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Bush and illegal immigrants

 
 
grant
16:38 / 27.01.05
OK, Bush just had a press conference yesterday where he brought up his support for a plan that I *think* comes from John McCain, one of the more interesting Republicans out there.

What Bush said yesterday:

"It's necessary to reform the immigration system."

And

I'm against amnesty, I've made that very clear... [I am] advancing a program that enables people to come into our country in a legal way to work for a period of time, for jobs that Americans won't do, will help make it easier for us to secure our borders.

The plan, as outlined briefly in the New York Sun:
The president has offered only broad outlines for a guest worker proposal. It would allow the estimated 10 million undocumented immigrants in America to gain three-year renewable temporary work visas. Employers could also advertise for foreign workers and the government would provide guest worker visas if they can prove a labor shortage.


Apparently, the actual legislation is being drawn up jointly by Senators McCain and Kennedy.

Note that one thing this could mean is that, in upcoming debates, President Bush could find himself lining up with Ted Kennedy against the Republican right.

Which sure is *interesting*.

The other thing I find interesting is that Bush seems to actually be thinking like a human being on this one.

Here, from the Salt Lake Tribune:

"I believe that if a person, an employer, can't find somebody willing to do a job in America, they ought to be able to legally hire somebody who is not a citizen of our country, and that that person ought to be treated with respect," the president said in an interview with The Wall Street Journal.


So what else does this mean that I'm not getting?
 
 
Axolotl
16:45 / 27.01.05
Is this not basically a sop to the large agri-businesses who use largely illegal migrant labour to work their farms and pick their fruit? Maybe I'm wrong but I find it hard to believe Bush is doing this out of the goodness of his heart. However I'd love to be proved wrong if anyone has any more info on this.
 
 
lekvar
18:13 / 27.01.05
This isn't just confined to the agribusiness sector- this will also affect Silicon Valley and other high-tech industries. This same thing was done in California in the late '90s to bring in cheap (but perfectly qualified) programmers and engineers from India, Pakistan, and other knowledge-rich areas. Illegal immigrants are also often used in microchip fabrication where dangerous levels of arsenic and other chemicals are used. Native citizens have this nasty habit of complaining, or worse forming unions, when their lungs start bleeding, but if you're threatened with deportation you'll do "jobs that Americans won't do."

By greasing the skids on the immigration issue, Mr. Bush gets to offer a friendly hand to the Latino community, (where there is both strong pro-immigration sentiment and anti-illegal sentiment) the agribusiness PACs, and the heavy industry/high-tech sectors, with the added bonus of weakening labor groups.
 
 
ibis the being
23:01 / 27.01.05
I would have had little idea what this is all about had I not just read the excellent book Reefer Madness by Eric Schlosser. The middle essay in this book of three, called "In the Strawberry Fields," is about migrant farm laborers particularly and cheap (ie illegal) labor in general. Basically, American corporations in the agriculture, meatpacking, construction, and other industries have everything to gain and nothing to lose by hiring illegal immigrants - they'll work for less, they'll do dangerous work that's not OSHA approved, they're fearful of joining unions or standing up for their own rights in other ways, they usually can't read English and therefore sign contracts against their best interests, etc etc. This whole "guest worker" idea is just a way to legalize & legitimatize (?) these unethical business practices and human rights abuses, and I presume to make a few tax dollars off these already poor working immigrants.

If you think Ted Kennedy is going to be on board with this, you've misunderstood.
 
 
Axolotl
08:47 / 28.01.05
Reefer Madness is my source for information about this issue, though Schlosser also touches on this in his other excellent book "Fast Food Nation".
 
 
grant
15:07 / 28.01.05
Kennedy not joining in? Hmm.

This from 25 Dec:
Kennedy, a longtime proponent of immigration reform said, "Congress needs to fix our broken immigration system as soon as possible, not only for economic and humanitarian reasons, but for urgent national security reasons as well. I'm hopeful we can reach bipartisan agreement early in the new Congress on reforms that are obviously needed."

and

Both McCain and Kennedy have sponsored guest worker bills in the past, and need to come up with a bill that will pass muster on both sides of the political aisle.



There's a heck of a lot more about "guest worker" issues here, at the California Rural Legal Assistance Foundation page, but I think I need someone to summarize all this stuff for me.
 
 
Alex's Grandma
15:22 / 28.01.05
Is there going to be any form of naturalisation involved in this though, whereby after say, nine years and two visa renewals it would be possible to apply for citizenship ? Because if not, any 'respect' afforded to the guest worker is going to be very much at the employer's discretion, I'd say. At least it's hard to picture anyone getting any ideas about issues like decent pay and conditions with the threat of cancellation hanging over their head.
 
 
whothehell@where?
15:29 / 06.02.05
i've read a couple opinion pieces suggesting legitimization of non citizen labor could also benefit social security in the long term, taking twelve percent from these workers and the matching funds from their employers despite the fact that 90% of them will never be granted citizenship and therefore will never be eligible to recieve social security benefits
 
 
Joetheneophyte
17:57 / 06.02.05
Does this smell of slavery to anybody else

Now don't get me wrong.....I know that unlawful workers crossing into America is a huge problem ......but this seems a rather cheap and nasty fix, and if the 'undesirables' are offered dangerous and poorly paid jobs, how in the long term is this going to help the US economy

1: it fits in with the globalisation model perfectly....cheap labour, poor conditions and the higher eschelons of society are seeing their profit margins grow via exploitation and a lack of health and safety concerns

2: Once in place, it is the potential thin end of the wedge to lawful, cross border movement of migrant workers. How do you legislate against the self same Mexican worker, taking your already piss poor paying job at McDonalds? You go for the job and the employer says 'well I offered the minimum wage, 80 hours per week....the US citizen had child care commitments that prevented them working more than 75 hours per week and so by the legislation in place, legally I am bound to employ the Mexican worker'

Okay, a gross exaggeration but I am making a point


3: it is a band aid to greater problems. For example, often trade tariffs, ridiculous IMF loans and corporate greed all contribute to other countries other than the US and those in Europe, from ever getting a decent chance of digging themselves out of debt. This proposal will do little to help Mexico fend for itself but forever be a poor relation to the US (imo)
the old adage, about giving a man a fish or helping him to learn to fish comes to mind


4: with lawful transit of labour, the US government has less of an argument when it comes to inter racial unions(by that I mean US/MEXICAN marriage etc)
what about the increase of children this will produce?

How will the US legislate against claims for residency from people who lawfully enter the US on such temporary visas and marry or produce kids? and how can supporting such children be of benefit to the child or the economy. Kick the father out and you are left with a single parent....take him in and if he cannot find work ......... ?

5: with the litigation culture in the US and greedy lawyers, surely it is only a matter of time before some clever slick lawyer decided to go for a test case against the US governement on the grounds that by virtue of point 4 above (or another issue) that this allows free migration. Once on the statute books, this will be hard to revoke and the US may be making a rod for it's own back



just my opinion but point two in particular is of particular concern as I can see how the insidiousness of this could further erode workers rights and freedoms
 
  
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