BARBELITH underground
 

Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.


Underground > Conversation >

Relationships, Life, Men, Death…

  
 
imaginary mice
11:26 / 19.08.04
I’ve got a new boyfriend. I’ve known him for six weeks (it’s already my second longest relationship – hooray!) but so far we’ve only met up 4 or 5 times (okay, okay, some people would not call this a relationship but it’s quite a big deal for me). He seems to quite like me but he’s not really putting a great deal of effort into this. I send him a text message about every other day but it takes him ages to reply. Sometimes I don’t hear from him for a week. He seemed to be really eager to meet up when he came back from holiday recently but now I realise that this isn’t going anywhere. And it’s getting me down, I hate waiting for him to reply to my messages. I find it very upsetting and difficult to deal with – not because I’m madly in love with him (I’m not) but because I’m very insecure and absolutely terrified of being rejected again. I’m trying to be strong but I can’t keep this up for much longer. And it’s not something I can discuss with him because I don’t want him to think that I’m paranoid and obsessive.

I’m considering breaking up with him but then again I believe that any relationship is better than being single. I’m not too fussed about him but he’s nice, good-looking and into the same type of music as me. I’m so fucking sick of feeling lonely and only having one-night-stands. I don’t have any close friends, I would be all on my own if it wasn’t for him.

So I’ve got a choice between having a relationship (with all the ups and downs that entails – feeling really happy when I see him once a week but spending the rest of the week staring at the phone, feeling unwanted and insecure) or not seeing him again and sticking to what I know best: going out on my own and having one-night-stands (I’m used to this, I can deal with it but it’s quite depressing in the long-term).

I would of course like to have a boyfriend that was interested in me as a person, someone who wasn’t just in it for the sex.
I once had a boyfriend who cared about me, who I met up with on a daily basis and who told me he loved me. We split up two and a half years ago and I still miss him so much I sometimes feel I can’t go on any longer. He made me feel wanted. He made me feel like a normal human being. But it doesn’t look like I’m going to meet someone like him again.
And I’m trying so hard to make friends but it’s just not working. There are people I say hello to when I see them but there’s no-one I’m close to.

It sucks to be me.

So – shall I ditch this guy or hang in there?
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
11:37 / 19.08.04
Tell him how you feel first.
 
 
_Boboss
11:51 / 19.08.04
yes. if he runs after that, fuck him (not 'fuck him' obviously, but y'know) and look for someone better. he may just be a bit oblivious to the fact that he could be doing more for your relationship, and a prod'll be all it takes to make him sit up and beg.

but if not there's nuff single men around here to be looking after you, surely. come on you bloody cowards, pm the girl, what you got to lose?
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
13:07 / 19.08.04
I believe that any relationship is better than being single.

I think the first place to start is by examining this statement. Why do you believe this, imaginary mice? Specifically, why any relationship? This seems to me to be a recipe for disaster, especially when coupled with the inflexibility you display when it comes to defining what level of commitment, what frequency of interaction etc, is desirable in a relationship. To simultaneously want to be in any relationship and yet not accept one in which the other party does not necessarily make contact every other day... that way lies unhappiness.

You can have ongoing relationships with people wherein you only see each other a few times a week - it tends to mean it's not that serious, but if sex and companionship is what you're after, it can work. But you can also make the mistake of thinking that a relationship ought to be more serious than it is - that all relationships have to have some kind of deep "meaning" (mmmmm, MEANING). I've done this, and I'd have been better off just waiting for the more 'deep' relationship to come along (it did).

Still, if you decide you do want to make this one more serious, and need some advice on that front... Does he have any pets? If so, you could always try threatening his pets to ensure he gives you enough attention. If he has no pets, you may wish to upgrade to threatening his family and friends, depending on how strongly you feel about the whole thing.
 
