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Recommend me some poets

 
  

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matsya
22:52 / 21.03.05
Okay, those of you who are po-partial, recommend me a favourite, and let's try to keep away from the canon if we can. I'm looking for new voices I ain't heard much of before. We all know that Eliot, Whitman, Heaney, Ondaatje, Plath &c did noteworthy work. But who's your shining light unrecognised genius more-people-should-know poet hero?

I'll start the ball rolling with:

joanne burns - australian poet, nice dense stuff, darker now than her earlier work but still firing.

Thomas Swiss - did this excellent animated poem called genius, which is on his page of webwork, along with some other gear I haven't checked out yet.

Sean M. Whelan is a bittersweet semi magic-realist Australian poet/photographer with his own blog.

Okay, now you try.

m.
 
 
Whisky Priestess
20:36 / 22.03.05
Being Antipodean, I don't 'spect I have to tell you much about David Malouf.
 
 
All Acting Regiment
11:36 / 01.12.06
Bump.

Gerard Manley Hopkins
Ezra Pound
T.S. Eliot
William Shakespeare


...who are all canon, but if you're like me, you think you know all about them but you don't, and when you read them properly it's a good thing...
 
 
grant
13:27 / 01.12.06
Li Qingzhao, a woman poet of the Song Dynasty.

The nice thing about historical Chinese poets is that you can find different translations of their work, which make them feel like whole new objects.

Here's one collection of her ci, or lyrics. (There's an OK explanation of how these work over here, with examples.)

And here's another set of translations, and here's another, and here's one more.

Compare and contrast:

Last night a sprinkling of rain,
a violent wind.

After a deep sleep, still not recovered
from the lingering effect of wine,

I inquired of the one rolling up the screen;

But the answer came: "The cherry-apple blossoms
are still the same."

"Oh, don't you know, don't you know?

The red must be getting thin,
while the green is becoming plump."


with


Last night the rain was violent with the strong wind.
After sound sleep the wine still remains in mind.
I asked the maid of the crab-apple trees.

"They are still the same," she said.

"But don't you know," I told her,
"There should be more green than red."
 
 
grant
14:00 / 01.12.06
and here:

one more.


 
 
ginger
14:33 / 01.12.06
still quite canonical, but william carlos williams' 'paterson' is long-poem sex on a stick, and has several moments that're so pretty, it makes bits fall off me. also has some really cool formal stuff going on, and really dubious bits where he quotes private and intensely personal letters at great length. also has a bit where he basically turns round and tells t.s.eliot to stop moaning about the price of pies because april's actually quite a nice month, all things considered.

read it together with a allen ginsberg's 'howl' and 'kaddish' and some walt whitman for an american long poetry sexgasm.
 
 
Whisky Priestess
15:06 / 01.12.06
Simon Armitage is quite the thing:


About His Person

Five pounds fifty in change, exactly,
a library card on its date of expiry.

A postcard stamped,
unwritten, but franked,

a pocket size diary slashed with a pencil
from March twenty-fourth to the first of April.

A brace of keys for a mortise lock,
an analogue watch, self winding, stopped.

A final demand
in his own hand,

a rolled up note of explanation
planted there like a spray carnation

but beheaded, in his fist.
A shopping list.

A givaway photgraph stashed in his wallet,
a kepsake banked in the heart of a locket.

no gold or silver,
but crowning one finger

a ring of white unweathered skin.
That was everything.

