Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.

Underground > Film, TV & Theatre >

The Secret Agent

Tryphena Absent

15:20 / 15.07.04

There's a programme about an undercover journalist going in to the BNP and exposing them being broadcast tonight that I'll probably watch. I thought I'd start a thread about it here. I saw some excerpts on Newsnight yesterday and frankly I just thought that the journalist who posed as a member seemed ridiculously brave.

16:05 / 15.07.04

I've seen a few clips on the news and I shall be watching it tonight. I agree he does seem ridiculously brave but I'm sure he'll feel the outcome was worth the risk. I shall post more after having seen it but I'm pleased to hear that there is the possiblility of prosecuting some of the leading members of the BNP.

06:15 / 16.07.04

I've had a bit of involvement with this, on the periphery, due to the anti-BNP journalism I've done in Bradford in association with the TUC.

What astonishes me is that anyone's actually surprised by what's in this documentary.

ONLY NICE THINGS

06:30 / 16.07.04

This is a thing - there seems to be a general feeling that people vote for the BNP "by accident" - and that if they are shown that it is a racist party full of thuggish halfwits led by jowly neo-nazis that they will wise up and stop voting for it. I'm not so sure that's the case. I suspect that the BNP gets most of its support precisely *because* it is a racist party.

Nick Griffin's subsequent interview on Newsnight afterwards was interesting - it's amazing how many lies you cna get away with if nobody challenges you on them. I was wishing for a Paxman there...

11:09 / 16.07.04

I believe that the upsurge in the numbers voting for them has been because they changed their public image to one that wasn't overtly racist and they'd distanced themselves from their violent past. They're a respectable party now don't you know or at least they were until this documentary proved otherwise.

The problem is that the people who should have watched the programme are probably the people who didn't watch it. Viewers were likely to be the people that suspected the truth of the BNP anyway and merely had their suspicions confirmed. Possibly criminal convictions will go some way to further discrediting the BNP.

11:41 / 16.07.04

it certaily dominated the BBC's newsoutput last night tho' - 9pm to 10pm the show itself, 10pm-10:30pm main item on the 10 pm bullitin - 10:30-11pm One of the main stories on Newsnight - with BMP leader Nick Griffin espousing his distrust of Islam.

11:48 / 16.07.04

So what were the revelations? Sax's post suggests that it was just presenting information which should be bleeding obvious to anybody with half a brain, which is what I expected and why I didn't bother watching. BNP in racism shocka?

The Natural Way

12:12 / 16.07.04

I don't think people vote for the BNP by "accident", but I do think people are more than capable of conveniently erasing knowledge from their minds, in order to make their decisions more palatable. Just as many racists begin a tirade with the words "I'm not racist, but...."

Regrettable Juvenilia

12:15 / 16.07.04

The thing I found really disturbing is that some of the things being said that we were (rightly) invited to find appalling are virtually identical to the opinions of the current Home Secretary - "if they want to live here, they have to speak English all the time", and so on.

Tryphena Absent

15:23 / 16.07.04

Actually the interesting part for me was the guy who's been ringing Searchlight for years.

I also think that you're putting a lot of faith in people. I was talking to a girl from Preston about six months ago and she was going on about 'how racist the Asians are' and how difficult they make life for her. Now what she was describing was pretty racist but she was making some pretty awful anti-immigration comments based on a few lone experiences- didn't seem to realise she was being racist too. Perhaps someone like her, possible BNP voter might not realise how extreme they are and would be put off by a programme like that- after all she was stupid enough to use a sentence like the one above in the first place. Why wouldn't she be dim enough to vote for them?

Our Lady Has Left the Building

12:26 / 17.07.04

I'm fairly sure that Mark Collett, the guy who describes immigrants as 'cockroaches' was the guy from the BNP youth wing a few years back who got exposed in a similar TV show for his views. He was going to stand for some sort of election, possibly National Union of Students, possibly council, but was recorded by this documentary maker making rascist comments and anti-Semitic comments and so Nick Griffin chucked him out because he 'wasn't representative of the party'. If it is him he obviously didn't stay out in the cold too long...

08:21 / 20.07.04

Flowers - you're quite right! Mark Collett was shown on a Channel 4 documentary saying that he would rather have lived in 1930s Germany than in Bradford. The BNP claimed that he had been expelled but he was back within days. See here.

I suspect that the BNP gets most of its support precisely *because* it is a racist party.

You might be right, but I think that persistently reiterating the "handful of extremists" line is a relatively useful strategy anyway. It does also seem to be the case that a fair proportion (if not a majority) of BNP supporters aren't aware of the nature of the party: one of its elected councillors in Burnely wasn't.

They all wore suits and spoke about the things that were concerning people I knew too. I really thought they were the silent voice... They had some very strange ideas, but they would never say them through fear of being exposed. I began to realise it was all a big con, then I realised I had contributed to the shaming of Burnley... I had absolutely no idea that the BNP did not care about Burnley at all.

