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I would like this removed, please.

  
 
Papess
15:13 / 12.06.05
This post is breeching etiquette, trust and ethics.

I have suspicions that this poster is NOT Ierne quite possibly. Whatever the case, using a screen shot of a conversation between Rex and myself which is now hidden, is a unethical and indeed suspicious.

If it is possible I want the IP checked out because I think I am being harrassed.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
15:42 / 12.06.05
Am I the only person here who thinks that this rubbish has been stinking Barbelith up for far too long now?
 
 
Papess
15:59 / 12.06.05
No. I agree it has too. I think it should stop. I would like that, which is why I am trying to get to the bottom of it. It would be nice to have some assistance instead of resistance.
 
 
Ganesh
16:04 / 12.06.05
Am I the only person here who thinks that this rubbish has been stinking Barbelith up for far too long now?

I'm bemused and slightly weirded out by it all. To me, it smells of old personal resentments with just a hint of paranoia. It's one of the things that makes me want to stay the fuck away from the Temple.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:14 / 12.06.05
Well, possibly yourself and Ierne should make a more serious attempt at arriving at a solution yourselves? Because there's history here, isn't there. One of you complains about how they're the victim of harassment, then, as day follows night, the other does the same. It's an entirely personal matter and I really don't believe that either of you should be trying to get Barbelith moderators who aren't directly involved in it to use their powers to effectively shut the other up.

By making the completely absurd request that you have here - absurd because you've totally failed to provide any supporting evidence for your claim - you're making it quite apparent that "getting to the bottom of it" is the last thing on your mind. Instead it suggests that what you want is a free 'win', or for somebody else to lift you out of the hole that you've managed to dig for yourself, and for the moderators to abuse their positions to grant you those things.

And yes, like Ganesh says it's quite possibly the main reason why the Temple has, over the years, become seen to be a completely inhospitable place to those who aren't up to speed on the bickering between your two groups or who simply aren't interested.

In short, you're damaging the board.
 
 
Papess
16:36 / 12.06.05
The screen-shot of the discussion was a discussion between myself and someone called hotblonde4now on livejournal. It was then handed over to Rex who created an lj called libelouspursuit in which to post in my lj because I banned him from commenting my lj.

I am under the impression however, that both of those lj's are Rex. I am now uncertain as to the actual identity of Babooshaka since it seems unlikely that Ierne would really care to be keeping tabs on myself or Rex enough to be taking time to read our lj's and adjacent lj's of Rex, much less, storing screenshots.

i think there may be some evidence here of impersonation.

It stinks to me too, and I want it to stop.
 
 
Papess
16:39 / 12.06.05
In short, you're damaging the board.

I didn't start this, and if it was you Spatula that this was happening to, you would want justice as well.

I am trying to end this but not by sweeping it under the rug. Maybe that is easier to do if one is not the target of this bullshit.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:43 / 12.06.05
You want advice and assistance? Okay, my attempt to be constructive:

Start considering the likely outcome of your own actions on the board *before* you act.

Make an attempt to heal this frustratingly stupid rift that you, or those you associate with, have created.

Alternatively, resolve to have nothing further to do with it, because with threads like this you're just serving to add fuel to the fire. What's to stop Ierne from reading this and deciding that it's evidence of you harassing hir? Nothing.

It's the Internet. It's remarkably easy to not let yourself become any further involved in personal disputes if you honestly don't want to. If it's spread out from the Internet and into the real world, then eayh, that's nasty. If that's the case, though - and it doesn't appear to be, it must be said - there are official bodies who you should go to to get it dealt with.

The amount of bickering on this board that could be prevented if certain people just learned to step the hell away or displayed the ability to make the first move towards a reconciliation...
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:44 / 12.06.05
The thing is, Strix, it isn't happening to me, and there's probably a very good reason for that. It isn't happening to me because I know to do the things that I've suggested you do.
 
 
Papess
16:44 / 12.06.05
If removal is not possible, then breaking the links to a discussion that was between myself and (possibly) two other people would be appropriate.

Instead of getting upset with me for trying to defend and protect myself from harrasment, why don't people get upset at the harrassers? Or is sticking up for oneself anti-barbelith?
 
 
Papess
16:47 / 12.06.05
The thing is, Strix, it isn't happening to me, and there's probably a very good reason for that. It isn't happening to me because I know to do the things that I've suggested you do.