 
imaginary mice
14:09 / 19.08.04
I don’t mind having a casual relationship and just meeting up once a week. I’m not sure if I’m ready for a serious, intense relationship and I’m quite busy at the moment anyway.
But if I send someone a message on a Wednesday asking about his plans for the weekend to see if we could maybe go out and I don’t hear from him till the following Monday then that really annoys me. If he just told me that he already had plans it wouldn’t be a problem at all – is that too much to ask for?
I know it’s not a major tragedy but there are times when I feel quite depressed and insecure and little things like that can have a huge effect on me.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
14:35 / 19.08.04
Plainly and clearly spell out to him, in no uncertain terms and with no room for misinterpretation, exactly how his delayed response to quite simple texts is making you feel. Let him know how upset it makes you. Chances are he's got absolutely no idea that his behaviour is triggering this sort of reaction in you, he's probably in a completely different headspace and might even be delaying responses because of insecurities of his own. Clear communication without any bullshit is the solution. Never underestimate how inanely stupid blokes can be sometimes. No, stupider than that. Even if you're dating a talented psychic, it's no guarantee that they will be a fucking mind reader...y'know... If you explain all of this in a non-confrontational way, chances are he'll be really shocked and surprised, stop doing that delay thing, and your relationship can move forward having overcome a small communication problem. On the other hand, if the response you get is of the: "I don't give a shit, bitch" variety then back off. You can probably do better.
 
 
w1rebaby
15:31 / 19.08.04
I don’t mind having a casual relationship and just meeting up once a week.

But previously you say

I’ve got a choice between having a relationship (with all the ups and downs that entails – feeling really happy when I see him once a week but spending the rest of the week staring at the phone, feeling unwanted and insecure)

Is that not minding?

If I may say so you sound confused about what you want - you don't want to feel too pressured but you want enough closeness to feel validated, you don't think you will ever find another good relationship so you say you've given up but you're apparently not happy with the alternatives. Unfortunately if I knew the way round all that I wouldn't be part of the Not-A-Scooby Club myself. But with sentences like "it doesn’t look like I’m going to meet someone like him again" you make it sound as if you're deliberately going after relationships which you don't want, not because you can't do anything else but because they're not with that particular person.
 
 
the Fool
22:56 / 19.08.04
But if I send someone a message on a Wednesday asking about his plans for the weekend to see if we could maybe go out and I don’t hear from him till the following Monday then that really annoys me. If he just told me that he already had plans it wouldn’t be a problem at all – is that too much to ask for?

If you ask 'what's up this weekend' and you don't hear from him till monday its a pretty clear sign he's probably not as interested as you. And I certainly wouldn't frame it as 'relationship'. Because it isn't too much to ask. its just polite to answer, even if the answer is 'no'.

I went through something really similar last year. Fell for a boy who I thought really liked me. Found pretty quickly that I didn't rank highly on his priority list. This hurt a lot. It all ended in tears, all mine. I thought we had a 'relationship' or at least some connection but I was just a shag. That was my mistake.

I guess I agree what most people seem to be saying here. Tell him how you feel. If its a no, or I don't care, then at least you know and you can move on.
 
 
RadJose
10:48 / 20.08.04
you've only met up 4 or 5 times in 6 weeks? are you sure he's even your boyfriend yet? maybe i'm old fashioned but it sounds to me as if you're still courting. i say this even for myself, no matter how far it goes physically when we are together, if i don't see her much she's not quite my girlfriend. then i again a girlfriend is very important to me, so maybe i'm biased. also he might not be a jerk, he might be forgetful and kind of a schlub, i know i am and i know that results in call backs later than i should.
 
 
Sax
11:00 / 20.08.04
Flyboy might be a thug, but he's a perceptive one and has already pointed out that this is the crux of your post:


I’m considering breaking up with him but then again I believe that any relationship is better than being single.
I’m not too fussed about him but he’s nice, good-looking and into the same type of music as me. I’m so
fucking sick of feeling lonely and only having one-night-stands. I don’t have any close friends, I would be all
on my own if it wasn’t for him.

That line about "any relationship's better than none..." that's even become a Bridget Jones-esque cliche. And that way not only lies madness, but also possibly crouching in the kitchen with bruises all down your cheek while your husband watches the football. Not necessarily the current object of your lust, but possibly somewhere, sometime, who takes advantage of people who think just like that.

The most pertinent bit is friends. Get them if you can. They're better than boyfriends, and you can even fuck them as well on occasion, and blame it on too many shandies. Don't know where you live but I'm sure there are barbeloids near you who'll go out for a pizza, a Farrelly brothers film and a Derrida jam.

And take care.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
11:16 / 20.08.04
Although before you fuck your friends, it's usually a good idea to both know what if anything that addition to your relationship is going to entail. Obviously, since people are usually drunk or high when they fuck their friends, this can be difficult, but still...
 
 
imaginary mice
13:46 / 20.08.04
I said a few months ago (there’s a post about this somewhere on Barbelith) that I would focus on making friends first before I had another relationship. I’ve got a tendency of becoming too dependent on boyfriends because I don’t have any close friends*.

