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Yet another silly sigil question.

 
 
Trijhaos
18:30 / 17.02.02
So I was thinking of giving sigils another try enough though out of the last 6 or so only one had any success and I got to thinking about a few things.

1. Does the color of the sigil matter? I did all of my previous sigils in black. If I were to draw up a sigil for a job using a green marker, since I've always equated green with cash, would I have better success?

2. Would a sigil that replaced "I will" with "I am" work? Say you're doing a sigil to gain self-confidence and you have it say "I am self-confident" would it work, or would it be a dud?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
19:02 / 17.02.02
Colour of the sigil: Well, no, I doubt it would make much difference in theory. However, you might want to select a colour that has particular significance for you. (Thanks for bringing this up, BTW: your question that has made me realise that when making a sigil I will go out of my way to select a blue pen. Never thought about that before. Hmmm....)

"I am" is probably as good as "I will". In the sort of context you mention it might be even better.

Basically, the theory goes like this: When you make and charge a sigil, you are talking to your subconscious. Your subconcious understands absolutes pretty well, but has problems with negatives. For example, say you were due to give a public performance of some kind and you were feeling nervous. There's no use making a sigil that says "I will not feel nervous", because your subconcious mind may well just skip over the not part and the whole thing will blow up in your face. Also on the avoid list are instructions like "I want to do (whatever)." You already want to do (whatever), so the sigil might do nothing except re-inforce your desire. (Okay, that alone might help you to achieve said desire, but that's beside the point.)

Hope this helps, and as I say it's all theory. Someone else might have a different take on the subject.
 
 
Trijhaos
22:08 / 17.02.02
What do you mean about picking a color that has a particular significance?

Yeah, I figured that "I am" may be better than "I will" in the context I was using it. The only reason I thought of this because I was thinking about an old episode of "Empty Nest" where Carol is listening to a self-help tape and she's repeating "I am the best me I can be". I thought maybe using the "I am" would be best when charging a sigil that deals with changing oneself. Anyway I figure it'd be easier to change myself than attempt to change my surroundings.

[ 18-02-2002: Message edited by: Trijhaos ]
 
 
Vadrice
04:05 / 18.02.02
Sigils are symbolic. That's the key. If a colour holds you meaning, it's important. If writing it on an egg and then hardboiling it in a stew of your own cum and wine, it's important.
Symbol- representation. Representation- focus. Focus- hones the energies.

That's my say.
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
05:20 / 18.02.02
I just meant a colour that has significance for you, like your fave colour, or one that you associate with the project at hand (blue for healing, red for energy, as it might be). What you feel would work best for you.
 
 
cusm
13:37 / 18.02.02
Chaos magick theory: Symbols mean nothing save what they mean to you. Use a color if you think its signifigant.

More traditional view: The body of evidence in psychological studies suggests strongly that colors have a more universally understood effect on the subconscious. For instance, Red has a lot of energy, can make you mad or irritated, but is also used a lot in magic works to give power to the work. Blue is cooling, tameing, and aids in communication. Yellow promotes intellect, orange energy in a less agressive manner than red, green is good for healing and growth, brown grounds, purple makes people crazy if they stare at it for too long.

When it comes to colors, follow your intuition. They work exactly how you think they do.
 
 
Trijhaos
13:59 / 18.02.02
I see now. The whole color thing is starting to make a bit more sense. I was lurking earlier on the chaosmagic.com message board and there was a post basically stating that the colors of magick were created out of spite, and that sigils limit chaos magick in some way.

I'd provide a link to the post but they use some queer messageboard software over there because every time I try I get sent to a page that says the service isn't available.

[ 18-02-2002: Message edited by: Trijhaos ]
 
 
Logos
22:16 / 18.02.02
Another way to think about all of this is from the standpoint of an artist. Technically, any piece of art can look like anything; however, each particular piece of art you make will seem to work better if you do it in one specific way or another: This should be green, and that should be smaller, paler, and drawn upside down (or whatever).

All of these choices may be conscious or unconscious on your part, but all of them have significance in the outcome, appearance and meaning of the artwork.

Or something like that. I'm really tired tonight.
 
 
Grendix
01:36 / 19.02.02
Vadrice,
off the topic...
...but "stew in your own cum"?
good lord man, you must not get out much, if you have enough to make stew with!



~G~
*keepin' it real, yo, since 1983*
 
 
ghadis
08:32 / 19.02.02
quote: I was lurking earlier on the chaosmagic.com message board and there was a post basically stating that the colors of magick were created out of spite, and that sigils limit chaos magick in some way.

?!?...I suppose they're talking about Carrolls colours of the 8 magicks he laid out in Liber Kaos...

Black - Death Magick
Blue - Wealth Magick
Green - Love Magick
Yellow - Ego Magick
Purple/Silver - Sex Magick
Orange - Thinking Magick
Red - War Magick

All quite traditional and mostly tying in with what cusm said. There's quite a backlash again Carroll going on at the moment. I havn't read the post that you talked about but perhaps they were comlaining about Carroll getting too traditional with the colour system or inventing it to spite the traditional comunity.
Liber Kaos is not one of Carrolls best books and there is a lot to find fault with in it but the 8star and it's colours work fine for me (at the moment). THere are problems with it such as the Thinking/Wealth axis but i tend to think of those as Play/Work which seems to work better...

That aside i aggree with what everyone has said above. Colours don't have to make a difference. Just go with what is right for you but it can be handy to use a colour system now and then. And the psychological attributes are undeniable.
 
 
Trijhaos
08:32 / 19.02.02
quote: The Colors of Magic seems to have been created out of spite for those who believe that magic is either black or white. True enough, Chaos magic is neither black nor white, indeed, but it's as easily a rainbow as it is nothing at all. The Eight Colors, while doubtlessly useful on a purely practical basis (as a form of categorization, perhaps), also act as an impediment to the understanding of the theorists. I read on the forum about one person who was having trouble with Wealth magic, and who had corrected an error in Chaos theory. Wealth magic isn't part of Chaos theory, per se. It's a belief designed and supported by the belief of it's creator and those who accept it as true.


That quote comes from the post I mentioned above. Yeah, you could say he's going on about Carroll's 8 colours of magick.

What's this backlash against Carroll thing you mentioned? This is the first I've heard anything about it.
 
  
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