Simon Armitage
 
 
iconoplast
18:02 / 01.12.06
The Song of Too Much

A polo zealot, Akbar, "the greatest
and wisest Mogul emperor of India,"
insisted that all candidates for public office
pass a strenuous polo test by playing
against the emperor himself, at night - a darkly
moonless night - in chase of a wooden ball
especially set on fire. Those who qualif - oh,

excuse me: email. Lowell again. His
marriage. As if I headed Office Central Command
for routing the cloverleaf intricacy
of Lowell's and Angie's emotional traffic. He
hit her. He didn't. She sucked off Freddie's brother.
She didn't. Also the night where every dish in their kitchen
got broken. Lowell's and Angie's emotional shit

is how it finally feels to me, and joins the list
of fecal exotica: otter dung is spraints;
cow dung is bodewash; deer turds, fewmets.
If we added every offal, every spoor, and then included gleet
(hawk stomach phlegm), we'd beat - at least
in quantity - the fabled ten (or fifty or a hundred:
it varies) Eskimaux words for "snow"; for "shit"

it's anaq. This is all too much. The formal
prodigality of heaven is too much: or of the heavens,
to be accurate; there are seven
in Jewish mystic tradition, layered as if angelic realms
were strata demarcating a canyon wall (a not atypical
cosmology in world religious beliefs), and in the second
of these heavens "stand one hundred thousand myriad of chariots

of fire" (the wheels of which have eyes, and these
"are like the flames of burning coals").
Nor is the human spirit simpler. For Confucians,
there are two souls, shen and kuei - that is, two kinds
of soul: in reality, the body holds at least five shen
(and maybe up to a hundred) and the kuei consists
of seven sections. Nor is the body

simple: not the weaving fan of fringe around the mouth
of the fallopian tube, and not the twenty-foot-long duct
that's coiled in the cojones, and not a single one
of the hundred thousand beats of the heart in a day,
and not the scribbley walnut gnarls of the brain - there's nothing
uncomplicated about, or under, flesh. The bruise
displayed on Angie's left cheek has its origin explained now

by at least as many theories as the universe's. Maybe
it was Lowell fueled by cheap drink and a costly rage.
But then again, a woman in a neighboring town presented herself
repeatedly to the police and doctors, over a span of two years,
with the knife cuts that a "stalker" inflicted who
turned out to be - at last, as she admitted - herself.
We can't be sure. It's all too much. 3,200

feet of helium are required to lift a person;
there are mornings when I wake and there's not
helium enough for the weight of my eyelids.
"I don't know," said Lowell, sitting on a bench with me,
as if this aptly summarized his marriage-angst:
"I don't know." What he means is that the element
most commonly discovered in an opened human life

is overloadium. And we bear the facts
that are soiled by tears, as we carry the facts
that are spangled in celebration; we accept the wobbly,
in-and-outty "facts" of quantum physics, as we hold on
to the great Truths carved of marble, and the counter-Truths
of counter-marble . . . no wonder we falter,
and deal in hurt. And yet I think existence

wants an ever-thickened density of knowledge
and connection, so that one day Information
will itself have reached the threshold to become a mind
- a mind of which we're neurons, know it and like it
or not. "I just don't get it," Angie said
when a third beer loosened her studied reserve,
"why can't it 'work out'?" What she means is

there are moments when we envy "the blesséd virgin
Amelberga, whose body was said to have been guided
upriver to Ghent by a school of sturgeon" - she
was floated, trusting, cared for, through a sure,
directed course. I have my version
of this fancy. It's a poem of, oh, say sonnet-length;
it's supple, undisrupted. It feels like this:

I close the door. (Behind it: gabble
and disjunction.) And I walk into the clear,
black night. I'm in a great arena. Nothing
can be seen - there may be nothing to be seen - except
of course for the ball on fire. That's all I need.
That's all: the darkness, and one burning sphere.
And I follow its light down the field.


Albert Goldbarth
 
 
Dusto
20:10 / 01.12.06
David Berman is pretty good.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
20:40 / 01.12.06
Anne Sexton rocks my world.

As does Czesław Miłosz, Bertolt Brecht (yes, he also wrote poems) and I recently picked up the complete works of Frank O'Hara based on the three or so poems of his I've seen anthologized. Brilliant. Adrienne Rich is full of unsettling depth.
 
