Servo
Wisdom
Vacuum Boots
Who
B.S.A
Stars (Reported to be the first song Anton ever wrote, back when he was 16)
Swallowtail
This is Why You Love Me
Satellite
Whoever You Are
She Made Me
Mary, Please
No Come Down
If Love Is the Drug, Then I Want to OD

...so, yeah - if you want a startinng point for BJM songs, go steal these from wherever on the etherweb you do your thieving. I think some of them are still free over at the BJM website.

The Return Of Rothkoid

11:12 / 10.01.06

However, if you like the BJM, the Morning After Girls are everything the BJM were meant to be, only better looking, with great shoes.

I've been pimping them far and wide, as some of them are my friends. But holy shit yes, they're bloody great. Especially when that three guitar action gets happening.

21:34 / 10.01.06

Yeah - the first time I saw them, they were a congender for best live act I've seen. The next night when I went to the second gig, they were in the running for favoritest band of all time.

And, weirdly, when I hear certain songs now I wish they would cover them. Specifically, Tuesday Morning by the sans-Shane Pogues. Which every time I hear I imagine four part harmonies and a slow droned out guitar sound.

18:34 / 10.09.07

So I just saw the BJM again, years later.

It's weird - DIG! seems to be haunting them far more than it seems to have affected the Dandys. Well, maybe because the movie ended up being about Anton.

Anyway, the last couple of times I've seen them, they have attracted a peculiar breed of heckler who seem to be there just to incite Anton to break down. They are there to see the spectacle of Anton ranting and hopefully fighting. And it's incredibly lame, because the rest of us are there just to see a really nice, slow, psych-rock show.

In other news, Matt Hollywood (Formerly of the BJM, now with The Warlocks, played a large role in DIG!) performed with them for one song.

Anyway. Their shows are becoming stranger and stranger, as they have several reputations among disparate populations - most of the crowd seemed to be there because they're heard the band's name and didn't know what to expect. They left early when Anton didn't explode. Then there were the hecklers who, by screaming shrill obscenities over and over, eventually won out and got Anton to stop playing for a while. Then there are the people who are there to see the BJM play - judging from my experience, this population expect interruptions in the set and are resigned to wait patiently until the band get their shit together and start playing again.

But the tension at their concerts is getting more and more interesting - you've got these hyper-agressive guys yelling at Anton who (I am sterotyping here) look like they ought to be copping feels on drunk girls at a Dave Matthews concert. And then you've got Anton, fill of fire and anger, responding to them, and there's this immanent promise of violence throughout the whole performance.

But then hen they play their music is incredibly gentle, and the lyrics are all about Anton's enduring belief in real, true love.

So I'm starting to think that part of the joy in watching Jonestown perform is in seeing Anton manage to avoid descending to the level of the shrill meatheads, and watching him choose, over and over, to meet their agressions with his faith in love.

If that's true, then the frustration in seeing them is all about the times when Anton doesn't pull that trick off, and instead decides he's done playing for the night if the crowd isn't going to shut up.

08:05 / 11.09.07

I didn't really mind BJM but ever since I saw Dig!, I couldn't help but think of Spinal Tap!
At some point i was even wondering if they were a "real" band...
Granted they seemed nicer than those Dandy Warhols mopheads (ooh that cyberpunk haircut on Courtney by the end of the movie was really something)but like nuneaton, I'm a 60s psych fan and they mostly sound like a really bad impression of most of my record collection, most of all they seem trapped by rock'n'rawl clichés, you know, like they're "for real"-maybe that lack of distance is what some find attractive and exciting...

10:10 / 11.09.07

Having listened to quite a bit of their stuff since by previous post in this thread, I'll admit I actually have quite a liking for the BJM.... their output's pretty patchy and musically conservative admittedly, and you wonder if all the A&R dopes in the movie proclaiming Anton thingy a "genius" have ever actually, like, heard any other rock bands, but NONETHELESS, it would be churlish to deny the fact that they've done more than their fair share of absolutely ripping tracks - beautiful, shimmery jams with a GREAT multi-guitar sound and some pretty good, ditinctive song-writing.

I suppose it's sadly inevitable that post-Dig! they're not going to be allowed to have a career as anything other than a touring freakshow, but... such is life.

Strangely, despite the variety of ridiculous/appalling/moronic behaviour on display, the movie made me feel quite sympathetic toward the band... I guess on some level I feel like bands SHOULD be crazed, chaotic, decadent, schizophrenic entities, and the honesty and dedication with which they insist on pursuing some nebulous, adolescent ideal of rock n' roll perfection against all the odds stacked against them by the more sensible and realistic world is quite touching.

11:19 / 11.09.07

Point!

02:23 / 29.09.07

I loved this movie and agree with the "maybe that's how rock bands SHOULD be" comment. WHo was the BJM's Bez character? I foudn him to be hilariously fascinating, a dude living out all his 1960s fantasies and just having a great time.

His whole "It's groovy, man" shtick (and I mean "Schtick" in the best possible way) reminded me of the guys in a UK band called "The Sandals." Anybody remember them?

18:52 / 29.09.07

Joel Gion - works at Amoeba Records in San Francisco, and is apparently maybe touring with the BJM on and off again.