Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.

Underground > Temple >

Bush/ Magick/ Protective spells

06:38 / 24.03.04

On another thread it was discussed that the White House might have it's own psychic/Magick defence unit

Sort of Norad for incoming sorcery

Do you think there might be any truth to this?

I actually do believe that there are Magicians and Mages employed to ensure that the White house etc is shielded from such attack.
Most of our Leaders are high initiates in Freemasonry or Rosicrucian orders and it is not too far a stretch to imagine that these lodges are at least conversant with Magickal matters (in fact don't Rosicrucians I have been led to believe, believe that they are the masters and in control of their own destiny....thought into action etc.....i don't know as I only have very limited knowledge of their beliefs)

Anyway, how do you all feel about this issue, do you believe that Bush is protected by his own personal Magician or coven?

Has anybody ever heard any stories of such?

Information in formation

09:24 / 24.03.04

I don't have any documentary evidence to back this up, but it has been suggested to me from a number of people that I have talked to that The Nazi SS had within it's ranks a division of black magicians. And from my own readings I have noticed the influence of Theosophy in a lot of the rhetoric spewed out by Hitler durring his unpleasant tenure on this planet. I have also read that durring the second world war the groups that formed from the ashes of the G:.D:. waged a campaign of magickal attack against the Nazi war machine, however for the life of me I can't remember exactly where I read this.

Joe, if you want to find out more about the historical roots of Rosecrutianism as well as its various manifestations throughout western culture I would suggest you find a copy of "The Rosecrutians" By Christopher McIntosh. it's not too difficult a read, a little on the accademic side, but quite informative. It took me about 2 weeks to get through, but I read slowly. Other good books on Rosecrutianism are "The Famma Fraternatis" and "The Chemical Wedding of Christian Rosencrutz" I believe that Holmes Publishing puts these out, I like that publishing company a lot. They put out these small volumes of obscure Occult stuff. They are all quite affordable and, I believe can be ordered direct from the company. It would not surprise me to learn that the US government employs magicians, after all the country was founded by high level Freemasons.

10:08 / 24.03.04

Anyway, how do you all feel about this issue, do you believe that Bush is protected by his own personal Magician or coven?

Joe, I doubt it.

I think it's got a kind of imaginal truth about it, the same way The Invisbles had. What I mean by that is that his administration is so fucking evil and scary, that they might as well be black magicians. The metaphor fits but as for the reality, no.

Why complicate matters? If you really want to see some occult works of horror, try and get your head round the the GATS agreement or the machinations of the WTO.

If he's got any spritual back up, it'll come from the millons of fundamentalists praying for him. Tho' I think he's fallen out with them a bit lately, because of not being sufficiently right wing.

*shudders*

13:19 / 24.03.04

Whether or not there is a crack squad of tactical magi on the beeper for the president, it has occured to me that there might very well be an egregore or similar entity that has coalesced around the office of the president (and/or the G.O.P. and/or the Skulls and/or the Bush (et.al) Dynasty) that might act to protect Bush (or any president) from magickal attack whether or not Bush or anyone in his administration knows about it on a conscious level, or would even want it. It has even been suggested (though I can't remember by whom - GM as part of his Corporate Magick rap?) that there is a mighty big egregore which arose from The United States of America itself (beginning with the founding fathers), which might have a default protective disposition towards the president (whomever it might be).

I say "default," in that case, because -- in the entirely hypothetical instance that one might wish to launch a magickal attack against the U.S. seat of government -- it might (just might) be possible to deal with the egregore (or whatever) to convince it that the re-election of the current acting president is not in the best interests of The Nation as a whole. If it could be convinced on this score, then it might be willing to at least 'look the other way' while the hypothetical magickian puts the whammy on the re-election campaign (or whatever).

The same might be possible in the event of "White House" or even "Bush Dynasty" egregori, because in each case G.W.B. has come out as a 'black sheep' that has given his elders and advisors cause for alarm.

