Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.

Underground > Temple >

Magick, employment, relationships

10:59 / 25.05.05

For those of you that are practising magick and working, or those that have a relationship in with that aswell. How well do you integrate these things? Also, do you have advice, tips, stories, experiences or anything else that you want to share?

I get that a lot of it is personal, but I think that there's still a lot that could be put here. For those willing to post anything : it could either be something of value to others, or a question/questions that someone else might easily be able to help out with.

My own motives for making this : I'm interested in how you work, and how you have a relationship whilst fully practising magick, having never practised it fully before for a long period of time. How people consistently juggle all three is something that's been on my mind a bit lately aswell.

I'm tired, so I don't know if this reads as stupid or not, but I'm sure it can be of use so I'll click the post topic button.

11:14 / 25.05.05

I don't understand why you think practising magic should be any impediment to having a successful career or healthy relationship.

1. Don't ever talk about it in the workplace.
2. Go out with people who respect your beliefs.

Simple as that.

11:34 / 25.05.05

Ok, maybe it's some mental blocks that I have on the idea of it being that easy then, I don't know. I just get the idea that magick is one of those things that could be a little trickier, but maybe that's just coming from my own experiences with it. If it's just my own hang-ups then, let it sink, maybe I misfired by making this.

11:56 / 25.05.05

Not a bad idea for a thread, as I think people do seem to have difficulty performing the heavy magic/job/relationship balancing act - but it's all down to how good you are at walking between worlds. The magician is a juggler, and being able to keep several balls in the air at the same time is just part of the game.

I think a good magician should be able to create a life for themselves that incorporates their magical practice healthily, without there being any friction between that and other interests. This might not be accomplished overnight, but it's something to think about.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

12:13 / 25.05.05

I've been in a stable, happy relationship with an uncunt for over nine years now. I don't really discuss it much, not out of a desire for secrecy but in the same way that he doesn't talk to me about pure mathematics. He's accustomed to the fact that every so often I'm going to cordon off a bit of the house to do strange shit with rattles and candles. He's not a believer, but he respects me enough to let me get on with things without prying, hassling or generally making my life difficult.

In some ways I think I'd have a harder time building a functional relationship with a magician.

As for work: What GL said. Stick your pentagram down your shirt, don't tell them anything and if anyone asks, lie. It's none of their business.

Unconditional Love

12:22 / 25.05.05

in my experience if magick has become a life style at the expense of other elements in life, such as employment and relationships then these areas can suffer. as soon as that is starting to happen it may be time to reaccess where values are held.

although some people may opt for social exclusion and the life of a monk/hermit etc etc, i found with my period of this, there is something of value to be learned, if only how valuable relationships with others and employment are that these two factors can provide a more healthy well rounded character, at one point in my life i wouldnt of found that idea to be healthy at all, not that ive achieved it, but i am making steps of working towards it.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

12:24 / 25.05.05

Actually, there are other issues WRT work than acceptance of one's magical life. For instance: Time. I've found that my practice suffered a lot if I was forced by circumstances to work long hours. Same with music or family life or anything else one does outside of work, I guess.

On the flip-side, some jobs lend themselves to one's magical practice. I've done the most unimaginably dull assembly-line work at times and it's really benefitted me because I can use that time to work on visualisations or whatever. Work becomes something to keep the hands busy while the mind soars.

I can also recommend cleaning work to anyone who would practice magic. Nothing helps you keep your feet on the ground like cleaning.

rising and revolving

12:32 / 25.05.05

It is an interesting topic, though. My magical work definately reflects its way into my workplace and my workplace behaviour. I think that makes me more random than most of the people in my office, for sure. If I'm working hard each night over the course of a couple of months on a specific piece of personal alchemy, then it means I'm going to be changing. In lots of ways - many of which carry over to my day to day work stuff. Now, most of the time this leaves me more energised and filled with new ways of looking at things - but sometimes it just renders me useless and frail. Mind you, the whole mojo-working lets me put my work in better perspective than it otherwise would be, so it all pans out in the end.

As for relationships, my fiancee and I are both into weird stuff - different branches, which is nice. We do some work together, she introduces me to her peeps, and I do the same for her. For the most part, having a differing perspective is nice - it allows us both to sanity check and cross-reference when we feel the need.

