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Narrative Magic experiments

 
 
Skeleton Camera
22:03 / 11.05.04
(Woo, I'm on a roll tonight! Just spent six hours helping a friend construct a life-size spaceship for an installation piece...probably affected my head somehow.)

I've been thinking about language recently, and from these thoughts have come several narrative efforts. Language (per many late-nite manic discussions) exists as a nodular network intertwining space and time. I do not define space and time as separate dimensions, ultimately, but our perceptions of them and our perceptions of ourselves within them are usually separated from one another. Language connects us to various points within each one, forming our 'reality tunnel.'

So every instance of language exists as a node, uniting concepts or events (abstractions or concrete happenings) to others within the X-Y of spacetime. Language then is a sort of Z axis. (Help me out here, this isn't dogma, but the fruit of several conversations and any expansion would be GREAT.)

So I began to apply these ideas. I spent several weeks writing a third-person narrative of my existence, up to this point and continuing in broad strokes into the future. To make sure it worked I interwove as many details - names, dates, events, etc - as felt necessary, and then logically extended those into the immediate and distant future. So far the results have been good, with the most immediate extentions already occurring.

The second project was more recent. I began a question-and-answer session with myself, forcing the Q and A to question each other, determine who was speaking which part, and how they existed in relation to the phrases "you", "I", "me", and my name. At times this has been disappointingly premeditated, but it also has revealed a sort of center-point - similar to the "director" idea mentioned in the Theater and Shamanism thread. I'll have to add more to this as this one progresses because I can't give a solid debrief of it now.
 
 
Skeleton Camera
14:13 / 12.05.04
More on this:

Language is a nodular net binding the manifestations of spacetime. The role of manifestation here is key, to differentiate from the broad concept of spacetime - a set of dimensions in which events or manifestations occur. Language effects the manifestations itself.

Experience => image => symbol => glyph => letterform

I'm sticking to written language for the sake of this discussion as it seems verbal language is another depth to study. They're not separate occurrances, I think, but they're in opposite directions from a central principle.

Any use of written words is an establishing of signifiers. These connect whatever is signified to the context in which they were established. I look at the bookshelf right now: all sorts of titles. Each of those words has been printed on the spine of the book in order to convey a summary of the contents. But each of those words also pulls at my particular associations with the words itself, and creates a fusion between my subjective associations and the subjective intentions of the printer. Whether or not they DO relate to the contents of the book is irrelevant at this point.

So all these interconnections form a huge network. Narrative magic works within the network, cross-referencing various established nodes until a new node can be inserted that references a potential event or manifestation. Shorter version: you use a system of references to set up the 'context' for a new reference. You make this new reference and insert it in the existing references. That reference will then manifest to complete the net.

Any thoughts?
 
 
Chiropteran
16:32 / 14.05.04
Sorry I let this sit for so long before responding.

This is making little clicking noises in the back of my mind, but I don't have any fully-formed comments quite ready to go. I would really like to hear about your projects in a little more detail, though, if you don't mind (i.e. if you can do so without revealing anything too personal/still pending results, etc.). I'm particularly interested in the Q&A -- could you give us a forinstance to illustrate what you mean?

This is an area I used to be very interested in, but I've let things slide for a bit while exploring off in other directions.

Good luck,

~L
 
 
Mug Chum
05:00 / 21.06.04
Buddy I'd just like to add that I don't know if there's any magical effect that can occur with your experiments (I've tried similar things, like Grant Morrison), but there's a semiology of great proportions, on a almost artistc vein. That was pretty cool. Ever read Saussure, Baudrillard, Peirce? Maybe you'd like them...

If you could write more about it, it be alright... I was interested on someone else's experiences on "how to" on narrative magick.

Read Alan Moore's 'Promethea'... The last 'Animal Man' that Grant Morrison did. 'Flex Mentallo' and 'The Invisibles' by GM as well... Or at least read something about it on the internet... i think you'll like it.

thanks.