 
Charlus
10:46 / 02.12.06
I have enjoyed poetry from the Bronte sisters, and the Russian poet Anna Akhmatova. However, I would also like to point out that to read poetry one has to be trained. Poetry is highly structured, probably the most highly structured literature, and to read and understand the poems outcome, or meaning for want of a better word is to understand the inner workings of the poem. These include the poems formal and stylistic qualities. To pick up a book of poetry for the first time and feel 'inspired' is, unfortunately, mere illusion. Having said this,our canon of work is slowly opening up to include other forms, writers and the like, but only as our awareness increases. So for the meantime we should continue to read and acknowledge poets such as Robert Browning, Elizabeth Barrett-Browning, Shelley, T.S Eliot, Lord Afred Tennyson and others, because it is from them that other poets have formed there work, by understanding how they have expoited these qualities, and the benefits it has given there own work.

I realise that this may be 'off topic', but I thought I would throw 'a spanner in the works', so to speak. I am also interested to know why you want to stray from the canon though.
 
 
All Acting Regiment
13:42 / 02.12.06
Some interesting points.

However, I would also like to point out that to read poetry one has to be trained. Poetry is highly structured, probably the most highly structured literature, and to read and understand the poems outcome, or meaning for want of a better word is to understand the inner workings of the poem. These include the poems formal and stylistic qualities. To pick up a book of poetry for the first time and feel 'inspired' is, unfortunately, mere illusion.

Trained? In what way? Is it enough ot be able to read, or is one's reaction to poetry less valuable if one hasn't learned about meter and stress?

I agree with your choice of the word "illusion", I suppose: the effect of a good poem is the effect of a calculated machine made out of words acting on our neurons. Which is why "honesty" and "passion" are nothing without form.

Having said this,our canon of work is slowly opening up to include other forms, writers and the like, but only as our awareness increases. So for the meantime we should continue to read and acknowledge poets such as Robert Browning, Elizabeth Barrett-Browning, Shelley, T.S Eliot, Lord Afred Tennyson and others, because it is from them that other poets have formed there work, by understanding how they have expoited these qualities, and the benefits it has given there own work.

I agree with you up to a point, Seamus. I have noticed, not here but elsewhere, a lazy, vaguely left-wing-seeming but actually anti-intellectual stance that thinks anything "canon" must be bad/boring because it's by "dead white men", with the assumption that all these writers were basically fascists.

It's a shame that some people think like that, because not only are the great mass of poets basically liberal, if not radical libertines, the canon, as a body of work, is largely A Good Thing in that it contains good poetry.

Of course, there is a very real issue in that it reflects the history of what was considered "worthy" in the past, and so a lot of women's poetry, and the poetry from countries like Jamaica or India, even in English, is yet to find it's way in there.

Then there are other languages, things like the Chinese poetry mentioned upthread, which is still something even I as a lit student don't know enough about.

At which I would add Derek Walcott's Omeros to the thread, and also suggest that people check out Ezra Pound's various Imagist anthologies if they're interested in the ideas in Chinese or Japanese poetry.
 
 
Rigettle
14:18 / 02.12.06
I'm currently reading Sherb: new urban writing from Coventry

a collection by local poets with the loose theme of our poor little river Sherbourne, in its culvert. You can get it from Heaven Tree Press but it's not in their online catalogue yet - it's official launch is at the Tin Angel, Spon St Tues 5th Dec. Email them (or contact me) if you're interested in a copy & can't get to the Midlands of the UK.

From A Different Map by one of the editors, Jon Morley:

and under it all, old streams
black and racing to escape the place
and a many-eyed beast lurks toadlike
in some deep dark cavern gulping and sucking
the whole toadlike herd of us down, like spaghetti


Yum. Then there's Alice Oswald:

I remember walking once into increasing
woods, my hearing like a widening wound.
first your voice and then the rustling ceasing
the last glow of rain dead in the ground.


from WOODS etc in her collection of that name.

