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How do you make your offerings to your Servitors?

08:28 / 20.07.04

I know this is a silly question but I really am confused.
When we offer food to a Servitor, do WE eat it on their behalf or leave it on the plate and hope that the Astral counterpart of the food is accepted by the entity

For example:

When we offer GEK milk and cookies, do we eat it on hir behalf or do we just leave the cookies out like we do for Santa?

I have always thought that by semi invoking the entity and letting it use our mouth, then we are letting the Servitor gain a semblence of material xisence and as such it can partake in the snack or offering of it's choice. I have smoked cigars for an entity called Skavan, ate biscuits for GEK and eaten fish for another entity that I created

Recently on another Chaos website , a poster with much more experience than myself claimed that when he made an offering, it was more that he left some food on his plate and offered this 'sacrifice' to the entity in question

What do you do?

thanks in anticipation of your responses

08:40 / 20.07.04

Depends on what you see fit really - what's relevant to what your doing?

With offerings in the past, I have variously:
Consumed them as a sacrament
Left them in the garden/park
Left them at a crossroads
Burnt them and kept the ash for later rituals

There's no rules or one right way, there's no way to "get it wrong" (or right), use your inspiration...

08:52 / 20.07.04

Instinct.

Being an effective magician is about developing the faculty to just instinctively know what should be done within the dialogue of magic. That's what you want to be aiming towards. Often the only way to develop that kind of intuitive sense is by having had your fingers burnt a few times. And no matter how adept you may think you are, there's always room for margins of error and always more opportunities for burnt fingers, and therefore increased understanding.

Generally, when making food offerings I would offer a portion on a plate, placed on my altar or before a representation of the entity. Then I would offer another portion inviting the Spirit to consume its spiritual essence through me as I consume its physical form. I find that tends to work quite well. But the main thing is to learn how to listen to them. If what you are doing has any power behind it at all, they will tell you what they want in terms of offerings. Half your job is to just be astute enough to grasp what they are saying and be able to act on it appropriately.

09:13 / 20.07.04

thanks to you both

actually, I am glad that you are both online at the moment as this tangent I am just going to veer off into, maybe of interest to you both

GypseyLantern and Illmatic, you were both very involved in our recent thread about Addictive Behaviours and we discussed the possibility of making an agreement with the spirit of gambling etc
I am a comics collector and my favourite is Promethea by Alan Moore. I haven't been able to get hold of the most recent issue to date and bought Tom Strong yesterday. Moore is no longer writing Tom Strong but the current story was up to his standard.

APOILERS FOR COMICS FANS, IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO KNOW, DON'T READ ANY FURTHER

Anyway in the issue, Tom was due to fly the equivalent of the Wright Brother's first aeroplane. It crashed and there were similar crash landings all over the world as planes suddenly lost the ability to fly. It transpired that the AIR spirits had made a covenant in 1904 that lasted 100 years allowing mankind to fly. This agreement was not renewed as the spirits were surprised at how quickly mankind had advanced in air travel and our polluting of the atmosphere had had disasterous effects on their own existence (there were other issues but that is it pretty much in a nutshell)

Tom Strong had to meet the Air Spirits and broker a new deal, though he was only able to get them to extend air travel usage by 20 years. It was an excellent story and I must say that it was very similar to our thread that we were involved in last week

Illmatic, I am sorry I haven't added much else to that thread but I was offline from last week until yesterday due to my confused 'marital' status at present

As for your comments about SERVITORS, I am sadly unable to successfully astral travel and my only communication with a Servitor was the sensation when I last asked GEK for help, that ze was saying "I would prefer something savoury to the sweets you are offering"

I took this little subconscious voice to either be a bona fide message from GEK or possibly my own unconscious kicking in and saying "You haven't got a sweet tooth, have a cheese buttie instead"

Thanks for your input and advice

11:33 / 20.07.04

As for your comments about SERVITORS, I am sadly unable to successfully astral travel

Who mentioned astral travel? If your entities can only communicate with you when you are "astrally projecting", you might want to find more adaptable entities. I said instinct, which is a more crucial aspect of a magicians skillset than proficiency astral projection. That none verbal alsmot synesthetic sensation that you picked up on during Spirit dialogue is what you want to be refining. Be sensible about it. Don't get into obeying imaginary voices in your head or anything daft like that. But when your talking to Spirit, learn how to tune in and instinctively fathom what they want, what their mood is, what vibe their sending out. It's a bit like subconsciously reading someone's body language. And the more you do it, the better you get at it.