GM's work with Corporate egregori could concieveably work as a model for working with National or Government egregori (though one should probably be working from heartfelt patriotism in seeking to remove politicians that they believe to be damaging the country).

Of course, anyone who (hypothetically) would take magickal action against any branch or aspect of government would do well to shield themselves thoroughly against any backlash (even if only from the prayers of flag-waving fundies).

In theory, of course.

:|

~L

Skeleton Camera

13:38 / 24.03.04

This brings up an interesting idea that some friends and I were kicking around this summer:
(note: I'm really sick right now, so this may or may not be coherent)

By the time the US was created North America had presented itself as a "blank slate" to the Enlightenment philosophers in Europe. Many of these philosophers were Masons and had a direct role in founding the US. In doing so they were creating their ideal society, one that would function on the principles of the Enlightenment and Masonry.
This was huge, pivotal in fact. Rarely if ever in history have people had the opportunity to create a culture and society virtually from scratch.
So the creation of the US was the creation of a giant meme - or egregore, as mentioned by Lepidopteran - that has vociferously perpetuated itself over the past 200+ years. But it is currently at a danger, and possible death, stage in its existence due to the change in technology from Enlightenment scientific industrialism to the more chaotic computer/information world.

Sometime I'll flush this out more thoroughly...

02:07 / 28.03.04

I always thought that if anyone tries it on with the seat of US power they'd come up against Astaroth, as that's supposed to be the entity that's assigned to America.

Britain has Mammon. Wether or not you believe this is upto you but i'm pretty sure that the two i've just mentioned get regularly fed with energy from various places that we'll never personally know anything of.

Funnily enough, Astaroth is said to be dual in nature and sex and is linked to Venus on the feminine side, my ruler if i take the Taurus star sign to be fact. I don't.

I wouldn't be foolish enough to tackle the US government with magic unless i had at least 3,000 skilled initiates, and i'm talking skilled.

I don't however, so i steer clear of stuff like that, but i'd say that with sheer numbers casting at the same time, a group of Whitehouse protectors would be pretty much fucked, just make sure your making the right decision, you raise shields, and have your own entities on your side if you end up taking action of your own.

02:27 / 28.03.04

There has been research into remote viewing within the NSA and CIA. Whether it is a viable usage of intelligence collection is debatable. Bush as well as other high ranking people converge on bohemian grove every year to sacrifice "care".

hmm

06:59 / 28.03.04

Yeah I heard about that, that Alex Ross fella at InfoWars.com infiltrated the park didn't he?

Danny Glover the actor and loads of former politicions were supposed to be present.

Two things struck me as strange

1. Security could not have been that great for Ross to get in so easily

2: Why the heck would you want to sacrifice 'care'

Is it their own worries the Bohemian Grovers are sacrificing.....as in, symbolically destroying their worries, once a year?

Or........... is it 'care' for other people?

The Grovers make out that it is harmless ritual and just a way for very rich and influential people to vent off and let off steam....but as most practitioners on here know, when you amass that many people and energy, surely an effect or that energy is going somewhere (?)
Maybe some of the people there are just innocent and going along for the ride but I suspect there are forces their, utilising this amassed energy for their own ends.

I think Alex Ross is generally a little bit too conspiracy minded even for me (that is quite a statement, believe me)

But I do definately think there is more to the Bohemian Grove thing than just a rich boys hideout. I know a lot of people ridicule David Icke (even Alex Jones has done in the past) for some of his more bizarre theories but in his books, there is interesting and verifiable info.
He did a good bit on the Bohenian Grovers in I think the Biggest Secret

I do not subscribe to all of Icke's views (and to his credit he never asks you to) but he does make some good points and I wouldn't throw the baby ot with the bathwater just because I don't agree with everything he writes.

07:00 / 28.03.04

sorry for thespelling mistakes (their/there)

09:28 / 28.03.04

[Just a quick sideline - Joe - if you do make spelling mistakes or typos and you'd like to fix them, all you have to do is click on 'moderate post' and edit what you said. A couple of moderators will quickly glance over your changes - just to make sure that you're not completely changing your argument to make someone else look stupid - and then everything will be fixed and sparky.]