You think I haven't tried to talk to Ierne? I have. However, I don't think Babooshka is Ierne.
 
 
Spatula Clarke
16:50 / 12.06.05
Instead of getting upset with me for trying to defend and protect myself from harrasment, why don't people get upset at the harrassers? Or is sticking up for oneself anti-barbelith?

Strix, take a good long look at your recent behaviour in Temple and tell me that you're not creating the perfect atmosphere for this, that you're not providing an invite for those who've been involved in petty personal disputes in the past to jump onboard and bring them back to life. Then ask me again why I'm annoyed with you.
 
 
Papess
16:54 / 12.06.05
Start considering the likely outcome of your own actions on the board *before* you act.

I do. Not perfectly, but who is.

Make an attempt to heal this frustratingly stupid rift that you, or those you associate with, have created.

I am and I have to no avail, thus far.

Alternatively, resolve to have nothing further to do with it, because with threads like this you're just serving to add fuel to the fire. What's to stop Ierne from reading this and deciding that it's evidence of you harassing hir? Nothing.

Asking for privacy regarding my personal life, as is respected for every other board member, is harrassment? No, it is not.

It's the Internet. It's remarkably easy to not let yourself become any further involved in personal disputes if you honestly don't want to. If it's spread out from the Internet and into the real world, then eayh, that's nasty. If that's the case, though - and it doesn't appear to be, it must be said - there are official bodies who you should go to to get it dealt with.

Well, please do tell me, because it has spilled over into my personal life.
 
 
Papess
16:55 / 12.06.05
Strix, take a good long look at your recent behaviour in Temple...

Take a look at the stuff I have had to deal with and then judge me.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
17:46 / 12.06.05
Way-ull, no, but. Here's the thing: you've decided that the bad things that are happening in your life are in some way connected to the Transducer. Fair enough. However, although you want to talk about it, when your aims or conclusions are questioned you wander off almost immediately into personal engagement. That means there is pretty much no way to make any progress either on dealing with the Transducer or, for that matter, dealing with the bad things that are happening in your life. And this is happening _again_.

Now, we can kill that link, but the information will still be out there on the Internet. The idea that somebody set up a Livejournal specifically to annotate your Livejournal seems ludicrous, until one is reminded of just how nasty, pusillanimous and emotionally disfunctional some of the arguments in the Temple - and elsewhere when they spilled over - were, with generally the same cast of characters. Take a look at Ierne's Blind Date - pretty much the same antagonisms expressed in pretty much the same language. Which is a problem - it feels unacceptable when it's happening to you, and not unacceptable when it's happening to someone you don't like. See the treatment meted out to various people by Modzero, which at the time I don't think you objected to overstrenuously. This dance has been going on for three or four years, and it is boring, boring, boring. I for one am profoundly disappointed to see it bobbing up again.

So. If that is not Ierne, but somebody using the suit - well, that's a problem, of course, especially if it is happening without the original Ierne's consent. However, the level of antagonism that has existed before between Ierne and yourself suggests that it is perfectly credible that it is her, or not. At this point, since the criticisms it makes are totally incomprehensible, and of no interest, to anyone not part of the original soap opera. This soap opera is itself of no interest to anyone etc., and will actively detract from any attempts you are making to sort out the Transducer.
 
 
Papess
18:01 / 12.06.05
See the treatment meted out to various people by Modzero, which at the time I don't think you objected to overstrenuously.

You know, I didn't see the posts that were made that were so offensive.

I did object to Ierne's posting of partial PM's, which is very similar to the objections I have about posting the link to a screenshot of an lj conversation.

And yes, it is ludicrous that someone set up a livejournal to annotate my own and slander me, to boot, but it is true.

I never had a problem with Ierne, but shortly after the Transducer working, which ze was a part of, ze became very hostile towards myself and a few others. I have no undrestanding as to why, I had even tried to work it out with Ierne which only amounted in more hostility from hir.

That ze became so hostile might indicate a reason why ze thought there was a malfunction with Transducer, possibly.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
18:33 / 12.06.05
Strix, I want you to think about the words that you wrote on page 5 of the Barbelith Personal Workings thread:

You want me to prove this with what? What has been edited out by you in this thread and other threads? PMs which I cannot reveal?

