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Underground > Film, TV & Theatre >

Linklater desperately needs your BarbeCrush!

D Terminator XXXIII

07:46 / 15.08.04

Linklater. Non-sequitor?

Non! Say it isn't so!

As someone who attended the newest 'Before... movie, I'd have to say: Linklater a total hack?

Non! Say it isn't so!

As someone who was thoroughly impressed by the animation phenomenon 'Waking Life,' I wonder to myself: doesn't Linklater need love too?

Oui! Say it is so!

Let's discuss. I promise to say a bit more than I usually have the time for, if Linklater achieves the tiniest hint of BarbeNotoriety.

16:48 / 15.08.04

Um, yeah, he's cool... what is this thread about again?

Regrettable Juvenilia

20:13 / 15.08.04

My; Masculine Pepsi's many, many problems.

21:20 / 15.08.04

I'm a huge Linklater fan. Everything I've seen of his has been entertaining in its own way, and I feel like he's one of the few directors who doesn't try to talk down to his audience. He doesn't waste time creating complex plots, he allows the characters to dictate the direction of the story, and just sort of floats through events, capturing what's interesting and then moving on.

My favorite movie of his is Waking Life, though the Before duology has been creeping up. Sunrise and Sunset work perfectly together and really complete each other. In that sense, it may be the best sequel I've seen, a great movie in its own right, that also makes the original even better.

08:35 / 16.08.04

Dazed & Confused still towers above all other motion pictures like a scruffy haired colossus, that goes without saying.

Slacker also still stands out as a pretty unique and imaginative film.

Aside from that though, I've somehow or other managed to miss pretty much all of Linklater's films for some reason, despite the fact that I think he's a very fine director who made one of my favouratist films ever..

funny that. Maybe I should go watch them.

09:53 / 16.08.04

I adore Linklater. Definitely my favourite film writer.

Is his first film, "It's Impossible to Learn to Plow by Reading Books", actually available anywhere?

I've not seen:
Live From Shiva's Dance Floor (directed by Linklater)
Heads I Win/Tails You Lose (produced by Linklater)

Anyone seen those ones?

15:19 / 16.08.04

I'm a fan of what I've seen of his work, though I haven't seen that much of it. I love "Dazed and Confused" and have spent many an evening post-pub watching it. "School of Rock" I thought was entertaining enough and I could see how it successful it was as a family film. Very well put together I thought.
However I am always irritated by the fact that Slackers is really hard to get hold of in the UK. Even Amazon doesn't do it.

XXII:X:II = XXX

05:15 / 18.08.04

Waking Life is, without a doubt, one of my favorite movies. Which made me all the more incensed when, in the first year that the Oscars had a Best Animated Feature category, it didn't even get a nomination, much less the Oscar itself, which it so undeniably deserved. I think I lost whatever respect I had for the Academy after that.

Dazed & Confused I saw in college, and it made me very happy, though also quite sad, as I had an acute sense that somehow I'd missed out on a lot in high school by being a total social recluse. I compensated in college like a motherfuck, but that sense of loss was palpable. But then a shot of a young Milla Jovovich would appear, and I'd forget all that noise.

I've still not seen School of Rock or Slacker or much else of his oeuvre, but I've no complaints with the man as yet.

/+,

D Terminator XXXIII

10:04 / 22.08.04

My; Masculine Pepsi's many, many problems

You've done a boy's job sir. And after you've done telling me of my many problems, please feel free to include the many, many.

Actually, what this thread is about is the fact that I did a search within Barbelith, some time after watching Waking Life. Nada. Before Sunset. Zip. Linklater. 0. What's wrong with him?

I think I know why he might not be as initially interesting as the failed, latest mega-blockbuster, much less than the successful special effects extravaganza. It is true that his ouevre - with the firm exception of Waking Life - is not as compelling as the deeply, intellectually enigmatic Lynch movie, neither the technically mastery and perfection of someone like Fincher or the older Scott. Linklater's movies are pared down, even in the beautiful, warped Waking Life, which otherwise resembles the work of a couple of dozen animators working on their segments squarely solo. Which it also is, but which works because these are differing stages of dream we enter.

The naturalism of Before Sunset and the fact that it happened much in what most approaches real time, and the depicted resistance of making stereotypes of the principal cast makes it seem very un-cinematic, if one is to contrast against the wire-fu and bullet times abundant a year ago.