I also recommend her wonderful book Dart, a journey down the river of that name. Verses in many voices. Jon Morley (above) has been corresponding with her & he read us a wonderful poem about a broken goddess figurine in a museum display which she had sent him. Very moving.

Also Ginsberg:

You were never no locomotive, Sunflower, you were a sunflower!

& Big Bill Blake, who I love:

Then loud the Furnaces of Los were heard! & seen as Seven Heavens
Stretching from south to north over the mountains of Albion


From Milton
 
 
iconoplast
16:07 / 02.12.06
I agree with you up to a point, Seamus. I have noticed, not here but elsewhere, a lazy, vaguely left-wing-seeming but actually anti-intellectual stance that thinks anything "canon" must be bad/boring because it's by "dead white men", with the assumption that all these writers were basically fascists.

I think it may just be the same indie-rock sensibility that exists in every other subforum of Barbelith. Cool = Quality * 1 / Popularity. No accusations of fascism. No dead white men loathing. Just the usual "What do you like that I've never heard of?"

The original poster said I'm looking for new voices I ain't heard much of before. We all know that Eliot, Whitman, Heaney, Ondaatje, Plath &c did noteworthy work. But who's your shining light unrecognised genius more-people-should-know poet hero?

I don't know, I think accusations of canon-bashing are sort of out of line - there is nothing in a call for new voices that disparages the canon in any way.

Also...
However, I would also like to point out that to read poetry one has to be trained. Poetry is highly structured, probably the most highly structured literature, and to read and understand the poems outcome, or meaning for want of a better word is to understand the inner workings of the poem.

I am just going to call Shennanigans on this, and let that be that.

So, anyway. Back on topic, and dealing with living and less well known (i.e., indie) poets, an ex turned me on to Timothy Donnelly's book Twenty Seven Props for a Production of Eine Lebenszeit. I'm at work so I can't quote it, but I remember really digging a lot of it.

Also Josh Bell's Love Double Wide (your love is like a bad tattoo) - if only for the last stanza.

Tenaya Darlington's first book, Madame Deluxe (a collection of poetry inspired by drag queens) included the line "fashion being an equation, poetry is geekier math," which I still love.
 
 
Charlus
00:36 / 03.12.06
Trained? In what way? Is it enough ot be able to read, or is one's reaction to poetry less valuable if one hasn't learned about meter and stress?

By trained I mean that one needs to be able to recognise the different rhyme schemes a poet uses, their exploitation of language (e.g. do they use personification,) the use of grammar, the use of meter and stress on certain words, and what effect this creates for the poem as a whole. The use of syntax is also important to be able to recognise. If you read Emily Dickinsons poem 712 'Because I could not stop for death' Which is a little cliched to use I'll admit, and you read it being able to recognise these qualities within the poem, and how they contribute to the poems overall structure and effect, then the poem might seem more valuable then it is to you now.

So no, I don't think that it is enough to be able to just 'read', because I don't think that anyone could 'read' poetry without being able to recognise these qualities, or the words that they would be reading a merely words arranged on a page. they would be meaningless. One could even go so far as to argue that they, the reader are'illiterate', but I think at this stage that is going to far. Lasty, poetry is meant to be read aloud, and read actively and this can't be done, effectively without recognising these qualities.

But then, what alternatives do you mean by 'read'.

Regards,
Seamus.

P.s. I would like to correct a spelling mistake in my last post. I meant 'their', not 'there'.
 
 
iconoplast
01:40 / 03.12.06
Seamus, I may be misinterpreting your posts, but I've re-read them a couple of times and I can't help but believe you're telling me I don't know how to read poetry because I don't have the required degrees. I don't know many poets who would share this understanding of what it means to read poetry.

This is where I almost resist a gag vis-a-vis being trained to read your posts.

