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the basics ( a humble request)

19:19 / 02.08.01

I'm coming cap-in-hand here.

The situation's this: I'm working on a story that heavily incorporates magic. I started it long before I dipped my big toe into the pool that is barbelith, and was completely oblivious of all this actual magick going on.

The kind of magic in my story is pretty well defined in my mind now, but since I've discovered you guys I thought I might ask a favour...

Can you give me the basics, basically. What it it you believe? What is it you practice? Are there any common pitfalls in the fictional representation of magic that you could help me to avoid? Is there any cool stuff out there that hasn't made it into fiction yet that I should know about?

Just think of me as Craig David. Fill me in.

Mordant Carnival

19:48 / 02.08.01

*puts on goat-horn headdress and snakeskin robe, does high-kickin' Dance of Evil*

A virgin! A virgin! We've found a virrrrrrgin!

(cue maniacal laughter, fade to cut.)

I belive six impossible things before brekfast (copyright the Rev. C. Dodgeson, all rights reserved).

All joking apart, sweet child... we belive all kinds of shinola round 'ere.

Speaking for myself: as a chaote / chaoist / unsavory-character-practicing-Low-Magick-in- defiance-of-all-things-Nice-and-New-Agey, I don't really believe in very much. It doesn't do to go around believing in things- you just give them ideas. At the moment, I'm entertaining the following metabelief: that our perception of reality influences that reality in certain small but important ways, and that we can harness this by using the unconcious mind via meditation, running round in circles till we fall over, or having (ahem) a Quiet Night In with a sigil, if you take my meaning. Or just plain hoovering up drugs till our brains leak out of our noses for all I care.

Pitfalls: getting discouraged because your overambitious sigil is a dud; forgetting that you still have to hold down a job and get the dinner on once you've hung up the ol' wand for the night; your own ego.

Cool stuff: That unforgettable "Hey, this shit really works, dude!" moment.

Anyoldhoo. Get up off your knees, lad; put your cap back on and join the party.

[ 02-08-2001: Message edited by: Mordant Carnival ]

01:59 / 03.08.01

My advice is simple and to the point: Run while you still can.

03:29 / 03.08.01

Well, as a Heremetic, I would advise the Golden Dawn by Regardie, the Lesser Key of Solomon trans by Mathers and Crowley, and the Sacred Magic of Abramelin the Mage, trans by Mathers. Tree of Life by Regardie is very good too.

If you survive that, I would recommand Phil Hine's Prime Chaos if you want to hang with the chaos mages around here.

i would also recommand practising physical magic too, like yoga or a martial art.

Good luck!

-Jesse

12:35 / 03.08.01

I think it would be more helpful if we tried to condense the main tenets and misconceptions of our beliefs into our posts, rather than overload Parliament with background reading. Bibliographies could then be added afterwards. If I were researching, I would need to know what source materials could offer before I delved in – they may not be wholly relevant to the subject.

Parliament, my friend: you already know where I’m coming from. There’s no real way you can misrepresent Christians, as we seem to have created all the negative archetypes that exist. Anyway: you’re a wicked writer and I know you’d do justice to all us sandal wearing, bigoted NRA nutters.

Oh - bibliography:

"Orthodoxy" and "The Everlasting Man" by G.K.Chesterton.

The Bible (heh, heh, heh - good luck with this one)

12:46 / 03.08.01

I second the Regardie.

Might want to check out Crowley's Magick Without Tears or Magick in Theory & Practice as well.

Doreen Vailente's books are good for the witchier side of things, can't think of specific titles due to major hangover

Witchcraft for Tomorrow is one...Issac Bonewits' Real Magic is coming to mind as well, not sure if it's what you're looking for though...

14:08 / 03.08.01

It's all about concentrating on the stuff your conscious mind down't normally notice. The world is not causal in the same way we think it is; things tend to happen at the same time in complexes that we choose to believe are cause-effect.
Raising awareness via meditation or martial arts or just going a bit mad - that's the way to notice the stuff your conscious mind wants to gloss over. Maybe do more than notice....

Mordant Carnival

15:32 / 03.08.01

quote:Originally posted by Rev. Jesse:
...i would also recommand practising physical magic too, like yoga or a martial art.

Good luck!

-Jesse

Roundly seconded.

01:05 / 04.08.01

Just so we don't start taking ourselves too seriously, Book of the Subgenius, baby. It probably won't be that helpful, but you'll enjoy it.

Also, just for general reference, I'd swing by your local book shop, check the bargain tables, see if you can find a general encyclopedia of divination or other such things. You can find some pretty decent resources sometimes for quite cheap.

Blank Faced Avatar

11:31 / 05.08.01

I'll tell you what I believe, but you can fuck off with that 'bo selecta' bollocks.

The only books I've ever really taken on are the King James Bible & the Tao of Lao Tsu.

Everyday life is miraculous, but I don't believe in magic especially. To clarify, I find formulating thoughts into sound energy to beam them into another person's head - ie talking - indistinguishable on a basic level from descriptions of psychic abilities; My mind & body enable me to interact with the other, miraculous power but no magic needed. I don't see the laws of physics having to be broken to explain how the mind works, how it can influence reality or affect action at a distance.

Magicians just make a lot of fuss about human abilities which often distracts them from some of the most powerful magic, like at least experimenting with getting off your ass & doing something about your life instead of resorting to some occult sigil cure immediately.

[ 05-08-2001: Message edited by: the Humble Crab ]

12:17 / 05.08.01

I believe all you need to experience the universe is inside your head.I think this world is a test,embedded in an extra-dimensional game.I think we will,one day,move through space like a shoal of fish.
I asked some entities 'Why?',as they over-hauled my obsidian body like they were changing a tyre on the car.No answers.Blank stares.I went into a place,journeying in a direction I've never thought of,and asked about what I do for a living (artist),it said :You are imitating nature.I can travel outside of the dreams and I know its shapes -or at least the shape of my imagination and all its impermanent localisations of psychocosm.I couldn't do any of these things without all those weird ass books I've read,and all the weird ass people I've met or written to.The corridors of your mind are real.And I'll keep going,no matter what any one tells me what to belive,until some pan-dimensional uber-alien gives me some goddam straight answers.To ask yourself what you believe,is premature by these standards.I believe in nothing,till I can feel it powering through my mind like the silence of a jet trail.Love is the real thing.Love is it.Love is the bomb.Magic is the medium.

Mordant Carnival

12:32 / 05.08.01

quote:Originally posted by the Humble Crab:
...some of the most powerful magic, like at least experimenting with getting off your ass & doing something about your life instead of resorting to some occult sigil cure immediately.

Fuckin' A, Crab.

[ 05-08-2001: Message edited by: Mordant Carnival ]

16:46 / 06.08.01

Some fanciful posturing and some food for thought.

I've got a pretty good idea what direction I want to take this story in and your input has pretty much clinched it for me.

Thanks for the help.

Mordant Carnival

16:53 / 06.08.01

quote:Originally posted by Parliament of Fools:
Some fanciful posturing and some food for thought.

I've got a pretty good idea what direction I want to take this story in and your input has pretty much clinched it for me.

Thanks for the help.

I can only come to one conclusion.

Parliament of Fools hates us.
Hates us and is going to put us in a story as Baddies.
Just like everybody hates us. Because we're so important.

Thank goodness for my tinfoil beret and lead socks, that's all I can say.

17:05 / 06.08.01

I'd like to be important,like Michael Jackson or Uri Geller.I'm sure Uri's known about my ambitions for ages,which is why he's blocking my ability to bend paperclips,and they're bent already.