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I am a newbie.

 
 
MorbidMike
00:39 / 10.12.01
So, being new to the board I figured I'd start things off with a question- well actually two.

1. Have any of you read Carroll's "Psybermagick" and what did you think?

2. Having read a lot of the texts available online regarding CM and having read some of Carroll's works, should I read P. Hine's works as well or will it be an exercise in redundancy?

Thats is all, be kind!
Mike
 
 
Naked Flame
01:24 / 10.12.01
I haven't a clue about either of those two authors, but hi.

Tea?
 
 
Vadrice
03:23 / 10.12.01
I have a clue, but I'm illiterate, so I couldn't really tell you.

Three for tea, perhaps?
 
 
De Selby
04:27 / 10.12.01
read Phil Hine.

if for no other reason (although there are lots) than he is a funny bastard. Too much magicky literature is dry humourless writing which feels like something my English Lit. teacher used to give me to read.

he also knows his stuff, writes well, and has a far less formal approach than Carroll.

and apparently he replies to personal emails, although I personally never sent him any.
 
 
ghadis
07:21 / 10.12.01
Yea i'd say dip into Phil Hines books as well...For the same reasons as Alex said below...Phil H also has a great web-site with loads of great stuff to download including some of his e-books...worth checking out...

I liked "Psybermagick"...it's a fun throw away book along the lines as Crowleys 'Book of Lies'...keep it by the shitter i reckon...
 
 
Janusian
11:57 / 10.12.01
Well, the two authors do essentially say the same thing, but they come from two different angles and justify their views a bit differently.

Carroll's writings are directed towards an audience with knowledge and experience of western ceremonial magick. His justification of his views(especially in Liber Null and Psychonaut) presupposes familiarity with the established viewpoints in mainstream western occultism. Liber Kaos is just to odd to be true, as a social scientist, I find his aeonics a bit 19th century, his use of formulas arbitrary, but I like Liber KKK as a practical training manual. Phil Hine is writing to the children of the 80s self-help guides and Llewellyn magick-light products. He uses a language that is accessible to a larger audience, and more suited to humorous asides. Also, Hine do not remain that fixed to the thelemic views of original chaos magic, something I find really refreshing.
I personally like both authors, sometimes I feel like their books are exerting a bad-cop/good-cop influence on my work, which is quite effective.
 
 
Bear
12:04 / 10.12.01
Yeah what s/he said !

Yeah I recommend reading Phil Hines stuff its how I started and is easy to follow and quite funny in places.. and yeah he does respond to e-mails now and then which is pretty kewl....

oh yeah and Hi Mike
 
 
cusm
02:03 / 11.12.01
I liked Psybermagick, it was crunchy. Its very easy read, done as a series of short observations/rules/lessons etc. Very digestable and entertaining. I generally like Carroll for his ideas, though can pass on his religious ideals. I have to laugh when chaos authors preach about breaking from dogma one chapter, and feeding you their own in the next.

I read the precurser to Condensed Chaos, and really like Hine's style. He gives a good overview of it all without being too pushy on it. Really, there's only but so much to Chaos. The rest is all magic one might use if they like it. "Don't use magic you read in a book, make up your own!" "Here's some magic you can use..."

*shrug*

Everyone wants to be a cult leader.
 
 
Tamayyurt
14:43 / 11.12.01
Hell, I do!

I'm getting Prime Chaos and Condensed Chaos for Christmas. YAY!

What's Psybermagick about?
 
 
cusm
15:23 / 11.12.01
Basicly, a brief summary of everything Carroll has come up with and decided was worth remembering. Its kind of like a book of quotes. Things like "Divine short and cast long", with a paragraph of followup explaination. The format pokes some fun at Crowley's works, pretentious titles beginning with "Lieber". Its a fun mental ride to switch back and forth between reading that and the Tao
 
  
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