09:41 / 28.03.04

cheers

thanks for the advice

Joe

17:31 / 29.03.04

Crowley addressed this issue somewhat obliquely in Magick in Theory and Practice:

"A body of black magicians under Anna Kingsford once attempted to kill a vivisector who was not particularly well known; and they succeeded in making him seriously ill. But in attempting the same thing with Pasteur they produced no effect whatever, because Pasteur was a great genius --- an adept in his own line far greater than she in hers --- and because millions of people were daily blessing him. It cannot be too clearly understood that magical force is subject to the same laws of proportion as any other kind of force. It is useless for a mere millionaire to try to bankrupt a man who has the Bank of England behind him."

In other words, you and your friends may cast a spell to oust Bush from the White House, but millions of people are willing that he remain there. While it's doubtful that many -- or even any -- of these people are magicians per se, many of them (politicians, media people, etc.) have almost indescribable power and influence over how our current consensus reality is defined.

In many ways, a U.S. presidential election, and all of the media and legal hoopla surrounding that election, is a more-or-less overt magical battle between competing groups over how reality will be defined for the next four years.

18:46 / 29.03.04

So instead of directing a magickal attack at the president per se, what about attempting to sow confusion and consternation amongst his supporters? Magickal agit-prop, underlining for each (group) all the reasons why the current president isn't all that they really want, dulling his popularity and approval rating, and hopefully negatively affecting voter turnout (on his behalf) whilst hopefully also boosting the opposition. And, while powerful, the media can also be very fickle -- just as a powerful directed force can be pushed off course with a very slight lateral nudge. Direct assault on the bastions of High Elected Office doesn't seem like the way -- small, well-placed magickal 'hits' intended to confuse or spread divisiveness -- and damage credibility -- are more like it. (The assault on the Death Star comes immediately to mind. I'm such a geek...)

The magickian who wishes to meddle in electoral politics need't try to destroy their target, nor do they need to try to change everybody's minds -- they only need to do just enough to swing the election (including the electoral vote -- yes, Shanghai Quasar: specifics!).

One can also join the millions of people (again, mostly not formally using magick, but still a number of powerful people) ALL OVER THE FRIKKIN' WORLD who want the U.S.'s current acting president out of office -- including many who consider him personally responsible (fairly or not) for the deaths of loved-ones and the destruction of their homes, and therefore have a lot of heavy energy directed his way every waking moment, and often in their prayers... Interesting point -- think about it: there are two large religious groups (especially the fundamentalist branches) striving on either side of B*sh, one for and one against (though I doubt that the Islamic fundamentalists are exactly "pro-Kerry," they're certainly "anti-B*sh"). How will this clash of spiritual forces affect things, if at all?

So, while the Republicans have a lot of support in this country, they're facing (psychic, magickal, religious) opposition from just about everywhere else -- and even where this opposition is really more "anti-U.S.," the president is still the most obvious (and hated) individual figurehead.

Just thinking outloud.

Have fun, everybody.

~L

Bard: One-Man Humaton Hoedown

19:59 / 29.03.04

I think I was the guy who brought this one up a while back.

There are some essential problems that I see with "attacking" US politics with magic has several factors.

First, as far as I know the founding fathers of the US were, or at least most of them were, Freemasons, and may well have put something into place to prevent this sort of democratic tampering, not nessecarily by anarchists, but very possibly by their opposite numbers in Britain.

Second, the President is a heavily, psychologically entrenched position in the US, meaning that mystical attempts against it are going to go up against some heavy consensual flack from all the people, especially those Southern fundamentalists and the like, who feel that the Presidency is a nigh-unto-holy position.