So... yeah. If I'm misinterpreting you, my bad - but you really sound as though you'd arrived in this thread to tell us all that we didn't know how to read poetry, and certainly shouldn't dare read outside the canon without formal preparation.
 
 
ginger
02:08 / 03.12.06
more long poem joy:

tony harrison does some very good stuff. 'v' is his most famous thing, which is particularly interesting if you've ever got mildly irritated with a romantic poem about graveyards. it was quite controversial when it came out; the bloodaxe books version collects the press response as an appendix, which is a nice wee bonus. it's also in the faber selected poems.

harrison's also written some film scripts in the form of long poems, many of which're published by faber. 'prometheus' is good if you like people moaning about not having margaret thatcher to moan about anymore; it's interesting to see how he uses strict poetic forms in a film setting.

if you want something a bit shorter, and at the risk of dragging in more dead white men, samuel beckett’s poems are genuinely excellent. it’s criminal that they’re not read as widely as his novels and plays. the collected poems has all his works in english and french, including his translations of his own work; it’s a pisser if you don’t read french, because you’re only getting half a book and paying for the lot, but trust me, it’s worth it. one of the french translations, which i reckon i can post under academic fair usage laws (wahey!):

what would I do without this world faceless incurious
where to be lasts but an instant where every instant
spills in the void the ignorance of having been
without this wave where in the end
body and shadow together are engulfed
what would I do without this silence where the murmurs die
the pantings the frenzies towards succour towards love
without the sky that soars
above its ballast dust

what would I do what I did yesterday and the day before
peering out of my deadlight looking for another
wandering like me eddying far from all the living
in a convulsive space
among the voices voiceless
that throng my hiddenness


bit like a much better version of myspace emo-kid angst poetry, innit? i’m pretty sure stephen king uses the word ‘deadlight’ quite extensively in ‘it’...

on the matter of training being necessary to the reading of poetry, i second iconoplast's call of shennanigans, which i think technically means we all have to hit each other with brooms now. the assumption that all poetry's based on stress and meter gets beaten out of first-year undergrads during their... erm... basic poetic training. much poetry works like that, but some doesn't, or does only some of the time. whilst this does rather bring into question the precise definition of poetry, it makes life much more fun and means we don't all just sit around and Appreciate gerard manley hopkins drowning nuns for the 9,000th time.

as for all poetry being intended to be read aloud, i defy anyone to read some of the later pound 'cantos' aloud without growing an extra voicebox, preferably one that's had classical chinese lessons, and i'd like to meet the reader who can adequately convey the 'falling words' page of section III book 3 of 'paterson' verbally. how do you pronounce the picture of a train that appears half way through ginsberg's 'iron horse'?

no snark intended...
 
 
ginger
02:14 / 03.12.06
as for straying from the canon, we all know what's in it and it's pretty stable by definition, so there's not much point in sitting around and asking each other if eliot and yeats're in or out this year. asking why we're straying from the canon in a thread started with the express purpose of doing so is a bit like turning up in at an a clash gig and asking why people aren't discussing byrd's 40-part motet.
 
 
Charlus
03:50 / 03.12.06
Iconoplast,

No, You read my posts correctly, and you are right, I am not entitled to tell you how to 'read' poetry, and I was aware as I was writing that this might be the case. However this is my opinion on the matter.

Thanks.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
11:59 / 03.12.06
For the record, seamus, either you are saying that one cannot read poetry without being able to read the language in which poetry is written, in which case your point is correct but not very interesting, or that there is a special skill attached to the reading of poetry, in which case you are largely wrong. Homer was read to the Athenian citizenry, few of whom had degrees but most of whom seemed to get something out of it.

There are, of course, knowledges which will aid enjoyment of poetry. Personally, I'd say the best way to pick those up is by reading poetry, and reading about poetry.

On which note, I'd recommend Don Paterson, who will probably be canon in a couple of decades. This from his first collection, Nil Nil:

An Elliptical Stylus

My uncle was beaming: 'Aye, yer elliptical stylus -
Fairly brings out a' the wee details.'
Balanced at a fraction of an ounce,
the fat cartridge sank down like a feather;
Music billowed into three dimensions
as if we could have walked between the players.