Sparrow
 
 
Joetheneophyte
05:43 / 21.06.04
I really like the idea of the third person narrative taking you into different directions. Have I uderstosdd that correctly?
Were you saying that you wrote your own future and then the fates/Universe/Higher you brought those experiences into existence

That is some scarey but exciting shit. Please give us mopre details and how they hae overlapped

I am genuinely excited by the possibilities here


cheers
 
 
Perfect Tommy
01:45 / 26.06.04
Verry intriguing, Seamus. I'm especially interested by the fact that you seem to be taking language magick out of the realm of pure 'narrative magick' (literomancy) and getting at a more fragmented 'word magick' (logomancy, I s'pose).

I think the reason that poetry works is that you have words working in many dimensions at once: along the denotation axis, along the connotation axis, along the narrative axis, and along the various sound axes (like rhyme, consonance, etc.). I suspect that slamming words together in such a way that they 'line up' in some other way than linearly might be interesting. You'd have spoken incantations that sounded like the lyrics for 'Come Together.'

Although, you're talking about writing, so perhaps the visual appearance of words on the page becomes more important than the sound of the words—'rough' is more connected to 'bough' than it would be in speech, for example.
 
 
Skeleton Camera
13:00 / 26.06.04
This thread's back! Nothing like incubation...so let's see here...

These were experiments in semiotic magic. Gary Snyder noted magic was "the power to transform through symbol and metaphor." If our 'reality' is defined by the markers we lay down - ie, language - what happens if you rearrange the markers?

It sounds like everyone wants more detail here, instead of the theory behind it. The Q & A session was akin to interviewing myself.

Q: How are you doing?
A: Fine.
Q: No you're not.
A: You're right, I'm really feeling good right now.
Q: Why?
A: I just woke up and had breakfast. I'm going to visit a long-lost friend soon.
Q: Have you been feeling good?
A: This week was pretty good but I went through a deep depressive point this Wednesday.
Q: Who is "I" by the way?
A: Seamus' authoritative voice, the voice used to answer questions.
Q: Are there any other voices in there?

And so on. As this went it on it would alternately wrap around itself, pulling my sense of self and communication into a spiral, and expand outward, revealing new facets I had not previously named or recognized. Most challenging was admitting candid thoughts, having to put them down in words. If Q would say "What are you thinking right now?" and the response was one that I didn't want to admit, it was genuinely difficult to have to write this out. And then I would have to figure out 'who' this was... it became alternately very stimulating and very frustating.

The other project, the third-person narrative, was scary and exciting shit. It was an attempt to write my own future. I took the most specific details of my life, beginning objectively (names, dates, facts such as those), and gradually added on details that I wanted to manifest. This was frightening and I grew more hesitant as it progressed. For one, I am trying to cultivate spontanaeity - and writin' your own future is imposing structure. So I kept the details open and sometimes vague - indicating what I wanted to happen, such as a future job position, without indicating where or how it would happen.

I was also frightened of what sorts of results I would get. There was a strong "tampering with the universe!" feel to this project, which is (at this point) much of what I was overcoming. The project in and of itself was an expansion of personal boundaries as well as semiotic magic.

The two projects didn't overlap greatly. If anything, the Q&A project was part of the 'deconstruction' phase taking place at the 'present time' dealt with in the narrative. That time was the foundation for 'what comes next', and the Q&A was some final deconstruction and rearranging before the rebuilding.

Amen to the note on poetry! I've been writing a lot of poetry recently and it does have a multi-layered nature that reminds me of the best visual art (I say this because I've studied visual art). Those many layers allows for a real magical power to poetry. I'm trying to take my work in a devotional and invocational direction and from the little feedback I've gotten, so far so good! This is key to the 'reconstruction' phase I'm now entering - unifying my various interests, particularly magic/spirituality and art/writing, into a juggernaut of personal and social power... (That sounds bombastic!)
 
 
Joetheneophyte
13:30 / 26.06.04
Wow

Please tell us more. You say it was frightening to write your own future, how so?

besides your fears of messing with the Universe

was it that it was working too well?


