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Scary bit of horror. What humanity can do to itself.

 
 
Digital Hermes
16:53 / 18.06.04
I came across this horrifying story, and it made me really think about not just the human capacity for evil, but also the culpability of the 'net.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20040618.wxtholly0618/BNStory/Front

Just in case the link doesn't work, try googling Michael Briere or Holly Jones to get the story.

In the trial, the murderer makes a speech as to his own shame in doing the act. Is this him trying to soften his prison sentence, or someone who honestly was horrified of himself?
 
 
Cailín
19:50 / 18.06.04
Having followed this story since the day Holly went missing, my objectivity may be lacking. However, Briere's shame seems largely fabricated to me. I'm sure he's horrified that he got caught, and was forced to admit every little detail about what he did to her, but if he was so horrified about what he actually did, the act itself, I think he would have broken earlier in the investigation, like when the police went door-to-door asking all the men in the area for a DNA sample (Briere refused). The discussion of his shame does raise a significant issue within our legal system: why are feelings of shame or guilt considered at all relevant in sentencing in this type of crime? Bad feelings do not negate the damage done, and Briere's sense of guilt after the fact does not make Holly's final hour any less horrifying.
As for our capacity to do this to ourselves and each other - I don't feel the suggestion that child porn on the internet prompted him to do it has any validity. A significant portion of the population views porn on a regular basis, and while I agree with the advocates for children that kiddie porn has to be attacked and eliminated, it is not to blame for the actions of anyone. Those who enjoy a little BDSM online do not typically go out and abduct people to be their submissives.
We all have crazy urges from time to time, to varying degrees. When we do not act upon them it is because we have the ability to distinguish between right and wrong, and empathize with our fellow humans. Michael Briere was, by many reports, a divorced loner, and maybe that's part of why he did not stop himself - a lack of empathy bred in self-imposed isolation. It certainly is not an excuse. But I refuse to believe that any intelligent, relatively sane human being lacks the capacity to understand that raping and strangling a little girl is wrong.
 
 
Jack Denfeld
19:09 / 20.06.04
why are feelings of shame or guilt considered at all relevant in sentencing in this type of crime?
It's related to rehabilitation. If the guy shows no remorse, or brags about his crimes in court, then it may take longer to rehabilitate him. If he shows some remorse, then at least he understands what the civilised world expects, and that's a start, so maybe he doesn't need to be rehabilitated that long.
 
 
Whale... Whale... Fish!
21:28 / 20.06.04
Agreed. Isn't rehabilitation ment to be the outcome of any sentence? I find it unfortunate that we live in a society where the justice system is viewed as a sytem for revenge. This, however, does not take away from the appauling act he committed.
 
 
Digital Hermes
23:37 / 20.06.04
I should probably say, Cailin, that I don't blame the 'net directly. Thing is, he did go directly from on line, to perpetrating the crime. I think I'm speculating on a less blame-level approach. Socially, in how our minds may be adapting to extreme amount of 'net use, is if there might be low-level self hypnosis going on, an unbelievable desire to get what you want. Hell, much of the fame of the net is based on the fact that you can get whatever you want, chances are, it's on-line.

As scary as it is, I'm sure there are many child-porn fans who get what they want and never desire to hurt a fly. For most, there are immediate social checks and moral boundaries that keep someone from enforcing their sexuality on people at random. To go in the direction of vague, most people, no matter their predilection, simply don't have it in them to do something to the scale of evil as what Briere did here.

I guess, to sum up, is it possible that the 'net's ability to give us what we want may be creating, particularly in those ensconced in technology and the net, (as Briere was) a strong selfish desire to simply take?
 
 
Joetheneophyte
09:59 / 21.06.04
I don't blame the NET as such though obviously , due to supply and demand, kids who are shown on those sites have suffered to provide these pics, so even the armchair paedo is not entirly blameless no matter what they claim.The NET is a quick and easy way to satisfy this demand.

The fact that the Paedo's are willing to pay for this service IS impacting on children somewhere,ie those used in posing for the pictures.

Good points have been made about people controlling their urges. I am sure there are people out there, attracted to kids who restrain themselves and control their urges.
They are probably terribly conflicted individuals who cannot reconcile their sexual urges with their morals....I actually have pity for those individuals as it must be awful to suffer these cravings against your will.

on a sliding scale we then come to those people who view this stuff over the net and buy magazines and videos
etc

Not actually partaking in the activity themselves, they nonetheless are guilty as without them paying for this stuff, no kids would be abused in taking these photos etc
So they are guilty of hurting children vicariously.


Then we come to the one time offender, who might have touched up a child and been racked with guilt. Guilty still but still deserving a little sympathy if they are truly sorry for their act. Sadly we tend to lock them up with repeat offenders and in the climate, they often become worse as they group together and justify their actions amongst themsleves. When they are released from prison they have plenty of contacts and swap vile material amongst themsleves, they are also better equipped to avoid detection and less likely to admit to their maladaptive behaviour, owing to their support system,

The man you mention is the worst type.....a predator.....totally evil and for the most part, beyond redemption or treatment. No psychiatric treatment can help and as such the only recourse is to monitor his whereabouts at all times. Remorse is usually feigned or short lived as the urge to re-commit an act builds

What scares me is that whilst there is a sliding scale of offenders and if you have kids it is reasonably understandable, the mob mentality that ensues whenever there is a suspicion of somebody having these tendencies, frightens me as much as the existence of these paedos.
worse, as soon as such an accusation is made along these lines, the person is guilty before any investigation has taken place. That truly frightens me


Imagine being wrongly accused and all those idiots kicking shit out of you for no reason and teh stigma attached to you forever


In the case of paedophiles, I think that the LSD research of Timothy Leary should be re-investigated. Leary claimed he could alter somebodies sexual preference and in view of the fact that no other treamtment seems to work with people who sincerely want to alter their sexual preferences, I cannot see the harm
That said monitoring would still need to be continued because the Predator type paedophles are notorious liars and would report improvements and alterations in their attitude just to avoid suspicion
 
  
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