My Dad, who could appreciate the difference,
went to Largs to buy an elliptical stylus
for our ancient, beat-up Phillips turntable.
We had the guy in stitches: 'You can't...
er... you'll have to upgrade your equipment.'
Still smirking, he sent us up from the shop
with a box of needles, thick as carpet-tags,
the only sort they made to fit our model.

(Supposing I'd been his son: let's eavesdrop
on 'Fidelities', the poem I'm writing now:
The day my father died, he showed me how
he'd prime the deck for optimum performance:
it's that lesson I recall - how he'd refine
the arm's weight, to leave the stylus balanced
somewhere between ellipsis and precision,
as I gently lower the sharp nip to the line
and wait for it to pick up the vibration
till it moves across the page, like a cardiograph ...)


We drove back slowly, as if we had a puncture;
my Dad trying not to blink, and that man's laugh
stuck in my head, which is where the story sticks,
and any attemt to cauterize this fable
with something axiomatic on the nature of articulacy and inheritance,
since he can well afford to make his own
excuses, you your own interpretation.
But if you still insist on resonance -
I'd swing for him, and every other cunt
hapy to let my father know his station,
which probably includes yourself. To be blunt.

He gets better in later work - a lot of his language here is unoriginal, in particular in the first stanza - but the limping metre in the last line is a nice payoff, and the punchy metre and the combination of empathy and contempt in the third stanza works nicely. Good use of "cunt", also.
 
 
MrKismet
22:50 / 03.12.06
My two favorite American poets are Vachel Lindsay (try NOT tapping your toes while reading The Santa Fe Trail) and Ogden Nash. An old (probably dead, now) Lit prof argued with me that Nash was a humorist rather than a poet. I argued that anyone who could write

"God, in His wisdom, made the fly,
And then forgot to tell us why."

had far more soul than he did.
 
 
lord nuneaton savage
14:10 / 04.12.06
"to read poetry one has to be trained."

What, all poetry? By which we would mean Coleridge and Barry Macsweeney? John James and Dr. Seuss? Tom Raworth and Ezra Pound? John Hegley and Aaron Williamson? In some of those cases (I'm looking at you Pound, you shifty fascist you), yes, it might help. But I reckon that rather depends what you're after from each poem. You can still enjoy dear Ezra without sharing his classics education.

"Poetry is highly structured"

Yes, Poetry is generally highly structured, to desired effect, by is author. That's not the same as meaning you need a degree in sextuplets (or whatever the fuck you call 'em) to understand it.

"to read and understand the poems outcome, or meaning for want of a better word is to understand the inner workings of the poem."

See, a lot of the time when I ask people if they like jazz they say that they don't understand it. They see its (admittedly complex) combination of notes and tempos as something that needs decoding in order for it to be appreciated. This is pizzle of the highest order. Same goes for poetry.

There it is, in front of you. It's not going anywhere. It's a bunch of words. Play with them. Which of the words sound good together? Read it aloud. Declaim it in front of the bathroom mirror wearing nothing but a toga. Bore your significant other by reading it to them when they want to go to sleep. Leave it lying around for your friends to see, so that they think you're dead arty. Just read the bloody stuff.

I've been reading and writing poetry since my early adolesence (and, since we're on recommendations, may I suggest Barry Macsweeney and the aforementioned Tom Raworth) and I have no idea of how most of it works, or even what it means. I just know that there are some poems I carry around like melanomas, That are with me everywhere I go - that pop out of the brain dome at strange moments and colour everything glory.

I will admit to understanding less than half of the poetry I read, but I know what it feels like when it hits.
 
 
Hallo, Paper Spaceboy
15:10 / 04.12.06
"Understanding" poetry should just add layers to your enjoyment - it's not the Sum & Total Experience. A -good- poet is able to express something that will hit any reader, regardless of their education.