Moore and Morrison have both commented about how things they have written (particularly Morrison with King Mob) came true in his own life


Please keep it simple for me as I struggled with some of the replies on here. I am astounded by the level of thought and knowledge on here....truly exciting and yet I feel inadequate conversing with people who intellectually leave me for dead
 
 
--
14:46 / 26.06.04
Yeah, the whole hyper sigil thingie... I have some experience with the third person thing as last year I wrote a long book intending it to cause change in my life, as I was one of the main characters (not ton mention a female fictionsuit representing me)... Now months later I have a new job, have met some interesting new people, blah blah blah. Certain aspects of the book haven't manifested themselves yet in my life but this is due to laziness on my part and I'm working on it. I can't really say that it was a scary experience however.
 
 
adamswish
10:13 / 29.06.04
Perfect Tommy - I suspect that slamming words together in such a way that they 'line up' in some other way than linearly might be interesting.

I'm guessing (and by all means correct me if I'm wrong) that the cut-up system used by Boroughs and Bowie is a way of creating this "non-linear" narrative. In Boroughs' case the result was jarring mental images conjured up by the descriptions where as Bowie creates the more verbal/aural(sic) side of it.

Seamus - If our 'reality' is defined by the markers we lay down - ie, language - what happens if you rearrange the markers?

I've always maintained that it take three people to create 'reality' through language. The example in my head runs along these lines:

Person 1: How do you tell what is a cow and what is a tree?

Person 2: Easy, you get milk from a cow and leaves from a tree. Why do you ask?

Person 1: Really, because I was told it is the other way round and trees give us milk and cows have leaves. Wonder which of us is right?

Person 2: We'll ask Person 3. Hir will know which is which.

Now my contention (and apologies for the silly metaphor, that's how my brain works) is that whatever Person 3 says, or whoever hir agrees with will create the reality.

One of the reasons I love my disinfo "Fuck consensus reality" t-shirt.
 
 
Skeleton Camera
19:46 / 29.06.04
Adamswish: "I've always maintained that it take three people to create 'reality' through language."

GOOD point! We (I?) take the idea of consensus reality for granted, but that's its insidious power. It is NOT an objectively existing manifestation. Memes are not born from nothing, but from the interaction of (minimally) two carriers. Three and the meme becomes virulent.
The 'inner dialogues' one has or the 'different voices' in your head, arguing various points or giving you commands, are imprinted aspects of consensus reality - ie, the nodes of language planted as references in your brain. When they connect with other nodes they are activated, and you 'hear' or 'think' something. (This is not my definition of thought; take it in context bitte.)

NeoJoe: My fear of the hypersigil (third-person narrative) was that, if I messed with the Universe, HOW would my various directives manifest? This in turn made me keep them broad in the writing and, looking back, pull some punches I should not have. It's neat to have a broad-scope vision of my life written down, but now for the details!
There was also the fear of "challenging destiny" or "altering fate," somehow. This I now recognize as preprogrammed and designed to impede me. I wrote the hypersigil during a time of intense personal crisis and near-breakdown. It was an attempt, and so far a successful one, to give my life some order and direction (as well as pin down what memories I had about what events). That crisis, though, also made me frightened of what could occur through this work. (This same fear of "what if" has undermined much of my work.) And yet, interestingly enough, a large part of the narrative's purpose was to get me out of that crisis. It's a long-term thing, and I haven't read it since completion, but I do see it beginning to work.

Your comment, though, makes me think I should try some short-term narrative workings.
 
 
Joetheneophyte
06:19 / 30.06.04
THANKS FOR THAT

My own life is going down shit street alley, so I might give that a go myself

Really interesting and I will do my utmost to keep my own directives broad and not too restrictive. Thanks for the input and post, very interesting


Joe
 
 
Perfect Tommy
06:42 / 30.06.04
I'm guessing (and by all means correct me if I'm wrong) that the cut-up system used by Boroughs and Bowie is a way of creating this "non-linear" narrative.