What then, makes Linklater's movies interesting?

Because they approach characters as existing people? Because they are an aberration from the majority of otherwise highly charged, highly stylised movies from the USA? Or, that Linklater and his casts are showing the way of the future? In that we also can make movies, rather cheaply, in our present times.

Before Sunset, the prior movie of which I have yet to see, struck no false notes to me. The people occupied by Ethan Hawke and Julie Delpy told so much, just by being. Or by playing and improvising being. I could, for instance, easily see that Hawke's cinematic person was lying to Julie Delpy's cinematic person. I could see that in both of their initial refusals to detail their persons' relationships too deeply, that not everything was well.

That's masterful.

10:54 / 22.08.04

However I am always irritated by the fact that Slackers is really hard to get hold of in the UK. Even Amazon doesn't do it.

Slacker (no 's' by the way, there's another film called 'Slackers' which is quite shit) was widely available on VHS a few years ago as part of some kind of "American indie masterpieces" series. There are still a lot of copies of that floating around, although I don't think it's been issued on DVD..

10:56 / 22.08.04

However I am always irritated by the fact that Slackers is really hard to get hold of in the UK. Even Amazon doesn't do it.

Slacker (no 's' by the way, there's another film called 'Slackers' which is quite shit) was widely available on VHS a few years ago as part of some kind of "American indie masterpieces" series. There are still a lot of copies of that floating around, although I don't think it's been issued on DVD..

10:56 / 22.08.04

However I am always irritated by the fact that Slackers is really hard to get hold of in the UK. Even Amazon doesn't do it.

Slacker (no 's' by the way, there's another film called 'Slackers' which is quite shit) was widely available on VHS a few years ago as part of some kind of "American indie masterpieces" series. There are still a lot of copies of that floating around, although I don't think it's been issued on DVD..

14:44 / 22.08.04

Slacker is out on DVD in two weeks, as you can see here.

As for discussion of Linklater, I'm pretty sure there was a big Waking Life thread on here at one point, but Google didn't turn anything up. It boiled down to some people who thought it was brilliant, and some who thought it was pretentious, philosophy 101 tripe, about evenly split.

Will, I heartily agree about Before Sunset. I was riveted just watching them talk, particularly the way that they would talk around issues, and you'd know that they were covering for something, even as they were talking about something else. Plus, the ending was perfect, that last moment perfectly ended the story of not only Sunset, but also paid off on a lot of stuff from Sunrise.

D Terminator XXXIII

13:26 / 23.08.04

The fact that they will make another 'Before... in some years time is reason for celebration, hey, Patrick?

("We don't have the money to buy the Oscar that Shrek has," goes the Linklater quote, and he was right!)

15:07 / 23.08.04

...that I did a search within Barbelith, some time after watching Waking Life. Nada.\

Um...

...what?

There were about a half-dozen threads on Waking Life at one point, which were eventually folded into this one—which is why the thread is a little weird and choppy. But it's definitely one we've discussed.

15:13 / 23.08.04

There have also been threads on School of Rock and two threads on the upcoming A Scanner Darkly, so I'm thinking that Linklater is not exactly The Forgotten Man that you paint him.

D Terminator XXXIII

17:08 / 23.08.04

Well. You got me there. What you gonna do now, Jock?

Sorry, Jick.

...And never searched for School of Rock. My point still stands -- one can't, simply can't, appreciate the subtlety of Before Sunset enough. Love it, dogdammit!

10:32 / 24.08.04

You see Before Sunrise and maybe you're a little cynical, maybe you wish that those kind of things did happen, that you could meet some great person on a train and wander around with them in Vienna and connect really well. After all, it seems that this kind of occurrence seems like it could happen often to these people, they're young, attractive and intelligent. We don't see their interactions with other people very much, so we don't really know if they actually appear to connect with everyone they meet on that level, or if it is as magical and possibly once in a lifetime as it appears.

Then Before Sunset comes in. I very much liked how at the beginning it was almost as if they hadn't really cared that they hadn't seen each other in years but then it was revealed just how much it actually meant to them. Such as when he denies that he turned up in Vienna and she becomes distraught about that, even though she didn't turn up.