And I'd add Dorothy Parker to my list partly because I don't know how much she's considered part of the canon and because, well, her poetry's good for a bitter laugh or two.
 
 
buttergun
15:37 / 04.12.06
Christopher Logue. His reworking of the Iliad, War Music, is some of the best writing, let alone poetry, I've ever read.
 
 
Princess
15:56 / 04.12.06
Denise Levertov. SHe was a beat poet who wrote stunning things. To read her work is to be beaten heavily with the recognition stick. Behold:

Hymn To Eros

O Eros, silently smiling one, hear me.
Let the shadow of thy wings
brush me.
Let thy presence
enfold me, as if darkness
were swandown.
Let me see that darkness
lamp in hand,
this country become
the other country
sacred to desire.

Drowsy god,
slow the wheels of my thought
so that I listen only
to the snowfall hush of
thy circling.
Close my beloved with me
in the smoke ring of thy power,
that we way be, each to the other,
figures of flame,
figures of smoke,
figures of flesh
newly seen in the dusk.
 
 
glitch
06:04 / 05.12.06
Jorge Luis Borges is supposed to be really great. However I am recommending him in the form of a question. Having not read any. Are there readers of Borges here who would recommend particular writings? I am partial to fiction.
(I know I am contributing a little threadrot here. But I thought the on topic contribution balanced it out. No offense intended.)
 
 
lord nuneaton savage
08:46 / 05.12.06
Yep, it's threadrot so I'll get this over quickly.

Borges: read anything, it's all fantastic.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
09:12 / 05.12.06
There's a thread on Borges here, if anyone has further inquiries.
 
 
Charlus
11:04 / 05.12.06
I never mentioned that one needs a 'degree', though by saing one needs to be trained does sound elitist. Secondly, I don't think such a degree exists. Perhaps my way of reading poetry is old school, or perhaps for me to enjoy it I need to be able to follow the ryhme scheme and the like. I have tried to read poetry without any understanding of it's inner workings (Ariel), and it didn't work. For me, a person who is able to read poetry without even the slightest inkling of it's components is someone who has spoken in verse and prose their entire life.

Thankyou for your thoughts on this.

Seamus.
 
 
lord nuneaton savage
11:09 / 05.12.06
But not all poetry has a rhyme scheme. What about free-verse? Language poetry? The Beats? Oulipo? Prynne?

It's a very broad church is poetry.
 
 
All Acting Regiment
13:15 / 05.12.06
Christopher Logue. His reworking of the Iliad, War Music, is some of the best writing, let alone poetry, I've ever read.

Absolutely. It blows fucking Pope out of the water...
 
 
iconoplast
18:03 / 05.12.06
Robert Pinsky started something called the Favorite Poem Project, where people sent in their favorite poem and a little explanation of why it was their favorite.

The above link is to videos of, among other things, a Marine reading Yeats, Bill Clinton reading Emerson, Hillary reading Nemerov, a Salesman reading Ashberry, and a Construction Worker reading Whitman.

This is a link to an article about the project. Which the project is just so totally awe inspiring because it really demonstrates how poetry is much more available than we think it is, and how more or less everyone has, somewhere inside them, a favorite poem rattling around.

Nobel Laureate poet Czeslaw Milosz told Pinsky that “during the Nazi occupation, carrying a copy of a poem around was a form of rebellion that even the most timid person could engage in,” said Pinsky, “not an incendiary poem, but any poem in Polish; a lot of people carried a poem as the most minimal way of resisting.”

At some point I heard a reading, by (I think) Pinsky - it might have been W. S. Merwin - of Eros Turranos as a part of this project, accompanied by a heartwrenching letter from the woman who had picked the poem. She wrote about being trapped in a bad marriage in a beautiful house by the sea, and said that this poem spoke to her each and every time she read it, as it managed to capture her relationship to her house, her life, and her husband.

