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Being Here Now...

12:26 / 02.10.04

Ok, I'm going to give two version of this post. The short version with no background, and the longer version with background.

Short version, I am wondering how people keep themselves focussed away from thoughts of the past and the future and live in the present?

Long version, one of the trends I have seen in many of the meditation books and the like I have been reading have extolled the virtues of living in the moment and not focussing on the past or the future as that can make one's life negative(I feel I should put a caveat in at this point that some thoughts of the past and the future are good as they help one to learn and anticipate respectively, it's when we go too much in the past and future that's the problem). I have been trying some of the practices suggested and am meeting with slow progress and frequent stumbling blocks so I'm curious to see what other techniques people use.

James

13:02 / 02.10.04

Just to start with, i'm in no way an expert with this problem.

I have been trying some of the practices suggested and am meeting with slow progress and frequent stumbling blocks so I'm curious to see what other techniques people use.

I had this for years and eventually things got better. One possible explanation is that it simply takes a long time for some people to do properly and with others it just comes naturally.

Can i ask what practises you've been trying and what stumbling blocks your coming up against? I think i read in Conversation that your Buddhist, have the practises all been Buddhist/Eastern orientated? This can often be a problem if you live in the Western world, not saying that it won't eventually pay off, but that it takes time to hone the skill.

One suggestion i can think of if you are Buddhist orientated, is to try reading the Tao Te Ching and then going back to Buddhism, it could give you a whole new outlook on the problems your having.

13:45 / 02.10.04

Ok, the practices I have been using are a combination of single point and analytical meditations mostly centered around simple relaxation and the subjective nature of reality. This is achieved through sitting meditation and devotional practice to Chenrezig and Tara as well as reading on Tibetian Meditation and Buddhist texts(I can recommend several very good titles if you want. These were recommended by my teacher and they are quite good). I have also learned several highly specific meditational practices that are good for anger and hate.

The stumbling blocks I come up are for the most part topical. For example, since I really amped up my practice two years ago(I have been practicing off and on since I was 13), I have made great strides against my temper and against lesser manifestations of attatchment and aversion. However, I am finding(especially recently as it inspired the post), that I am having very limited success with attatchment to women. In English, I've become real hard to piss off and quite patient and reasonably compassionate, but I have recently discovered that I am stil quite vulerable to going bongo stupid over some women who display a particular combination of personality and appearance.

Here is a bit more about how the practices I use fail. I understand that the only reason that all of the aggregates hold appeal is that I signify them as appealing(i.e., most guys don't find quoting Shakespeare via IM, beating people with foam weapons and listening to goth and techno music drop dead sexy) because of my past experiences(or karma). I understand further that dwelling on past conversations with her as well as thinking of the next time I will see her will be counterproductive if done to excess. However, I am only barely able to not do this, as opposed to getting angry or drinking too much alcohol which I can easily avert. Some of the more specific meditations for this situation(yes, there are specific meditations for this sort of thing, they involve examining the separate aggregates and circumstances of the person you feel intense attatchment to) yield slightly better results, but the results are still marginal.

James

16:21 / 02.10.04

but I have recently discovered that I am stil quite vulerable to going bongo stupid over some women who display a particular combination of personality and appearance.

I don't think there's any need to worry about it too much, your not the only one in this situation! Like i said, it should come with time, don't stress too much about it. You seem to be doing other things well that many people have a nightmare with, so take confidence from that, and if you keep at it maybe your willpower will strengthen to the point where you can resist the charms of these women a lot easier than you expected.

Not that i'm an expert on women, but who is?

Or you could just try your hardest to completely abstain for a while of course, but it's upto you. Try looking at it from as many different angles as you can too, a solution could come to you that way.

17:15 / 02.10.04

While the practice you mention is undoubtedly a good thing, it seems to me like you're going about it in a very controlled and analytical way. Would it not help to simply stop analyzing and worrying about (self)control sometimes?
(I don't know you or your particular situation, but I do have some personal experience with the issues you're speaking of)

For every "what if?" there's a "so what?". Few things are worth agonizing over, and those are generally the ones you can't do much about in the first place.

In short, to begin with I definitely second Jack's recommendation of the Tao Te Ching.

And which man really understands women, anyway?

19:18 / 02.10.04

One other thing ! Stop and smell the flowers .

Unconditional Love

23:05 / 02.10.04

action is a great way to be in the moment.

i recommend food or bodily movement.

prepare a fvourite food take time over every ingredient how it is arranged how it mixes its smell its texture how it cooks pay intense attention to it and do the same with the serving, taste every mouth full, chew it thousands of times til you really understand that taste, become aware of the swallowing and digestion, burp and fart.

a slow form of martial art say tai chi, bagua, water boxing or perhaps hatha yoga can also help you become aware of the moment, ive found it easier through an act of doing rather than abstract contemplation.

another way would be to pick one sense, say smell and indulge it with a range of smells, notice memories the differences between smells etc etc.

gotham island fae

23:53 / 02.10.04

Breathe.

Start by focusing on one's breath and making it conscious. When in meditation, this is fundamental. When in action in life it can be useful to direct consciousness toward respiration's normally automatic function. Thereby commiting directly to the moment that one is in.

Then as one is walking down the street or sitting on one's stoop, expand the same consciousness of breath out into a connection to the universal respiration that goes on all around, every moment. This is similar to what is suggested here:

another way would be to pick one sense, say smell and indulge it with a range of smells, notice memories the differences between smells etc etc.