13:43 / 25.05.05

For those of you that are practising magick and working, or those that have a relationship in with that aswell. How well do you integrate these things?

For me and it seems to appear others, everything about life usually has to balance with something/one else. How do you integrate working with studying at university plus have a relationship for example? It's just a question of balance.

I personally get up an hour earlier than I have to so I can doing any reading (magic or mundane) that I wish to do, workings, exercise (if made to feel guilty by weightwatchers adverts) and alsorts of everyday things.

The one really important thing I have learnt is to draw up a contract with various dieties, spirits or etc that I work with basically unless it's majorly important (you may have to define your version of important) I'm not to be pounced on whilst at work, on the bus or etc. This may sound cold and harsh to them but in return for this, there are benefits of undivided time at other points.

13:50 / 25.05.05

Xyu, what do you mean by “fully practising”? Do you mean something like the Sacred of Abramelin, where the magician goes into a full time retirement? I don’t think that’s a viable option for anything but the short term. Most of us in the West are going to have to balance lots of priorities alongside our spiritual interests. I don’t see why they should conflict, and I think getting a job, earning money or having a fulfilling relationship can both be magical acts in their own right.

A model you might like - the tantric yantra the Shri Vidya is surrounded by four oceans – each representing a different aspect of life – artha (wealth), kama (sensual pleasure), dharma (social duty/ritual observances) and moshka (liberation). Sounds like a healthy balance to me.

14:09 / 25.05.05

On the flip-side, some jobs lend themselves to one's magical practice. I've done the most unimaginably dull assembly-line work at times and it's really benefitted me because I can use that time to work on visualisations or whatever.

Yeah I've noticed that, when a job is often dull and repetetive, especially when in your own little area or room, it can be great doing visualization. I found it sometimes worked better than usual, with the mind being in such an active state.

The one really important thing I have learnt is to draw up a contract with various dieties, spirits or etc that I work with basically unless it's majorly important (you may have to define your version of important) I'm not to be pounced on whilst at work, on the bus or etc

That's amazing, something that might seem obvious to some but I never thought of that on the few occasions that I've been close to working and practising regularly.

14:12 / 25.05.05

Xyu, what do you mean by “fully practising”?

Sorry, wierd wording due to tiredness earlier. I meant as in regular practise as opposed to dabbling every now and then.

Thanks for the suggestion aswell, I'll look that up shortly.

14:19 / 25.05.05

I've often managed to fit a regular practice around a day job, no problem. Just getting up earlier. Less inclined to do it since I moved in with my girlfriend though as it's more fun to gurgle blearly eyed nothings at each other. I'm managing irregualr morning or evening practice with martial arts - half hour in the morning sets me up for the day!

nyarlathotep's shoe horn

15:51 / 25.05.05

I've found that at various places of employment (no dream jobs here), magic can still be practiced.

most disbelievers in magic understand/have experienced some aspect of what we refer to as "magic" (or what I do, at any rate). They refer to it by different things.

I started putting sygils on my reports, on envelopes, on white boards. No one asked about them, occasionally they'd be erased, and new ones would crop up.

I also managed to get a cantankerous printer to work by wiggling my fingers at it (after all else had failed)...

play with the spaces in between.

as far as personal relationships - each and every one of us is a freak. it's all a matter of how compatible our freakishness is with others'.

ta
pablo

20:24 / 25.05.05

Thanks for the replies, and apologies for any bizarreness that this thread has. I think that the reason I made it now was partly because I had one or two misconceptions that needed clearing up.

Also, thanks Lucky Liquid for leading me to Shri Vidya. The triangle symbol that represents that always baffled me, and I'm chuffed that I now know not only what it represents, but more about how it's actually put together aswell. I was sat baffled for a while looking at it, and had to do a little more searching until I found that it's showing 4 upright for male and 5 downwards for female, it's a really neat symbol.

I think I'm a little more prepared to accept the idea that I could start getting back into this now more than I thought so at first anyway, so thanks again.

Tryphena Absent

23:02 / 25.05.05

Stick your pentagram down your shirt, don't tell them anything and if anyone asks, lie.

"That's a very pretty necklace. Are you Jewish?"
"No, wrong number of points, I just saw it in a shop and though it was nice."

Oh, my life, with such inanities in it.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

23:30 / 25.05.05

My favourite response (Not that I've worn a pentagram for a while, mark you)

Me + der-face: Whu?