So I’ve decided to make a real effort. I’ve read a couple of books about avoidant personality disorder and social anxiety, which has let me to the conclusion that I have to try and be as “non-avoidant” as possible, i.e. going out, being friendly, talking to people, accepting invitations etc. So I’ve tried to be really outgoing and positive which is why I ended up with a “boyfriend” (there, quotation marks, happy now?). And this is also why I’m quite reluctant to break up with him - because rejecting someone before you really got to know them could be classed as avoidant behaviour.

And I’ve made some progress – I’ve progressed from just having one-night-stands to having casual, short-term “relationships”. Yay me!

It’s ironic though, I’ve been trying so hard to move on and now that I’ve finally got a new “boyfriend” I actually miss my ex-boyfriend even more than I used to.

* I’ve also got a tendency of becoming too attached to someone because then I don’t have to go out and try to socialise with other people. But that’s a different problem and I’m working on it.
 
 
bitchiekittie
14:51 / 20.08.04
I just tried something totally new - I made sure I was happy BEFORE I started up with my new boy. it seems to be working...your relationsip should ENHANCE your life/happiness rather than define it.

and if he doesn't have the courtesy to respond to you within a day or two than he obviously is either a) not very terribly considerate nor thinking much of you or how you might feel or b) sending you a message that he, for whatever reason, cannot otherwise manage to articulate in a more straightforward fashion. in either case you're better off finding this out now than once you've gotten in deep with him. cease all contact with him and move right on along.
 
 
bitchiekittie
14:59 / 20.08.04
that sounds bitchy, but I think if we would all just keep from willfully ignoring personality traits that we KNOW we couldn't accept and live with at the START of a relationship, we'd all save ourselves a hell of a lot of grief over the course of our lives.
 
 
imaginary mice
15:28 / 20.08.04
I can definitely see where you're coming from but I'm not sure if I can be that picky and demanding. Maybe I just don't deserve someone better. I've been single for so long now and I'm sick of just having one-night stands, I feel I need to hold on to anything that comes my way.

I just tried something totally new - I made sure I was happy BEFORE I started up with my new boy.

I remember someone telling me the exact same thing four and a half years ago. I'm actually far happier than I used to be. And I don't think it's gonna get any better than this. If I'm not ready for a relationship now, I might as well just give up completely.

Sorry if this sounds a bit harsh. I am very grateful for all the advice I've received so far.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
15:31 / 20.08.04
Right I don't want to come down on you and you know, shake my finger and be critical but this sentence is really getting to me.

I’m not sure if I’m ready for a serious, intense relationship and I’m quite busy at the moment anyway.

A lot of women think relationships are something they must do to validate themselves. That's what we're socially brought up to believe and it's unhealthy so even when we're not really up for anything we go out and look for a partner. You don't need a relationship and you should hold out for someone you really want to be around. Busy moments will then include that person. I have a friend who never goes out with people she likes, only people she's sexually attracted to and can hold as perfect in some obscure way. Perfect instead of a person like her. Frankly it's stupid because she trails a wake of potential relationships that could have made her intensely happy and real relationships that screwed her over. When I tell her she should date specific people she looks embarassed and tells me that the men I recommend are, well 'but he's like a brother to me'. She hates her brother. I doubt you're like this but I thought you might like to hear about someone who's too hopeless for words.
 
 
Tryphena Absent
15:37 / 20.08.04
And you don't need to give up completely because you're not ready for a relationship. You may be happier but perhaps you're not in the right head-space for it, or there are other things you need to be doing. Relationships aren't the bees knees. They can be horrible and really drag you through the dirt when you're only looking for a balance in them. Relax, calm down and hang around and be a bit selfish. We all have our entire lifetimes, there are years rolling ahead of you.
 
 
Bed Head
15:53 / 20.08.04
Er, alternatively... if this one boyfriend isn’t doing enough to fulfil your expectations of the role, get a second boyfriend. Or, at least keep that option open when you’re out and about. Seriously. Until it’s making you happy, always keep considering alternatives. I think it’s possible that you’re far too committed already to something you’re not satisfied with. I mean, why should it be ‘this boy or nothing, ever’? Why not try ‘this boy, plus another one if I feel like it’? Going back to your first post, the problem you mention is you’ve got nights free.
 
 
Bear
15:56 / 20.08.04
A lot of women think relationships are something they must do to validate themselves.

Not just woman, but Anna is wise listen to her advise it's what I'm going to do.
 