Over the years, they have got a lot more bitter and cynical, and realized that the connection they had was a once in a lifetime thing, was totally magical, not something they would experience every other week, which maybe in their youth they thought they would.

And, oh, then at the end, when she has that song she has written about him, it's like they've been thinking about each other all those years, never got over it, and that was just somehow beautiful to me. I was deeply moved by the film.

I did wonder how Waking Life fitted in, because it featured the same characters, but even though it was a dream, even before Before Sunset was released, it was sweetly optimistic that they would end up together.

I liked the way they mentioned some of the same subjects they had talked about before, such as reincarnation, which was also something they did in Waking Life. I guess that's part of Linklater's films - the continuation and connectedness of them - how Waking Life contained many characters from other films of his, all there together.

I suppose Before Sunset has ended any debates about what happened in the park though.

16:33 / 24.08.04

Wait -- there was a sequel to Before Sunrise?

Dude.

goes over to netflix posthaste...

00:58 / 25.08.04

It's still in theaters here in the States, I think the DVD comes out in November.

02:43 / 25.08.04

I just saw Before Sunrise, It's been a while since I'd seen it and I saw Before Sunset (twice) recently and they work so well together. You can watch them in any order and they just fit. It's like Jesse was saying at his book signing (in Sunset) they're two moments that are really happening at the same time.

00:26 / 14.09.04

So, Linklater's apparently making a remake of The Bad News Bears, with Billy Bob Thornton and the writing team from Bad Santa. I haven't seen Bad Santa, but I've heard good things, and it certainly doesn't seem like they'll be producing a sappy movie.

I can't say I'm thrilled, as I'd have preferred to see him do The Smoker next, but if it's as good as School of Rock, we'll have nothing to complain about. Plus, we've still got A Scanner Darkly before this. Interestingly, I'm reading the book Spike, Mike, Slackers and Dykes, and it talks about how Linklater was a big athlete before getting into film, so this is something of a return to his roots.

09:19 / 11.10.04

Apparently Linklater is being sued for basing his characters in Dazed and Confused on people he knew, and ridiculing them:

BBC news story

14:46 / 11.10.04

oh. my. god.

You mean he didn't even bother to change their names...??

You mean.. these people are real?!? And the implication is that Dazed & Confused is, well, TRUE???

Wow.

19:21 / 12.12.04

There is a profile of Linklater on (UK terrestrial) Channel 4, tomorrow, 13th December 2004, at 20:00 - The Art Show.

17:44 / 15.12.04

IMHO, Linklater is slowly swirling around the drain. Slacker was brilliant. Dazed and Confused was excellent. haven't seen either of the Before... movies, but i would like to at some point.

Waking Life, however, was a steaming pile of horseshit. it was fucking terrible - certainly in the top 10 of the worst movies i've ever seen. Slacker is similar, in some ways, in that it basically follows a bunch of wankers talking bullshit, but Slacker knows it's a movie about stupid people and has fun with that, which is why it works. Waking Life, on the other hand, was chock full of morons talking about things that might have been profound on a bad day when you were 13, but for some reason, not only takes them seriously but expects us to take them seriously. watching this movie was like being trapped with a bunch of stoned fucktards in a freshman dorm room at 3am and not being able to escape when they started asking "deep" questions.

it is a trite, shallow, insipid, stupid movie. despite that, it somehow manages to choke to death on its own pretentions. it's like a perfect storm of crap.

really visually gorgeous, however. i recommend renting it and turning off the sound.

School of Rock was thoroughly unremarkable. not bad for what it was, but did we really need any more movies like this? Jack Black teaches kids at an uptight prep school how to RAWK. gotcha.

20:59 / 15.12.04

If you haven't seen Before Sunset, you really shouldn't say anything bad about Linklater's current output. It's the best thing he's done, and arguably, the best sequel of all time, in the way that it is not only a great movie on its own, but actually makes the first mvoie even better.

I loved Waking Life, but it does have a lot of detractors. I don't think the movie's intended to "blow your mind," it's more people talking about things that are interesting to them, giving you a little something to think about. The basic thesis of the movie, and all Linklater's work, is that there is something magical in discussion, in the sharing of ideas and feelings, and I think the movie captures that.