Take all senses and direct them towards the environment one finds for oneself.

15:02 / 04.10.04

Hey James

I really think there's a brillant selfhelp book waiting to be written about the sexual dilemmas of young men. I'm not taking the piss, I'm serious, probably every bloke on the board has twisted himself up in some way or another at some point, including me.

I note from your intro you're a Vajrayana practioner - could some of this stuff not help? A practice I've tried a few times is to sit somewhere busy and watch everyone passing and acknowledge taht they have the same desires I do - towards happiness, away from suffering - to get out of my egocentricity. Doing this makes you conscious of the way in which you're creating narratives, backstory etc with everyone you look at - the interesting thing is, this is all coming from me, is all aan act of creation on my part.

Perhaps you could try something similar.Taking "ownership" of all your projections and recognising they're not anything to do with her, that they're all coming from you? You could even name each component of your projection, try and visualise it, then banish/tell it fuck off.
All this stuff is easier said than done, I know.

21:13 / 04.10.04

Try eating more yellow food, like bannanas. Not too much though.

09:06 / 05.10.04

I heartily recommend what Illmatic is saying about owning your own projections concerning how you relate to the opposite sex.

The process is fairly simple, and involves listing everything that you find attractive in the opposite sex. Everything that makes you *go bongo.* Then realise that this list has nothing to do with the people in question, and everything to do with you and your internal reality. Do some self-exploration with it.

Then comes the fun part. Wear the characteristics on the list like a mask, and become that person. You might overbalance in favour of becoming your anima for a while, but the parts should soon intergrate. Or, rather than role playing, you could use a parts integration technique. Or make up your own technique that feels right.

Jung has an awful lot of useful stuff to say here, particularly concerning the anima and animus. Note that I don't believe it to be true, I just found it to be a useful model when dealing with my experience. The anima is his term for the parts of the male personality that we unconsciously label as female, which usually represent aspects of ourselves that we are currently uncomfortable with or distanced from, and often get projected onto certain types of people who we perceive represent those characteristics.

Good luck - this kind of work can be great fun if approached with non-dogmatic, accepting curiosity. And you'll become a much sexier person once you start to get a handle on it!

10:36 / 10.10.04

Ok, lots of responses. I'll try to address them as best as I can.

Tao Te Ching: Read it before, but it's the type of thing that is really slippery so I'm reading it again, even as we speak. Oh, and on a side note, if you are a techno fan, it seems that jungle goes really well will Tao Te Ching. Who knew?

Vajrayana practice: The biggest problem with using some of the deity practices is that it takes a vast amount of time. It's actually interesting as some of the practices described later in this thread combine the teachings on emptiness and the influence of the individual on perception of the aggregates(properties) as well as the practice of visualizing oneself as the deity(in this case it would in my case be Tara, as I can practice with Chenrezig and Tara, one female and one male, I find that brings a sort of balance to it).

A self help book on young men and dating: I was perusing online and actually found something(the link escapes me sadly enough) addressed to women that was quite interesting. It talked about many of the same concerns that I had in the first place. This was interesting to me as it showed that there is a strong chance(once one looks at the situation through the "wisdom eye" as Lama Yeshe puts it) that she may be going through very similar. And somehow that, plus the other input here, helps greatly.

I'll post more later, but that's me for now.

James

farseer /pokes out an i

13:46 / 11.10.04

On this one, I'm with what 'Justice for the US' has expressed thus far re: breathing. (Not discounting what other folks have posted, lol) I practise Aikido, and I've discovered that combinations of the following help me play in "Now-space" and stay for a while, until something (usually within me) bumps me out.

- don't look at the clock. This helps so much, it's hard to describe. I've eliminated some of the clocks in my house (or taken the batteries out of the analog ones, leaving them 'frozen' on prime numbers).

- keep some awareness on your breathing, don't let your breathing stay shallow for too long. Sometimes keeping the feeling of motion on your nose hairs for the inhalation helps. Took me a bit of experimentation to find the right body clue to work this one best. If I get up in the AM and stretch, and take a few minutes to relax and tune into my breath, it helps me stay centered all day.

- keep your vision wide. Even when you're stuck staring at an LCD or stoplight, keep your mind engaged with what's going on beyond the focal point. I developed a nack at doing this via riding motorcycles- keeping my vision broad really helps maintain a good mental 'map' of what's going on around me.

- try imagining that all your see and hear are only models of that's going on in your brain, like everything is an image you're seeing in there, like the entire universe is in your head. I get a werid buzzy/wired feeling when I'm doing this, and my vision quality changes to a fluid/broad/non-focused but aware of change/color/motion. This is the most difficult one to keep playing with for long to me. But i've noticed I stay more 'balanced' (in body) and centered (in mind) while I'm playing with this model.

09:43 / 20.10.04

Well, here's an update. I've since been able to move otu of the house I was in and that will help, once I get the power turned on(scheduled for today). Some things happened with the woman that was mentioned earlier and that caused a huge wave of anger. It was more than I have felt in a very long time. It was all I could do to not raise my voice, punch through a wall and so forth. I was able to, after a few minutes, regain control and was able to overcome it completely after a few minutes.
It was fortunate that I wasn't as ignorant as I once was in that I was able to remember that the woman in question was only the relative cause of something that begins in my mind as opposed to the ultimate determinant of it(the ultimate determinant being, btw, the mind).

I'll post more on this, most likely in a new post in the "Conversaton" thread.

James

00:36 / 12.11.04

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