 
Cat Chant
15:59 / 20.08.04
Can you explain what you mean by 'a relationship', or what 'a relationship' means to you? I ask firstly because it's unclear to me, but also because (sorry if this sounds patronizing) I think it might help you see your own situation more clearly (which is what you need to do, I guess - no matter how clearly I or anyone else think we see your situation, you have access to more information than we do).

Anyway, you seem to me to have a double-meaning or a double-think going on: you want 'a relationship' because it will make you happy, but all the options for 'a relationship' you actually cite look pretty bad for you, if I may say so. Like, "I want a relationship [someone who will love and take care of me], so I had better be in a relationship [spend all week waiting for a phone call and feeling miserable]". There's a logical flaw there, which the double-meaning of 'relationship' is enabling.

Anyway. Other people have said it, but I don't think I can stress it enough: friends. Seriously, dude, friends. And I know it's excellent when you have a boyfriend/partner who makes you feel like a normal human being, but if they don't make you feel like a normal human being even after they've gone away, maybe they were bad for you in some ways? Like, "you're only normal when you're with me", rather than releasing your capacities to be normal and happy and outward-focussed (defining "normal" here as "however you need to feel to be happy")?

Can I ask how old you are, by the way? Just because I think this problem is likely to be of a different nature depending on whether you're 14 or 40.
 
 
Alex's Grandma
17:27 / 20.08.04
Staring at the phone, feeling unwanted and insecure

A ( cough ) friend of mine was in a similar situation recently, and it's not so much fun, so you have my sympathies. Mainly, while you're staring at the phone and feeling lousy, why not open a bottle of wine ?

Don't do that, and you should be okay.

Anyway, for what it's worth - I'm guessing this guy's quite a sociable character, ie has a number of qualities you don't see in yourself ( wrongly I think - going out on your own and then home with a stranger takes a certain amount of nihilism, possibly, but also courage, as well as social ability, charm, attractiveness, that kind of thing, ) and so seems to, er " represent " ( cod-psychology - it's never so good, ) something you possibly feel you need to hang onto.

But I'm pretty sure you don't.

Either way, what I'd suggest is that rather than say, telling him how you feel - people in relationships always advise this, and they really shouldn't - you just don't call him, wait for him to call you. He either will or he won't, but at least if he doesn't, you've still got your dignity. And if that seems a bit much, at least fill up your evenings, and if that means going out every night, well so be it - anything's better than being home on your own with the silent phone, and it's implicit criticisms.

Plus what everyone's said about friends, pretty clearly.

Good luck.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
17:53 / 20.08.04
Maybe I just don't deserve someone better.

Sorry to come in late here and all that, but what the fuck?

That statement engenders two questions in me. First up, why not? And secondly, since when did "deserving" stuff ever have anything to do with relationships anyway?

I know I sound brusque... I'm a bit drunk, so bear with me. Sounds to me like you have to start thinking about yourself a bit more- and there's nothing wrong or selfish about "thinking about yourself". Seems to me like you;re trying to define yourself purely through the way others relate to you- yeah, that's part of it, but it shouldn't be the whole thing, y'know? Sure, to me, you're just words on a screen, but I'm guessing there's a whole lot more to you than that, right? Start engaging with THAT, and trying to love it. (Yeah, easier said than done, I know).

Anyway, self-help shit aside, pretty much anything logistically useful I could suggest has already been said- communication is key. Always.

Good luck anyhow.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
17:57 / 20.08.04
Oh, and (sorry for the double-post)-

I believe that any relationship is better than being single.

I know this point's been made before by people more eloquent than I, but I'll add my voice to those who say "no, it isn't".
 
 
Spaniel
09:24 / 22.08.04
This

He made me feel like a normal human being. But it doesn’t look like I’m going to meet someone like him again.

Then this

Maybe I just don't deserve someone better

And, lastly, this.

...I don't think it's gonna get any better than this. If I'm not ready for a relationship now, I might as well just give up completely.

Micey, you seem to have very, very low self-esteem. All this talk of not "deserving any better", well, bloody hell, talk about the ol' self-fulfilling prophecy.

I suggest that you listen to Flyboy, Deva and Anna'a advice, they're just trying to help you get your head a little straighter, something you seem to be in great need of.
 
 
imaginary mice
15:22 / 22.08.04
A lot of women think relationships are something they must do to validate themselves.

