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Fashion 10,000 years BC

 
 
All Acting Regiment
23:40 / 05.03.05
Okay. This is an odd idea I had, but just look at these:




The ghost world girl has a raptor top on that I thought was fucking ace when JP came out and still seem to now- dinosaurs are cool, aren't they? And the fur aesthetic- controversial but some love it. Are these people hip or no? And can we take inspiration from them? Would you, in fact?

(This is serious)
 
 
Tryphena Absent
09:24 / 09.03.05
I know that this is a bit off topic but the way that we perceive fur always strikes me as odd. It's a status symbol of the most basic sort. It represents bulk, wealth, power, only the rich and important wear fur and this surely harks back to a time when only the strongest and the fastest could obtain it. But there are miles between a person hunting and stripping an animal of its skin and the status that is afforded through those actions and the monied classes walking around in fur that they have bought, possibly through the same kind of ruthlessness, but a type gained with manicured nails.
 
 
Jack Vincennes
10:40 / 10.03.05
Legba, what do you mean when you say 'the fur aesthetic'? Sorry to pick up on what was actually quite a small part of your post, but I find it interesting since my own image of what that aesthetic is, is quite different from any of the pictures you post or what you talk about.

But there are miles between a person hunting and stripping an animal of its skin... and the monied classes walking around in fur that they have bought

I was thinking about that with reference to this thread as well, and wondered if the status was actually now derived from the fact that fur is so far dissociated from its source -it is, as Nina says, quite clear that the wearer didn't actually kill, clean and treat the hides of several animals. So is the status now just from the fact that the wearer can pay for someone else to do all this, which I would imagine (correctly or otherwise) to be more difficult than, for example, making a tshirt? And is this the same kind of status as that derived from any other piece of expensive clothing, or is the fact that it was once alive important?

Too many parentheses in the above paragraph, apologies for that...
 
 
Tryphena Absent
11:09 / 10.03.05
I think that there remains that sense of brutality around fur. I'm not sure if this is because, as a child, the vets waiting room had a Peta picture on the wall or if it really is because there's some association with hunter-gatherers locked in to me. It could also be the odd sense of brutal wealth that is associated with, for example, a Harrods shopper in a giant coat and gold jewellery- this image screams dirty money to me... the abuse of workers.

I think the fur aesthetic probably works on two levels- the first is that kind of tacky, cave girl image. Perfect hair and nails and a fur trimmed skin wrapped around the body. This image is tacky because it's at odds with the fur. It's about B-movies and cartoons and Wu-Tang videos.

The second type of fur aesthetic is the wealthy woman in her expensive coat. Fur is usually for people who want to advertise their wealth, not always but most of the time and it's especially impossible to ignore wealth in a neck to ankle fur coat. I find the fur aesthetic slightly repulsive.
 
 
Jack Fear
13:02 / 11.03.05
I think that there remains that sense of brutality around fur.

Not to derail the thread too much, but is this association with the abattoir also a part of what gives leather its bad-ass vibe?
 
 
Tryphena Absent
14:15 / 11.03.05
I really don't know, I think leather is so processed afterwards that it almost seems synthetic. It got its bad ass vibe primarily from cultural associations- pilots for example.

Actually I'm hard pressed to think of leather-wearers before the 20th century. Anyone else think of groups of people who definitely wore leather?
 
 
Jack Vincennes
10:24 / 16.03.05
I think that another point about leather (as opposed to fur) is that it's very hard-wearing -if someone puts a cigarette out on a leather jacket it won't make that much of a difference, whereas it would probably ruin a fur coat.

as for wearing leather pre-C20th -the first thing I thought of was the American West, I'd imagine that Native Americans (sorry if that's the wrong phrase) wore it. This seems to suggest so, and Wikipedia seems to associate it with clothes around the time of the gold rush. Not sure how either of these work with current cultural associations, though.
 
 
grant
18:53 / 16.03.05
There's a thing on leather pioneer clothes here, mentioning French traders, Native Americans and work clothes.

I also think of early motorists (if that counts as pre-20th-c), outdoorsmen and soldiers. And German Alpine villagers in their lederhosen, which might be more of an "outdoorsmen" thing than anything else.

Breeches, "spatterdashes" and leggings were also made of leather in the 1700s.

I think these were all utilitarian applications.
 
 
Liger Null
11:50 / 30.03.05
I'm more interested in the dinosaur aesthetic. I remember once seeing a necktie with a veloceraptor on it and eyeing it covetously, wishing I were the kind of girl who could pull off a necktie.
 
 
All Acting Regiment
13:26 / 30.03.05
Dinosaurs are cool, especcially your fast predator type ones (see ghost world pic above). On a t-shirt, they have this kind of "Yeah? I'm clever enough to know about and like these things" vibe, but also a "Yes, I will rip your fucking face off with my extendable foot claw".
 
 
Jub
12:11 / 31.03.05
 
 
ibis the being
12:55 / 31.03.05
"Yeah? I'm clever enough to know about and like these things" vibe, but also a "Yes, I will rip your fucking face off with my extendable foot claw".

Really? I think dinosaur Ts are just another "ironic" Tshirt referencing childhood in the 80s. And why it's perceived as particularly hot or badass on a girl is because dinosaurs are stereotypically little boys' obsessions - so it broadcasts a message like "I was a tomboy who played with trucks and dinosaurs, now I have boobs but I'm still tough, rawr." The assumption being she's aggressive/good in bed. Like many Tshirts, it's a bit too talky for my tastes, but to each....
 
 
grant
17:43 / 01.04.05
That being said,

I'm more interested in the dinosaur aesthetic. I remember once seeing a necktie with a veloceraptor on it and eyeing it covetously, wishing I were the kind of girl who could pull off a necktie.

You are.

I don't have to know what you look like to know you are.
 
 
Liger Null
21:37 / 03.04.05
Thanks, but you really have to be a super-girly waifish young-Diane-Keaton-type to pull it off, in my view. I'm too tall and buxom (not to brag or anything, it's actually a pain in the ass, see brasseire thread) to do the men's-suit thing without it looking ultra-weird. Trust me, I tried. People thought I was a guy with a glandular problem...
 
 
Tryphena Absent
22:08 / 03.04.05
Dump the jacket, go for a Jane Russell in a suit plus dinosaur necktie look.
 
 
grant
12:59 / 04.04.05
I'm with Nina.
 
  
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