On the astral projection thing, don't worry about it. I can't astrally project either, but I can shamanic journey, which is a slightly different procedure. I think they both more or less accomplish the same thing, but use a different operating system. Parallels to Mac versus PC. Get yourself a decent shamanic drumming tape from amazon. Get yourself some white sage. Open ritual space in whichever way you prefer. Light sage and smudge yourself and the room you are in. Lie down comfortably on the floor. Listen to shamanic drumming tape on walkman. Let the drums and your imagination take you to the shamanic upper or lower world, perhaps using the visual metaphor of climbing a tree or descending down a well. Have a look about and see what's there. Don't try to force anything. See what arises of its own accord.

Repeat the excercise regularly, taking a note of all results. See if any Spirits come forward and see if you can get them onside as allies. Once you get the technique down it can be applied in a variety of ways limited only by your imagination. Do a search for old threads on "shamanic journeying". There was a lot of great material on this a few years back, when we had people like Lothar Tuppan posting regularly. Seth's posts on this subject are really good as well.

11:49 / 20.07.04

I too amd puzzled where the astral stuff came from? - I think GL's advice is sound but just to be snipey, re. I can't astrally project. Well, you can bloody well practice, can't you? *

*And if this thread thurns into another "well, I tried to do it once, and failed, oh I'm useless, I tried it again three weeks later but was interrupted by the noise of a milkfloat, woe is me" I will come round your house and KILL YOU, thus rendering you projected permanently.

12:13 / 20.07.04

As far as Gek is concerned you're supposed to eat it yourself.

12:21 / 20.07.04

On a more pacfistic note (I won't really kill you, Joe)* I think you can pick up on these kind of sensations in other places? Anyone else any experience this? I defintely feel I am aware of distict atmospheres in Churches. I feel the same about ritual spaces, on my own and with others. I think this is something anybody can tap into without being especially "psychic" - makes me wonder if in fact, psychicism is simply related to noticing what is going on around you, and accepting subjective impressions.

*though I may want to.

14:12 / 20.07.04

Yeah, I would say that's what psychicism is, or at least a branch of it. Doing lots of Spirit communication tends to make you a lot more aware of "atmospheres", sometimes bordering on psychometry where you can almost pick up impressions from objects and places. You could easily make a case that it's just cultivating an increased awareness of what's going on around you and picking up on things that people normally miss.

14:43 / 20.07.04

Funny. Just found this article by Louis Martine on Silverstar Magazine -
Talking to God with Food

It's more about the ethics of animal sacrafice than what we've been discussing here but it may give you something to reflect on, Joe

17:58 / 20.07.04

Gee whillakers

(I hope that spelling is correct!)

Thankyou SO much for all your replies. Impulsivelad Adventures..........cheers for your advice about GEK

Illmatic and GypseyLantern........again thanks for your input. I am a bit worse for wear as my girlfriend and I have been out today and are trying to at least be civil if not totally reconcile. I am a bit 'squiffy' as a result but your comments have been noted and are most welcome

Astral projection was me projecting........I have read on numerous occassions, how people have these wonderful PERSONAL connections with their Servitors................

me I am struggling to accept the validity of magick, let alone , having conversations with entitities that part of my brain is telling me are at best, little more than aspects of my own fugged up brain

thanks for all your kind words

Joe

10:05 / 21.07.04

First off, my sincerest sympathies on the girlfriend situation. No amount of occult experience makes that sort of thing any less difficult or confusing, I can tell you...

Astral projection was me projecting........I have read on numerous occassions, how people have these wonderful PERSONAL connections with their Servitors...

But mate! Gah! Fuck! Am I speaking in fucking martian!! You don't have to ascend onto some astral plane and perceive and interact with a visual Dreamworks Studios image of an entity in order to have a close intimate and personal relationship with it. "Speaking to God with Food" is an excellent term for describing how very real dialogues can take place through a variety of mediums. You could have a very personal relationship with an entity that takes place entirely through the medium of art and painting, for instance.

me I am struggling to accept the validity of magick, let alone , having conversations with entitities that part of my brain is telling me are at best, little more than aspects of my own fugged up brain

You're going to struggle with this stuff until you've done loads of it and eventually get yourself connected up to something mad and powerful that starts working for you. It doesn't happen overnight. It takes hard work and personal investment. Sacrifice and effort. The benefits are often hard won. No such thing as a free lunch. And other such cliches.