No, I don’t feel that way. But if you meant relationship in the broadest sense of the word (i.e. relationships with friends, family members, partners, colleagues…) then most people could probably relate to this statement. Hardly anyone would feel fulfilled and happy if he couldn’t share his experiences and opinions with other people.
I know this is not what you meant but that pretty much sums up my problem. There is a lot going on in my life at the moment and I’m much happier than I used to be but I’ve been on my own for almost 7 years now (I’m 26) and I just wish there were people in my life (or at least one person) that I could talk to and go out with. That’s what I meant when I said I wanted to lead a normal life and feel like a normal human being – I didn’t mean I would like a mortgage, a 9-5 job and regular trips to IKEA, I meant ‘normal’ as in having friends and not being completely on my own.
I’m used to being alone but I know I can’t continue like this forever. That’s why this relationship is so important to me.
At the same time there’s a real danger of me becoming too dependent on this person, which is why I don’t think I should see him more than once a week.

I believe that any relationship is better than being single.

I know this point's been made before by people more eloquent than I, but I'll add my voice to those who say "no, it isn't".

Sorry that’s me being very abrupt again and not explaining myself particularly well.
That’s just how I feel personally at this moment in time because I’m spending so much time on my own and I’m also so tired of having one-night-stands. I regard anything that lasts longer than a few nights as progress. I am quite a strong character though and I certainly wouldn’t let any boyfriend abuse me in any way…

Maybe I just don't deserve someone better.

I said this because I actually promised my ex-boyfriend I wouldn’t have a relationship again and I was totally serious at the time.
I can’t handle rejection especially if I’m rejected by someone I love – I just totally lose control. My last break-up was an utter disaster and resulted in a vicious circle that lasted for over a year and that I couldn’t break until I hit rock bottom in February and had to choose between moving on or ending my life (basically I felt horrible after the break-up, let it all out on my ex-boyfriend, then felt guilty and wanted to apologise, he kept hanging up on me, I then felt guilty about harassing him and wanted to apologise even more, I kept trying to contact him, he kept ignoring me, I felt worse and worse, thought I would never feel better unless I managed to apologise to him etc etc). I still feel horrendously guilty, it’s something that weighs me down immensely and I think about it on a daily basis.
This is why I don’t want to fall in love again or have an intense relationship. At the same time I feel I need to move on and meet people. It would probably be better if I made friends first and then had a relationship but I’m happy with my boyfriend at the moment and I still have things under control – I wouldn’t hurt him if he split up with me now.

Btw – we met up yesterday and he was actually really, really sweet. He’s just been very busy and stressed at work plus he’s a bit of a dreamer and he can be quite strange – but in a good way. It just takes him a while to reply to text messages, that’s all. Maybe it was a lesson I had to learn, I tend to get too paranoid about little things like that.

We just need to take things slowly and I will try to find friends who I will be able to turn to if things don’t work out.

(This explains why I’m finding it so hard to make friends. I’m working on it.)
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
07:42 / 23.08.04
I said this because I actually promised my ex-boyfriend I wouldn’t have a relationship again and I was totally serious at the time.

Umm... did he ask you to? If not, then I don't think it's something you need to worry about, just as "I couldn't live without you" is often gainsayed by successfully continuing so to do. If so, then he is clearly a thoroughly bad lot, and you *really* shouldn't be worried about it...
 
 
Michelle Gale
08:31 / 23.08.04
I completely sympathise I think im in a similar stution in my life at the moment.

I found Buddhism really helped, and if you get involved with a buddhist group it's a good way to meet lovely (if slightly happy clappy) new people. It aint hellacool being on your own but your the only person that can change that.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
09:09 / 23.08.04
Have you ever considered getting yourself a monkey?
 
 
Morlock - groupie for hire
13:03 / 24.08.04
Some quick points, I'll try to come back later.

My mind has been following similar spirals for a while now, but I realised a couple of things recently that you may be able to use. Firstly, a rare and long chat with my sister reminded me that it is absurdly easy to underestimate your friends. I'm beginning to realise (though not yet to understand) that I have more and better friends than I think I do. Perhaps you do too.

Secondly, forget about "deserve". "Fairness" is a fairytale. Worth telling, worth remembering, but by no means a law of nature. You say you think you don't deserve any better, sometimes; I say you don't deserve any worse, either. Why should you? Who has the authority to make that kind of judgement?

For now, look around you. People you have never met want you to be happy. Tell me what that's worth.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
14:24 / 24.08.04
it is absurdly easy to underestimate your friends

Fuck yes.
 
  
Add Your Reply