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EURO 2004/Servitors and empowerment

11:56 / 18.06.04

Recently there was a discussion about the definitions about Egregores, Servitors and Godforms. ImpulsiveLad Adventures, kindly explained the definition of an Egregore and evidence that I have read since has confirmed entirely everything that he said, namely that Servitors can gain in power and eventually attain Godform status but because they are launched by an individual, they cannot become an Egregore as these are usually the product of a group working.

This made sense and I know that this is all semantics but my original belief was that Servitors could become Egregores if they gained sufficient power and again, if still growing exponentially, they could gain Godform status

The Fotamecus stories on Chaosmatrix.org seemed to follow my original paradigm that Servitors could become Egregors and then Godforms.On re-reading, it might have been that the original Fotamecus creator passed on the Fotamecus Sigil to his friend at a crucial stage in its' development and as a result, it was empowered by more than one person and thus attained Egregorehood or even more possible that the definitions are blurred and nobody can truly say how much power or at what stage an entity has attained whatever status

I have recently developed a Servitor for my own use and dependant upon the paradigm that we follow, I have been thinking of various ways of adding more power and thus more effectiveness to my creation.

To date, I have only discussed the Servitor with two or three other people and this has been with people not likley to bother in attempting to use or empower my creation.

I have made a Sigil out of the name of the entity and stuck it on numerous screens in local pubs, where people are watching Euro 2004. This is I am hoping will catch some ambient 'gnosis' power and thus help my entity boost it's power and effectiveness

Any other ideas on how I can further empower my servitor and whether if I share his name, do you believe he might still be effective?

Thoughts please?

12:00 / 18.06.04

I ALSO MEANT TO SAY THAT even though I know entities like GEK can be used by others.....my creation ORIGINALLY was for me alone. I have no problem with modifying his abilities to allow others to use him but I want to wait to see whether I attain results as he is now first, before casting him out to the general Barbelith populace

He is a darned good looking fella and I suspect he is working alreadfy in a minor way.....hence my wanting to give him a boost

12:20 / 18.06.04

namely that Servitors can gain in power and eventually attain Godform status but because they are launched by an individual, they cannot become an Egregore as these are usually the product of a group working.

Well... I personally think that's a fairly inane statement with loads of dumb gaping holes in it. But I'm not getting into all of that again so soon after last time.

12:32 / 18.06.04

Sorry if my statements and questions are or seem silly....I admit my lack of knowledge and whilst I know the subject was broached in the last discussion, we never really got to a consensual opinion (that I could see anyway......... BUT I admit my ignorance)

12:45 / 18.06.04

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, just as I'm entitled to think their opinions are stupid.

13:04 / 18.06.04

For clarification - if you think about the depth of history, disparity of belief, the variety of meanings and uses, that lie behind any God, the way they are bound up with the histories, ontologies and philosophies of Nations and Empires, you might get a sense of why Gypsy disagrees. God are a bit more than "a load of people decided to pump power into it" IMO. It started as an egegore, ended up as a god, doesn't seem to capture the degree of complexity involved.

Having said that, trying to be a bit more helpful, you might find an essay called the Cyberzoo by Dave Lee useful - it's on Phil Hine's site somewhere. I just had a look but couldn't find it.

If I wanted to power an entity like that I'd just make sure it got worshipped regularly, had a physical base or altar, a carry around totem etc and got thanked acknowledged, and fed with attention and offerings on a regualr basis.

(off topic - sorry to be a hater, but I always disliked that Formatecus story - not the bulk of it, but the bit at the end where it says it's going to "kill time". Sounds like a load of bollocks to me. I wonder if Fenwick Rysen is indulging in a bit of self mythologising).

trouser the trouserian

13:34 / 18.06.04

Servitors can gain in power and eventually attain Godform status

Okay, so there's these two shepherds and one's complaining "Y'know, I'm really sick of that Ben Yusef from across the way nicking my lambs. I'm gonna create a servitor to smite him with piles every time he comes near my flock."
"Cool" says the other, "could I use it to stop them damn Cannanite used-donkey salesman eyein' up my daughter?"
"Okay, here's what we'll do. We'll inscribe the instructions on a stone tablet and stick it up near the well. That way anyone can feed it energy and it should get bigger and nastier".
"What shall we call it?"
"How's about Yah-Way?"