Third...you gotta wonder how the Spirit of America would feel about the change. I've wondered how that would work, or what a country's spirit/zeitgeist/whatever would want or how it would react to a magically powered regime change. Would it assist, if the leader was bad for the land and the people, would it resist becuase the leader is its symbolic master? I'm not great with "spirits of the place" outside the urban, and occasionally roadway, scale, so I really don't know.

Skeleton Camera

23:47 / 29.03.04

This raises the question of danger in political work. It's been covered how most politics is magic of some sort, especially elections and the swaying of popular opinion, but to enter hardcore magic into politics... In a brief discussion a friend and I had about this, this friend admittedly being more skeptical and reserved about such things than I, he raised the point of the Nazis and their use of occultism - as a deterrant for magic in politics.

But what exactly does this mean? One one hand, the Nazis were heavy into magic and its certainly helped perpetuate the Nazi meme. But it also may account for the rapid rise and rapid collapse. Of course it's been discussed that said collapse occured when Hitler turned against the occult world in the form of Freemason lodges etc.

19:22 / 31.03.04

In many ways, a U.S. presidential election, and all of the media and legal hoopla surrounding that election, is a more-or-less overt magical battle between competing groups over how reality will be defined for the next four years.

I think that if you're willing to accept that pop-culture magic works, then by extension, you have to accept that stuff like this has a degree of magical clout behind it.

Surely it would make more sense to focus your efforts on local Governers and the various relatively small fry political figures who nonetheless make decisions and have responsibility over areas of government. As opposed to the big symbolic figureheads.

14:40 / 08.04.04

To divert the thread slightly toward the topic of spirits or egregores which might play a role in the history of nations (particularly the U.S.), I offer (FWIW) the following account of the (much later) first president of the United States, George Washington, when he was a young colonel in the French and Indian War - the article was printed in the magazine The Living Age in 1852, but the passage is quoted from an earlier source (a history by Bancroft):

“I expected every moment,” said one whose eye was on Washington, “to see him fall.” Nothing but the superintending care of Providence could have saved him. An Indian chief – I suppose a Shawnee – singled him out with his rifle, and bade others of his warriors do the same. Two horses were killed under him; four balls penetrated his coat. “Some potent Manitou guards his life,” exclaimed the savage. “Death,” wrote Washington, “was leveling my companions on every side of me; but, by the all-powerful dispensations of Providence, I have been protected.” “To the public,” said Davis, a learned divine, in the following month, “I point out that heroic youth, Colonel Washington, whom I cannot but hope Providence has preserved in so signal a manner for some important service to his country.”

Like I said: FWIW. Make of it what you will, but the suggestion is at least there that Washington enjoyed some sort of magickal/spiritual protection even at a young age (and then went on to be this country's first Executive Chief). I would be interested to find similar accounts from the American Revolution, if they exist.

Whether this has any relevance to the original focus of the thread (the presidency of G.W. Bush, and magickal defenses thereof) is another matter entirely, but I figured this was as good a place as any to mention it. Anyone feel like starting a new thread on Magick, Masons, and Nation Building?

Meanwhile, Don't Get Caught!

~L

Epop Bastart the Justified, I

19:45 / 17.04.04

I think it's fairly obvious that, functaionally speaking, a lot of people in positions of power are magicians. I don't know that they call it that, and I don't know that they need to, but they often have a lot of mojo.

Look at Churchill and squint a little.... if you met him down the local pub at a gathering of sorcerors, would he look out of place? Or somebody like Karl Rove who's constantly making up realities for other people to believe in...

No messing around.

I'm a mason, and for whatever reason, the rituals do work. The opening and closing of a lodge does have a magical effect which is palpable, although a lot more subltle than even a simple banishing ritual done solo. It is feasible that the Founding Masons (a subset of the founding fathers, to be sure) did ritual to lay the magical foundations of the country?

Quite possibly.

Then there are all the oaths sworn by people like Soldiers, and Oaths of Office... all basically magical in effect, if not in intent.

And, finally, I'm sure that at least some of those folks as conscious, wilful magicians - just as some percentage of doctors, lawyers, traffic cops and factory workers are.