(Links are to a .pdf of the 'tabloid paper' that Searchlight used to campaign against the BNP in the local elections).

ONLY NICE THINGS

11:47 / 20.07.04

You're probably right - I just find it very difficult to believe that anyone could be *so* naive as to believe that the BNP is not a racist party. Then again, my understanding of what constitutes racism is not apparently general...

One thing that I found again not surprising but worthy of remark was just how stupid the BNP are. First up, by allowing "Jason" that much access without even attempting a security check, and also by believing his woefully unconvincing football hooligan schtick. Also, the scenes where they are shown discussing the campaign for local office, and cannot get the guy to focus on any of the issues rather than his warpo fantasies. Hopefully this, along with the fact that, when elected, BNP councillors are utterly useless and as such are a wasted vote, will deflate their momentum. I don't know, though - should the mainstream media and parties be confronting them or ignoring them? Or, you know, baton-charging the fuckers.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

12:40 / 20.07.04

I think that the race baiting being done by the Conservatives and the Labour party in recent years has gone a long way to making people think that if mainstream politicians are "allowed" to use it then it's alright to vote for the BNP or pillocks like Kilroy (MEP for Leicestershire how embarressing can you get I nearly moved), there seems to be a surge to the right going on in Britain at the moment.

The C4 documentary had Collet running for local election I believe. A friend of mine had a run in with him at Leeds Uni, he overturned an anti racist stand she was working on and threatened to have some of his female cohorts beat her up. Nasty little shit.

It's a shame I missed the programme actually.

Tryphena Absent

15:08 / 20.07.04

also by believing his woefully unconvincing football hooligan schtick

Hmmm but don't forget that he posed as a football hooligan on another assignment and convinced them so it makes an absurd kind of sense.

16:56 / 20.07.04

You're probably right - I just find it very difficult to believe that anyone could be *so* naive as to believe that the BNP is not a racist party. Then again, my understanding of what constitutes racism is not apparently general...

No I think it is a lack of understanding of the level of political awareness of the electorate in this country.

I think generally the people of the UK are far less politically aware than the users of this forum. It doesn't surprise me in the least that there are many people who are unaware that the BNP is a racist party or even come to that a right-wing party.

I think it's probably possible to just invent a political party and spout any old bollocks that appeals to people at a local level and get as many votes as the BNP.

06:22 / 22.07.04

I think it's probably possible to just invent a political party and spout any old bollocks that appeals to people at a local level and get as many votes as the BNP.

...like the UKIP?!

Can't believe taxpayers money went on this frankly. I'm waiting for the day they send someone in undercover to the Vatican to expose the truth - the Pope is Catholic!

Our Lady Has Left the Building

12:29 / 22.07.04

Quite how Labour and the Tories think it's acceptable when they use the phrase 'illegal immigrant' instead of 'asian' or 'black'...

13:22 / 26.07.04

I've just had another dream (making only two in all, but still) about the BNP since I saw this - me and my gf were "undercover" attending a BNP day conference sort of thing. Which had a craft fair. Then when we were waiting for the bus home we met this other woman who had also been "undercover" there, and who was black (I've only just noticed that that's a bit implausible). Hmm. Anyway, sorry for pointless post - I just wish I could work out why this documentary clearly bothered me enough for my subconscious still to be working on it two weeks later.

Tryphena Absent

13:54 / 26.07.04

I think it was quite effecting- the guy who was ringing Searchlight with information was clearly in a dangerous position and doing something incredibly worthy. Mostly though it's quite upsetting to think that a group like that is allowed to exist. Sure it might be practical and mean that it's traceable but it's just really sad that people say these kinds of things and mean them. Weirdly I was thinking about this earlier today and wondering how people can believe that Britishness means anything at all. It confuses me. I have this urge to sit down with these people and ask them what they actually mean because all I hear is 'we need to take back our Britishness' and it's a sentence I don't understand.

The resistable rise of Reidcourchie

13:55 / 26.07.04

Could it be your worried about the impact of facism on basket weaving?

Our Lady Has Left the Building

10:10 / 14.12.04

The leader of the British National Party has been arrested as part of a police inquiry following the screening of a BBC documentary.

In July, the BBC documentary Secret Agent featured covertly-filmed footage of BNP activists. Mr Griffin is the twelfth man to be arrested following the documentary.

Our Lady Has Left the Building

13:58 / 17.01.06

Griffin's trial begins.

14:22 / 17.01.06

we met this other woman who had also been "undercover" there, and who was black (I've only just noticed that that's a bit implausible).

As if they wouldn't notice a black woman running a stall at the BNP craft fare - the very idea!

Our Lady Has Left the Building

15:49 / 02.02.06

Shit-heel not guilty.