Them: Well, uh, the pentecleee or a pentegrim or whatever. That means you're Jewish, right?

Me + der-face: Whu? 'Sjust a star, innit?

Them: Uhh. Look, you're not a Satanist are you?

Me + der-face: *All cross* No-o-o.

Them: Oh. okay. Hey, can you get me some dope? It's not ofr me, it's for my nephew who's got an exam coming up, blah blah blah.

03:30 / 26.05.05

I've found that it's a good idea to keep the hat on the magick practice while relating to the general public. People can get notoriously crazy over that........ Besides, large amounts of scoffing have a certain banishing effect.....

I guess I have it lucky, I'm in a relationship with a fellow magick worker. My view on it is that you at least have to be with someone who can except what you are doing. My previous partner was a Christian, and we had a wonderful relationship. She wasn't fundamentalist however. She would let me to babble on at length about magickal topics, consciousness, and society. She seldom talked to me however, because to her, it was simple. Pray to Jesus. I was happy about what she had found, and she was happy about what I had found. To me, that's the secret. If both of you want each other to be happy, it'll work out. In answer to the unspoken question, it was death that split us up, as she died of cancer.

Now if you are in a relationship with another magick worker, that can open up a whole nuther can of worms...

cue to The Lucy Show: Ricky walks in

"LUUUUCCCCYYYY!!!!!! What?! You did not banish?! What were you thinking?! There are THINGS in here!!!!!!! There is a spirit in de closet!!!!!"

08:21 / 26.05.05

Nina, when the Jewish question comes up just say 'Yep I'm so Jewish even my stars been circumsised!'

08:24 / 26.05.05

I don't mention Magick at work, though people know I can read tarot as we had a hidden skills survey and that was the skill I revealed. I'm also in a relationship with a fellow practitioner so no problems either way really.

Unconditional Love

11:05 / 26.05.05

when i first went to kung fu at my local methodist church, i started conversations with the instructor about the golden dawn, aleister crowley, gnosticism, satanism, vodou, neo paganism, ive worn bone malas, egyptian scarabs, kali pendants and all sorts ive also encouraged the instructor to get involved with hinduism, he already was so he didnt need much encouragement.

well all the senoir kung fu students are christians, some are real christians some arent, ive been roughed up, humiliated, had my character attacked, it is probably all best hidden, but, one important point, its allowed the instructors and others to see who they are, and also to some degree allowed self reflection on there own behalf, and its also taught me a hell of alot about my own conception of christians.

i could probably of avoided this by keeping a low profile, but i like causing trouble and then learning from it. for the last 3 weeks or so ive had the most fearsome screaming noise in my head about it all, but yesterday that kind of died down a little after kung fu, something changed, i cant put my finger on it yet.

i guess my point is by being honest about who i am, what my intrests are, although ive faced alot of conflict, ive learnt so much about myself, and also about what was such an evil word to me, christianity and christains.

as for work, ive been lucky, my boss is an old punk, who has intrests in shamanism, is generally well read, has looked at tantra etc etc.

i think learning a martial art in a potentially hostile environment, is great in some ways and very challenging, but it can become very exhausting.

12:30 / 26.05.05

I've decided that I'm not going to be anyone different at work to how I am the rest of my life.

It's healthy to be surrounded by a diversity of people. I'm not going to deprive myself of real interaction with people who dont believe the same as me just because it makes for an easier life. And if I can help explode stereotypes and misinformed beliefs, so much the better. I also have a healthy respect for the people I work with and wouldn't want to do them the injustice of appearing to be something that I'm not.

When I start new relationships with people either inside or outside of work I usually just introduce more of myself as time goes by, pacing them at their level. Sometimes I get the balance wrong, sometimes right. Sometimes you can't do that, sometimes you can. But I'm not ashamed of myself or who I am.

People are entitled to their opinions about me, but crucially by just being myself I naturally attract the type of people I would otherwise want to attract and repel the people I would otherwise want to repel.

But misrepresenting myself? I can see why people might want to do it, but I find it a bit icky. You take away the possibility that people might grow to understand and like you for who you are. You don't give them or you a chance. Plus you condescend to "know" in advance that they won't get you. And you're probably right: they might not "get" you. But if you don't give them a chance then they definitely won't.