As for School of Rock, it's not a great movie, but I thought it was a lot of fun, in a way that almost no other comedies recently have been. I hate most movies that are just fun, like School of Rock is, but SoR managed to be fun in a way that didn't insult your intelligence, and I got caught up in the story.

But seriosly, see the Before movies, essential viewing.

12:02 / 16.12.04

The problem with "most movies that are just fun" is that, y'know, they aren't.

Creating a movie that works as a pure entertainment is like writing a catchy pop single—the end result feels light and effortless to the viewer or listener, but it takes a combintion of instinct, smarts, and tremendous craft to carry it off. Most Hollywood "entertainments"—even from reliable fun-factories like Disney—just thud along leadenly, with only the occasional brilliant set-piece to lift them up.

It's easier, I think, to make a more "complex," "challenging" film like Waking Life or the Before movies: they can afford to have some uneven moments, and there's more leeway in the timing, the pacing, the performances. Dying is easy: comedy is hard.

When I first heard that Linklater was doing a "family comedy," I really didn't think he had the chops or the focus to carry it off. School Of Rock really changed my mind. It maintained its insubstantial fizziness straight through to the end, and is, I think, easily Linklater's best-crafted work to date

12:03 / 16.12.04

Full stop.

12:24 / 16.12.04

Before Sunset is indeed amazing. School of Rock was only directed by Linklater, not written by, so maybe that is why it is not as great?

The documentary was interesting. It showed various actors who have been in his films, mainly that live in Austin, and whether or not they have been affected by the slacker ethos that Linklater apparently tries to propagate.

Wiley Wiggins, who was the main character in Dazed and Confused and Waking Life, appeared and was of course, older, and had put on a bit of weight, and although he had some great facial expressions, he seemed somehow sad. Take a look at his blog.

A girl from Waking Life also appeared, and she said that she was not working and was only scraping by. The interviewer seemed to be making a big thing of what Linklater's message was, and whether his films were just encouraging slacking, and the whole thing of not working for a big corporation and being more creative, as if it makes us more interesting people. I didn't like the way the interviewer was so determined to find some kind of over all message from Linklater's films, as if he was going to declare that "Generation X" (the book - Generation X - by Douglas Coupland was shown at the start of the documentary, and Douglas Coupland wrote the introduction to the book version of Slacker) were a write-off simply because they watched Linklater's films.

Linklater said that he used to work for a while and save up, and then not work, and just read and watch films, and then write his own, and that he did not go to film school.

The set of A Scanner Darkley was shown, and the various actors that are to be in it - Robert Downey Jr, Winona Ryder, etc.

When searching for extra details of the documentary, I saw the DVD of Slacker (Criterion Collection) mentioned, and apparently it also contains It's Impossible to Learn to Plow by Reading Books.

16:42 / 16.12.04

Dazed and Confused and Slacker are two of my favorite movies, comprising parts one and two of a near-biography of my life and/or that of my friends (see Office Space for part three). All three were filmed in Austin, Texas, where I live, and cover the experience of high school, college, and (working life), respectively, very much in the local idiom. It's quite eerie watching them. "Hey, that's the back of my apartment building... and that's the burger joint over on Burnet... and I could swear that's my roomate in that crowd shot... oh, wait, it is my roommate."

I'd be interested in that documentary. It's funny (funny-odd, not funny-haha) how Linklater's actors often seem to end up treading water rather than getting into an actual career in show biz. Wiley Wiggins worked at the Apple call center here for a long time, though I think he quit around when Waking Life was in the works. He always seemed embarrassed when anyone brought up Dazed and Confused.

Linklater does have a bit of a theme going, you must admit. The "slacker" motif is pretty prevalent. I don't know that it's necessarily a bad thing, though, and I certainly don't think his "promotion" of the slacker lifestyle is necessarily indicative of some agenda on his part. Linklater isn't campaigning, he's just putting his own life experiences and observations on screen. "Write what you know", right? Austin's a slacker town, Linklater's from a slacker culture. So he makes slacker movies. No big whoop.

22:07 / 22.12.04

(Pretending to be a UK TV guide)

Suburbia is on Channel 5 (UK terrestrial) on Christmas Day.

unheimlich manoeuvre

23:41 / 23.12.04

what Scanner Darkly is being made into a film?!? how did I miss that?

... ohh starring Keanu Reeves. (weeps copiously)