E A Robinson is sort of canonical, but not really in the capital C Canon, so I'm going to add Eros Turranos to the list, because it does have a rhyme scheme and cadence and because it is so formal, but at the same time so accessible and so affecting.

Eros Turranos

She fears him, and will always ask
What fated her to choose him;
She meets in his engaging mask
All reasons to refuse him;
But what she meets and what she fears
Are less than are the downward years,
Drawn slowly to the foamless weirs
Of age, were she to lose him.

Between a blurred sagacity
That once had power to sound him,
And Love, that will not let him be
The Judas that she found him,
Her pride assuages her almost,
As if it were alone the cost. --
He sees that he will not be lost,
And waits and looks around him.

A sense of ocean and old trees
Envelops and allures him;
Tradition, touching all he sees,
Beguiles and reassures him;
And all her doubts of what he says
Are dimmed of what she knows of days --
Till even prejudice delays
And fades, and she secures him.

The falling leaf inaugurates
The reign of her confusion;
The pounding wave reverberates
The dirge of her illusion;
And home, where passion lived and died,
Becomes a place where she can hide,
While all the town and harbor side
Vibrate with her seclusion.

We tell you, tapping on our brows,
The story as it should be, --
As if the story of a house
Were told, or ever could be;
We'll have no kindly veil between
Her visions and those we have seen, --
As if we guessed what hers have been,
Or what they are or would be.

Meanwhile we do no harm; for they
That with a god have striven,
Not hearing much of what we say,
Take what the god has given;
Though like waves breaking it may be,
Or like a changed familiar tree,
Or like a stairway to the sea
Where down the blind are driven.
 
 
ginger
18:48 / 05.12.06
seamus, not wishing to prolong a discussion that seems to have run its course, but i'm pretty sure that there're quite a few english lit. degrees around that include a fair amount of stuff on poetic form. in fact, the academic pendulum's swinging back in that direction; christopher ricks has been made professor of poetry at oxford, which is a post that traditionally goes to a poet, not a critic. he's very fond of tricksy little formal games, and knows his metre and rhyme backwards, even if he does talk a colossal load of bollocks about beckett.

i do agree with you that in certain circumstances, an analytical edge on a reading's desirable; some american universities seem to have a decidedly touchy-feely approach, where the students sit around and respond to things in a hugely subjective and ill-informed way, with the most 'moved' responses getting the highest marks. some places seem to send students up against eliot without so much as a translation of the german and french bits. however, i think that an obsession with form can lead to massively reductive approaches; form's important, even in free verse and suchlike, but there's more to life. there are times when it's worth stepping back and wondering if the metrix has you.

meanwhile, back at the topic:

dannie abse, welsh jewish cardiac doctor, poet, wrote a few plays, played john fuller at chess, now lives in hampstead, and i'm glad he's not dead, because whilst i know he'll never have statues built to him in the middle of cardiff, there's something in his poems that makes you think he must be a genuinely nice bloke, which is a rare quality in poetry. if you ask me, dylan thomas' true heir. 'two small stones', an odd wee poem, not sure what to make of it, but it definitely does something:

After the therapy of the grave ritual
(mourners who weep circumspectly weep less long)
'A fine man.' No-one snarled the priest was wrong.
Relatives pressed limp hands, filed out, heads bowed,
emotional as opera singers. But mute their song.

I do not know why I picked up two small stones
(bits of broken sky trailed on the gravel path)
and dropped them in my pocket. No epitaph,
no valediction pardoned me. Why didn't I cry,
and why won't I throw these stones away? Don't laugh.
 
 
Closed for Business Time
11:19 / 08.12.06
Mevlana Celaleddin Rumi.
Here, here and here for starters.

Sufi poetry from the 13th century. One of the finest.
 
 
grant
13:11 / 08.12.06
That Abse is brilliant. Why haven't I heard of him before?
 
  

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