Time passes ... cut to a tapas bar in downtime Haifa:
"I've been working with this servitor-thingy, Yah-weh."
"How's it going?"
"Not bad. I smote my neighbour with a plague of frogs the other day."
"Wicked!"
"Well actually, it was just one frog, but it got under his floorboards and kept him awake all night croaking."
"You know, I've a bunch of mates who'd be interested in that. How could we feed it more power?"
"Well, we could meet regularly - say Thursdays .. hold on, no Thursdays is all-in stoning night ... best make it Wednesdays and do chants and stuff. Hey, maybe if we slaughtered some oxen..."
"Why don't we call ourselves The Cult of Yahweh?"

... and the rest is just time, energy, and some over-enthusiastic P.R by some half-Eygptian guy called Moses.

14:01 / 18.06.04

THANKS

I remember now Gypsy's comments about such. I actually agree in my limited knowledge. I believe we tap into something already there and put a human face or virtues on said entity.

cheers for the info much appreciated. What did you think of the idea about placing Sigils on TV screens?

You might think it is nonsense as it was partially based on the Fotamecus idea of sucking up ambient Gnosis. I have no idea whether this could conceivably work but when everybody shouted ROOOOONNNNNEYYYYYYY!!!!!! as the little potato head scored for England last night, I couldn't help but feel the energy level of the pub boost incredibly. Their was a palpable raising of energy that was quite startling and my little Sigil was sitting in the bottom corner of the TV set

I don't know whether this is possible or valid but it gave me a boost thinking that all this energy was on the way to my little creation

14:14 / 18.06.04

again I understand that this is how you percieve Sigils to work

Whether they are 'charged' or embed themselves in the Unconscious

I like the idea that all this ambient Energy is directed at either the TV and my sigil, or via my unconscious via some vampiric energy redirection

14:25 / 18.06.04

absence of Gravitas....that was great

made me smile

14:33 / 18.06.04

So are you saying that Wayne Rooney is actually your servitor? Well done with that one, mate. How do you get him to do that little cartwheel thing? Is it something to do with gnosis?

14:35 / 18.06.04

ha that was the easy part

I said listen Wayne......if you score a goal, there is a pastie, a custard slice and a can of Fanta in it for you

the little bugger scored two and I spent a fortune in Sayers

14:57 / 18.06.04

The role of the pastie in occultism has often been down-played by writers on the subject. There are in fact records in the British Museum that suggest Dr Dee and Edward Kelly channelled a whole system of Enochian Quabbala based around different types of pastie. From Cheese & Onion to Meat & Potato the aspirant ascends, refining the soul through the rigours of Cornish, and overcoming the challenges of Chicken & Leek to arise triumphant within that state that is Pure Archetypal Corned Beef Pastie and on through the triple veils of Limitless Pastie. Kenneth Grant has written extensively on the subject of the Nightside of Pasties, wherein terrible Qlipphotic entities may plunge the hapless explorer into a phantasmagoria of Steak & Kidney Pudding.

15:07 / 18.06.04

a truly horrible fate I agree. I believe the Demon in charge of the shell in question is GoblinBoilinthePanz

if you reach this HELL, you are in real hot water

trouser the trouserian

15:23 / 18.06.04

Was it not the sublime Stewart Home who summed up magick by saying (on channel 4 a few years back) "Magick is when Arsenal win at home!"

23:02 / 18.06.04

Anyway, enough of this thread rot.

If you'll allow me, I'll just re-route this conversation back to the original subject of pasties.

It seems that the pastie is the great global unifier. The glue that binds civilisation together. Every culture has its pastie. England is rich in pasties. Jamaica has its own pastie. India brings us the samosa and bhaji. China the spring roll. All pasties in their own way.

Interestingly, there are certain parallels that can readily be made between the formula of the pastie and the operating system of the hoodoo gris gris bag. A number of potent and symbolic items encased within pastry and consumed as a holy sacrament. Is the Catholic wafer not, in its own way, a form of pastie. The body and blood of Christ, with ale and stilton, served in a light pastry casing.

Pasties. Last best hope for peace? Or something more..

The Knights Templar Boogie Machine

23:36 / 18.06.04

I really like the sigils on tv idea... There are a few threads lurking around the temple related to such ideas( sigils in porn mags etc). Theres a lot of energy raised in those mini satori moments when a goal is scored, and it seems that the fuckers near me don't know what the hell to do with all that energy anyway and spend their time chucking bins down the high street whether their team loses or wins.I think persistence with such things may acheive some form of fourth dimensional construct, but as to the nature of the sentient qualities it would possess is another matter...

13:44 / 19.06.04

Funny coincedence

remember the Fat Les video Vindaloo and the ENG ER LAND John Barnes song?