You were accusatory towards Seth, you basically accused him of covering something up by performing moderation duties and you never apologised for that. Now you are asking moderators to remove an entire post, written in opposition to you after you responded to earlier actions by a moderator with hysteria. That isn't fair and I very much doubt any of us want our own moderation actions to be irrationally criticised by you in a years time. So, as Spatula Clarke suggested, I should go back to that thread and read it very carefully and objectively and were I you I would consider the accusations that I had levelled at people.
 
 
Papess
19:07 / 12.06.05
Nina, I never accused Seth of covering anything up, just that the evidence is now gone due to moderation.

If removing the entire post I am refering to is not possible, and perhaps it shouldn't be, the link to the screen shot should definately be removed. It has nothing to do with anything.
 
 
Papess
19:10 / 12.06.05
Now you are asking moderators to remove an entire post, written in opposition to you after you responded to earlier actions by a moderator with hysteria.

That post was not responding to anything but the my bringing up that accusations were made, and not by Seth.
 
 
Lurid Archive
19:28 / 12.06.05
Just to note that the link to the screencap has been removed at the request of Babooshka.
 
 
Papess
21:06 / 12.06.05
Fair enough.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
23:42 / 12.06.05
That post was not responding to anything but the my bringing up that accusations were made, and not by Seth.

Then you need to be more careful about the way you word things when you're agitated (which admittedly is something that I also need to do).
 
 
All Acting Regiment
09:57 / 13.06.05
Do we need guidelines in the FAQ on the subject of magic in the context of personal vendettas? Because although this episode looks to have been sorted out fairly well, it could have got a lot nastier.
 
 
Mazarine
02:53 / 01.07.05
How would we enforce it?
 
 
Tryphena Absent
03:47 / 01.07.05
Do we need guidelines in the FAQ on the subject of magic in the context of personal vendettas? Because although this episode looks to have been sorted out fairly well, it could have got a lot nastier.

I think that generally bringing up personal vendettas of any kind is frowned upon here. Do we need guidelines on doing so in a specifically magical context? I'd say no because what applies to the board does so generally. We don't really have specific rules for specific areas of barbelith and I think it's best to keep all of the fora on an equal footing. Threats of any kind should be unwelcome, if people want to bring up their personal grievances then they should be aware that there will be little support for either side of an argument that no one else has had any involvement in.
 
 
Alpha Beth
06:06 / 03.07.05
I don't really find that too believable. Seems to go against several things that have occurred on this board over the years.

That's merely a personal observation, mind.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
10:46 / 03.07.05
Alpha Beth, I'm not sure what your personal observaton is actually an observation about. Do you mean that this:

Threats of any kind should be unwelcome, if people want to bring up their personal grievances then they should be aware that there will be little support for either side of an argument that no one else has had any involvement in.

Does not follow your experience of Barbelith? I can see that, to an extent - a good donnybrook does occasionally crop up, but there is usually some form of involvement - often simply based on having read the comic or book that formed the nucleus of the argument. The pursual of grievances from outside Barbelith onto Barbelith, although difficult to police, is, I think, more generally frowned on, whereas grievances developed entirely within Barbelith are generally easier to deal with, if at times a bit frustrating.

Example: Poster a and Poster b have a great big fight about Radioactive Man's powers on a thread in Barbelith. Eventually, poster a provides canonical evidence to support his contention. Two months later, Poster b comments about the quality of the latest album by Waterloo Facebar. Poster a hops in and goes "that's the kind of opinion I'd expect from somebody who gets Radioactive Man mixed up with the the Crimson Dynamo, bitch". That's probably a bit bewildering for other people on the thread, and if it leads to threadrot then it has to be dealt with, but it's the way geeks often argue, so to an extent I think it is tolerated.

Whereas if Poster a and Poster b have gone out with each other IRL, and one starts pursuing the other around the board leaving snarky comments about dick size,(especially if its offtopic, which admittedly on Barbelith it so rarely is), or Poster a starts threatening to come round Poster b's house and beat them up, that is a bit different, and is treated a bit differently.

Of course, that's a difficult line to draw, because we don't really know exactly what everyone on Barbelith gets up to. You can put in some obvious breaks - if somebody starts publishing real names or addresses, for example, but in other cases arguments can spring up as a mix of online, offline, email and other elements - this being yet further complicated when people have access, real or possible, to other ficsuits. It's a difficult balance, and mistakes are no doubt made...
 
  
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