Oh, sure! I was thinking more along the lines of composing these non-linear narratives. Now, I don't know much about it but I always figured the cut-up method was more for divination. Although, I suppose one's choice of source text could direct the cut-up in a particular direction...
 
 
Joetheneophyte
07:55 / 06.07.04
Seamus as you know I have embarked on this little adventure myself. At present doing such work is difficult as I am staying in my mum and dad's and privacy is at a premium

Thanks for the ideas. I was particularly impressed by the other workings you mentioned, using visuals as well as narratives.......it is not my place to pressurise you but I am sure that some others on here would be genuinely excited at your other ideas about meta-programming and Magick (the girl who came into your work and fictions suits etc)

Thanks for a wonderful and truly exciting thread

I hope I haven't stepped over the mark recounting a little of our private conversation but I believe you have really done something worthwhile here


Joe
 
 
Skeleton Camera
20:50 / 07.07.04
Per the last message.

I began a comic in January of 2002. (For reference: I knew nothing of magic, fiction suits, or The Invisibles at the time). It was the first one I intended as a "serious" work. From this intention came three titles that I didn't understand at the time but sounded like working ideas. I draughted these down and began to flesh out each story (one for each title). The result was a three-episode 16-page book, largely freewritten (a lot of sitting in clubs and the library letting ideas pour out).

The stories all focused on a late-teenage girl named Sam, who was vaguely an alter-ego character. Each story also involved some circumstances of my own life: a family death, a 'meditation' of daily activity, questions of androgeny. The strongest narrative of them all was a story I had heard from a family member, that I then projected Sam into and fleshed out.

(Copies of this book, self-published w/ one spot color, are still available if anyone wants it...)

That spring I followed it up with a sequel, much less intensely done. It was more of a pastiche of influences: Joyce Carol Oates, Tori Amos, other comic authors, and my own ruminations, but still using Sam and her story-world as a foundation. This one I worked through with a professor to get a more coherent narrative structure, and wound up being less impressive than the first. Part of the challenge was dealing with three different timelines, each overlapping and supposedly complementing each other. It wasn't much of a success in my own mind, so I saved the money and didn't self-publish it and didn't think much of it afterwards.

Until I sat down to write a third book, last summer. This was after the Invisibles had rekindled my interest in comics, not to mention deranged my world and introduced chaos magic into my life. I read of Grant's experiences with the King Mob fiction suit and decided to play with that. I was in a hot, tumultuous job situation at the time with a lot of repressed anger towards my co-workers. So I wrote a third comic, consciously using Sam as a fiction suit now, putting her in the job situation. This was a much more linear story than the first two, and it ended with an "epiphany" moment as I wanted to have. Out of the three this was the most conscious of the books and the one I deliberately spiked with the most personal detail. It took several months to finish (ink and all I mean).

Before it was inked, though (pencils were done), Sam showed up at the job.

She walked in with a boyfriend figure who didn't much resemble the comic's figure. But she herself was IDENTICAL to the character. Save for a blue wig (underneath which was identical hair, however). The job was a restaurant in a tourist town; lots of coming and going. She walked in, ordered, ate, left. Made eye contact with me a few times, a smile or two. No words.

Much of that summer was heat-addled, especially at the job. Heat's been known to make me hallucinate before and I don't doubt that this, and the stress of that day (big), were factors in the experience. But it wasn't JUST my own loopiness.

That's one of the strangest things to happen so far.
 
 
Joetheneophyte
06:37 / 08.07.04
Thanks for sahring that with us Seamus

I have started a very rough comic book with myself as the main character. Whilst very slap dash, the likenesses are okay and the story is flowing easy enough

I am hoping this will allow me some of the same opportunities your narrative workings have done for you


thanks for all the ideas


Joe
 
 
FinderWolf
13:09 / 08.07.04
Cool! I gotta get back to writing some hypersigils...
 
  
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