Also you may remember the THUG storyline by the Comic Strip Presents years ago on Channel 4 (UK)

well Keith Allen the actor who starred in these and seems to have made a living playing the English thug abroad allegedly slept with an ex girlfriend of mine. We were just about to get down to the body mingling and I asked her why she had a picture of the admittedly charismatic but in my opinion not good looking Mr Allen on her wall

'oH.....him.......I shagged him'

I wasn't bothered but she also tried to get off with John Barnes but he wouldn't bother with her

isn't it a small world

then again, several of you on here have probably slept with her as she was pretty promiscuous but still a cracking girl, if fugging nuts

Goodness Gracious Meme

22:00 / 19.06.04

It seems that the pastie is the great global unifier. The glue that binds civilisation together. Every culture has its pastie. England is rich in pasties. Jamaica has its own pastie. India brings us the samosa and bhaji. China the spring roll. All pasties in their own way.

Gypsy, I expected a more nuanced understanding of the specifics of cultural traditions from you.

Leaving aside the dangerous reductionism inherent in 'all pasties in their own way', I'm particularly concerned with your inclusion of the bhaji in this list.

That's a rather facile reading of the composition of the bhaji, which in no way connects to the pastry/filling, inner/outer dynamic that is at work within these other artefacts. The bhaji is, by contrast, precisely a non-dualistic entity, and should be worked with as such.

tsk tsk

14:03 / 25.06.04

I'm sure by today England's Egregore has taken a pasting and is flying their flags half-mast.

20:55 / 25.06.04

Portugal's worshippers, on the other hand, were raucous as far away as the streets of Canada; hence the egregore, fed and spurred by numerous traditional offerings of beer-laced vomit, the honking of car-horns and the waving of huge nunbers of flags was no doubt sitting fat and happy on this side of the pond, and I can only imagine the frivolous destruction wrought Iberia-side.

08:18 / 26.06.04

the problem with the English Egregore was that with Beckham ...it is more of an Ego-grebore

I was sick of him telling us day after day what great shape he was in and yet he was crap for most of every game I watched him

He clearly wasn't fit........he cannot tackle and the one thing he is good at (set pieces) seem to be beyond him at the moment. Losing Rooney was a huge blow. Just as Owen found his feet, we lose the only player who looked like he had the talent to make goals from nowhere. On a positive note, Rooney and Owen look like they could form a good partnership in future

Gerrard was disappointing for the most part and I bet Chelsea wished they had negotiated his deal a little later as from the evidence of his Euro 2004 performance,they may have got him for a lower price if they had waited

Erickson's substitutions seem more and more bizarre but we were unlucky with the disallowed goal.
Beckham did have some bad luck as the ground did look very dodgy near that penalty spot but for me, he has been atrocious and nowhere near world class

(then again, I hate the posing bastard anyway, so I am biased against him)

at the end of the day, it is my my belief that England just aren't good enough.....simple as that. we scored one goal then backed off. Rooney has been phenomonal (as much as it pains me as a Liverpool supporter to admit) and I have nothing but respect for the potato headed little fat whack

Owen and Gerrard mostly disappointing but the former at least was finding his feet in the last two games...that one two that produced Rooney's goal against Croatia was beautiful and boded well for the future. Owen's goal against Portugal was a piece of brilliance

Portugal deserved to win.....Ronaldo is a cheating little prick and Deco falls over more than Beckham but the quality of play was better and I wish them well in the tournament

10:15 / 29.06.04

Did you see those Swefish footie fans that had Beckham Voudoun Dolls?? Shocking stuff indeed!!!

10:15 / 29.06.04

Did you see those Swedish footie fans that had Beckham Voudoun Dolls?? Shocking stuff indeed!!!

12:36 / 29.06.04

you are joking!

I am a scouser and whilst the illustrious Mr Beckham got me annoyed by being a former MU player......I hate him more for his amazing ability to con the footballingwordl that he is a world class player and more than a one trick pony

Let's be honest. He is a fantastic crosser of the ball, reasonable dribbler, CANNOT TACKLE AT ALL

he is a good player but hardly world class......in fact I believe Ferguson was correct......he is much better than average but no bigger than the top 6 clubs in the Premiereship and his primma donna actions are more and more annoying

At hs level and his position, I think that whatever his private problems, he should be able to get past them when playing football. For the money he is getting and his position as Captain, if he cannot handle the stress, then maybe he should re-evaulate his position

I am not being an asshole.....no matter how much I think Beckham is a dickhead

I just cannot stand somebody living off self promotion and past glories (listen....I used to love Gene Simmons of Kiss so I know all about this!)

Anyway, if anybody had a voodoo doll it was probably me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!