But there is no reason why you should "believe" anything beyond the evidence of your five senses. Perform experiments in occultism. Suspend your disbelief for the duration of the operation itself. Note all observations and results in your journal. Set yourself a period of three years. If by the end of this time, you have had experiences that prove to your satisfaction that these operations are having a beneficial effect on your life, and that there is some essential truth behind the obfuscations of occultism, then reaffirm your practice and start a new journal working from that new altered perspective. If by the end of the three year period, you have proven to your satisfaction that it's all a load of bollocks, knock the whole thing on the head, take all your books to a charity shop, and take up something more rewarding like embroidery or realistic martial arts.

10:28 / 21.07.04

sorry GypseyLantern

You are not talking Martian, in fact Illmatic, Yourself, ImpulsiveLad Adventures, Seth, Doctor Beck and numerous others have been most kind.
I am a coward by nature but I have dabbled with Servitors, Sigils and written out agreements with Spirits

I was mentioning on another board that I frequent that my Sigils have worked but not to the exact letter that I wanted.
For example I wrote out seven Sigils, to see things that I would not usually see in my day to day life. Nothing major but strange enough for me to go "well that is unusual"

I had no idea which three of the seven I cast or launched (whatever your preferred terminology) but some strange things happened

One of my Sigils was to see the Red Arrows. Not something you see every day. The strange thig was that I never actually saw them. A couple of Sundays ago, Pauline phoned me at my parents and said "it is the Wirral Airshow and the Red Arrows have just flown overhead"

I never saw them but I heard them and got phone confirmation of their fly by

Another Sigil was to see a blimp/airship

a week or so later I had forgotten something for work and had to get a taxi home to pick up keys etc. On the way home, via a different route than i usually take, a hot air balloon was taking off.....again not something I see more than say once per year. The funny thing with this was that whilst I meant to write blimp or air ship, I have a sneaking suspicion I wrote hot air balloon by mistake

Now I know none of these are earth shattering or even remotely interesting but it was the closest I have had to validation of magickal effectiveness or I should say the nearest

10:57 / 21.07.04

Interesting results. I'll leave you to draw your own conclusions.

Your post gives me a bit of pause for reflection– most people with an interest in magick as beginners seem to only want to know if it’s “real” – do odd things happen that contradict the dominant science based models of our culture? I think people sometimes focus on little weird phenomena at the expense of some of the other meanings, models and metaphors to be found in occultism. In your three year neophytehood, remember that there’s other stuff – eg ask yourself, does the concept of Thelema as expressed by Crowley mean anything to me? What the fuck does he mean anyway? Does the concept of “free belief in Austin Spare’s work give me any tools for negotiating with my current difficulties? Does the sense of connection spoken of in relation to ancestor worship speak to me? And so on. It’s not necessarily the Buffy the Vampire slayer type phenomena that’s important.

And stop saying shite like “I’m a coward by nature” It’s really beginning to piss me off.

10:58 / 21.07.04

Joe: sounds like the sigils worked alright to me. The results weren't earth-shattering, but neither was your intent. To Gypsy Lantern's list of cliches, let me add: "Keep up the good work."

~L

11:58 / 21.07.04

okay

but in agreeing to stopping saying it, I am just showing that I am scared that you might come around and kill me

bloody double binds

thanks folks

my most recent Sigils have been for bigger things but the whole lust for result thing keeps popping into my head. At least I have no idea which of the 6 or Sigils I constructed have already been launched. I will keep you informed as and when the results manifest

(was that more positive?)

17:57 / 21.07.04

Nice work, Joe. Sounds like your sigils did indeed work - what exactly are the Red Arrow, pray tell? A team of acrobat pilots/jets?

04:17 / 23.07.04

How do you make offerings of your servitors?

07:27 / 23.07.04

I don't understand? Do you mean to other beings....sort of sacrificing a Servitor to a God...something like that?

Is that what you mean?

Oh and FinderWolf.....yeah, the Red Arrows are an air unit that perform displays.....they release smoke and fly in formation etc