Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.

Underground > Art, Fashion & Design >

"Is this outfit too gay?"

No star here laces

08:07 / 03.09.04

...is a question i often find myself asking when choosing an outfit.

And it's a tricky one. It's not that I could give a fuck what people think my sexuality is, but should I be looking for casual sex with a person of the opposite gender that evening, an outfit that is too gay would be misjudged (singapore being a conservative place).

But, dammit, it's fucking annoying how once you've gone past a certain level of flamboyance the assumptions start to kick in.

Suggestions for decoupling outre fashion from male homosexuality here please.

(especially if they concern how I can wear my black and white horizontal stripe trousers and beret combo with impunity)

lord nuneaton savage

10:53 / 03.09.04

I don't think you'd catch a man of taste, gay or otherwise, in a pair of horizontal striped trousers.

won't they make your thighs look really big?

11:41 / 03.09.04

The gayer the better, I think. Then when you subject an unwary girl to sweaty frottage in a dank nightclub, they're pleasantly surprised.

M'lud.

Skeleton Camera

19:36 / 03.09.04

Horizontal stripes are for shirts, not pants. Not that that's a RULE but they do tend to make yer figure look weird.

I find it's all about ambiguity. Wear what ye please and people will make their assumptions. Your character, and the way you carry yourself, will reveal other things. And I don't even mean dressing femme and acting macho. Often enough, in my experience, simply NOT acting the stereotypical "limp-wrist" part throws people off-guard. And then, to echo a previous post, yes - when the opposite gender finds out that you are, indeed, attracted to them, the fireworks start up.

No star here laces

06:58 / 04.09.04

The horizontal stripes are about 8 inches thick so they're not what you're imagining. And nothing can make my thighs look fat (my ass is a different story)

Tryphena Absent

16:05 / 04.09.04

I shouldn't worry too much about it all. Men often think my brother's gay because he's extremely particular about his clothes and presentation but women can always tell that he's not. Just make a path to the most flamboyant woman in the room, at least she'll get why you're dressed like that.

Now on to history-
Flamboyant dress and homosexuality have only been associated with one another for about the last 70 years. Before that men often dressed as flamboyantly as women, just think about all those aristocrats trotting about in white curly wigs and silk trousers. Personally I blame industrialisation and Paul Poiret for the change. Working class men, suddenly able to afford finery rather disliked clothes that they couldn't actually work in (hence the suit appears in almost entirely current form just before the Victorian era). Then in the 1910's Poiret opened the first major (contemporary) fashion house geared at women and made the most flamboyant and over the top clothes, paving the way for Vionnet and all of the twenties designers and thus linking flamboyance and femininity together. In the 1950/60's the camp man starts to construct, over the top and feminine designs are specifically aimed at these men and that was that really. So it seems to me that this moment in our culture is probably fleeting anyway. I mean, homosexual men have only presented as feminine for a tiny amount of time and have adopted this form of dress for that specific reason.

Around England clothes certainly seem to be returning to their usual, very slightly ambiguous state. Clearly you're dealing with a quite different culture but the same rules seem to apply (I've only been reading up about Japanese clothes though). It's also adopted Western dress pretty thoroughly, so I imagine that the same thing is beginning to happen there. I think you simply have to wait for a while and it will all sort itself out anyway.

Skeleton Camera

22:49 / 04.09.04

I agree that industrialism has a great deal to do with it - beginning with the economic divide of rich and poor, and the rich being able to afford much more sumptuous clothes than the poor (which predates industrialism, but...) Does homosexuality enter the question on the decadence train? IE - those naughty naughty upper-crusters! And it does make a convenient bogey for the salt-of-the-earth.

But this is shooting from the hip in the dark.

23:33 / 06.09.04

The gayer the better, I think. Then when you subject an unwary girl to sweaty frottage in a dank nightclub, they're pleasantly surprised.

Did you buy the leather trousers in the end, then?

No star here laces

01:55 / 07.09.04

Sax's dating secrets are revealed...

10:37 / 07.09.04

The gayer the better, I think. Then when you subject an unwary girl to sweaty frottage in a dank nightclub, they're pleasantly surprised.

And more amenable to a suggestion that you're used to doing things, err, differently.

11:29 / 07.09.04

Jefe:
"especially if they concern how I can wear my black and white horizontal stripe trousers and beret combo with impunity"

Sorry, Jefe, but the only people who can wear a beret with impunity are members of the armed forces. Have you ever thought of joining the clown army?

12:07 / 07.09.04

And mimes. They're allowed to wear berets. Though I don't think dressing like a mime is going to help you pull, straight or gay.

12:40 / 07.09.04

But think of the fun you could have miming your intentions across a crowded room. I'm sure you'd pull somebody.

13:20 / 07.09.04

That 'pushing a stationary balloon' schtick always works for me...

13:58 / 07.09.04

Duckie: fucking stationary balloons up to dance rhythms.

(with apologies to Xoc)

06:25 / 08.09.04

Did you buy the leather trousers in the end, then?

No, but I did buy some incredibly gay Bent + Corrupt jeans designed by Colin Wolfenden off that Fairy Godfathers. You'd be proud of me.

Tryphena Absent

14:06 / 08.09.04

Does homosexuality enter the question on the decadence train?

I read a bit about it when I was writing my dissertation and homosexuality definitely enters in to it. I think my source was Malcolm Barnard but I'm not entirely sure, I'll have to consult my reference cards.