BARBELITH underground
 

Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.


Wagner's Ring (missus)

 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
09:36 / 18.03.04
(note to mods- you may want to move this to Film/TV/Theatre- or you may not.)

I did something very out of character last night- I went to see the English National Opera's new production of Das Rheingold.

And lots of fun it was too- although I found the staging somewhat weird. It's a modern interpretation- the Rhinemaidens are poledancers, the giants stereotypical builders, Wotan a yuppie... Surprisingly enough, it still managed to seem epic (something I'd worried about having read some less-than-complimentary reviews) and, as my first experience of Wagner "live", was well fucking worth it.

Has anybody else seen either this production, or another they'd like to talk about? I STILL want to see a good old-fashioned pointy-helmets and swords (rather than guns!) production... anyone recommend one on DVD or something? (I used to have a wicked Tannhauser on video, but it was many years ago and I forget who did it, but that was the "traditional" staging.)

I'm definitely going to Die Walkure when it rolls around... although I'm gonna pay extra for a more comfortable seat for that.
 
 
FinderWolf
17:02 / 19.03.04
I thought the topic abstract meant Brian Eno did his own modern version of this Wagner opera

This sounds fucking cool - wish I was in England to see it! Alas, I am in NYC. Any pictures or linked pages about this production?
 
 
Brigade du jour
21:55 / 25.03.04
Stoatie, don't take this wrong way, but ... they let you in an opera? Thought they were all ponces.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
19:25 / 01.10.07
And... it's that time again. I've got tickets for the entire Ring Cycle at the Royal Opera House, starting tomorrow with Das Rheingold (Die Walkure is on Thursday, Siegfried Sunday and Gotterdammerung on the following Tuesday).

It's a different staging, obviously, and this time it's in the original German. I'm looking forward to it and dreading it (it's gonna be something of an endurance test, for sure- apart from anything else, I'll have to not drink before I go in, cos they're BLOODY LONG) in equal measures, but I shall be back to tell you all about it.

Anyone else going?

I know my opera threads have a history of sinking without trace on here, but I'll keep trying, dammit. In a heroically doomed sort of way.

(In December I've got the REALLY EXPENSIVE tickets for Parsifal... I had some money and figured "when the fuck am I ever again gonna be able to afford 200 quid for the opera? Never, that's when. FUCK IT").
 
 
Saturn's nod
19:37 / 01.10.07
My opera threads usually sink without trace too. Go us.

I'm wondering whether treating myself to seeing Parsifal might be just the right kind of end-of-PhD celebration, you've definitely got me considering it.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
20:22 / 01.10.07
Do it! I'm going on the 21st December- we could have a micro-Barbemeet with orchestra.
 
 
Colonel Kadmon
21:04 / 01.10.07
I saw Gotterdamerung when Scottish Opera did the entire ring cycle as part of the Edinburgh International Festival 4 or 5 years ago. It was in German, but set in the 1930's or 40's. It was brilliant, my first experience of Wagner, and I loved it.

It was basically the dress rehearsal, and they opened the theatre up for anyone under 21 (I think) to see it for free, as part of some social inclusion plan. Thing is, they didn't really advertise it, and about forty people turned up. So me and two of my mates sat leaning over the orchestra pit in an almost empty Festival Theatre. The cast was bigger than the audience. Halfway through, we switched sides and watched the string section instead. And we don't even look under 21!
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
21:27 / 02.10.07
So I just got back from Das Rheingold, and it was fucking great. I preferred it to the ENO's production- I thought he design decisions made a lot more sense. There were still a lot of modern costumes and the like, but whereas in Phyllida Lloyd's ENO production they seemed to be trying to take everything epic out of it by doing this, here it seemed to work the other way round.

Also, on a practical level, it works much better in German, cos they give you surtitles... paradoxically it's when it's in English that I find it harder to follow. And the fifty quid seats weren't bad at all.

Die Walkure on Thursday...
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
21:57 / 04.10.07
Die Walkure was FUCKING AMAZING. Honestly, I don't think anyone's complaining about Bryn Terfel dropping out anymore- Sir John Tomlinson is a fucking wicked Wotan. His looong scene in Act III with just him and Brunnhilde (where he's casting her out for betraying him by trying to save Siegmund) was fucking gorgeous- visually less intense than the ENO's version of the same scene, but musically a lot stronger.

(The end of Act I, with Siegmund and Sieglinde in Hunding's hut, dragged a little, but, well, it just does, however you do it, and there's not much getting around that. Again, though, the vocal performances were fucking top).
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
20:51 / 07.10.07
Just got back from Siegfried- conceptually this was the most confused one so far, with a lot of Act I, beautiful though it looked and sounded, leaving me wondering why some of the design decisions had been made. Overall, though, another killer, with a Siegfried who seemed arrogant, drunk on his own youthful belief in invulnerability, and (of course) fearless- in short, a hero, but still a dick. Compare this to the ENO's Siegfried who was just a dick, really, and had me thinking "you know, if I were Mime, I'd probably figure the chance to use the ring to rule the world wouldn't really be worth putting up with this gitwizard for however-many-teen years it is". This time, by contrast, Siegfried was actually quite likeable for all his arrogance and self-obsession.

The high point was Brunnhilde's emergence from the rock- musically, of course, that bit's gorgeous anyway, but they avoided the temptation to do something really overblown and settled for just bathing the stage in yellow light as she comes out and hails the Sun.

Yeah, three for three so far. Blimey, this is good shit.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
18:55 / 08.10.07
15 hours of Wagner gets even LESS interest than 24 hours of Throbbing Gristle... come on, guys, this time round there are TUNES and stuff!
 
 
Ticker
18:59 / 08.10.07
I grew up listening to the cycle so when my Dad could he took us to see Siegfried. I was in my late teens at the time but it was amazing. I always have mixed feelings about Wagner but I can't resist seeing these.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
22:47 / 08.10.07
I always have mixed feelings about Wagner

On a political level? Well yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

To their credit, the Royal Opera haven't shied away from that- in Das Rheingold, Nibelheim under Alberich's rule seemed to have deliberate echoes of Mengele, which I took to be an acknowledgment and rejection of some of the dodgier elements of Wagner.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
23:01 / 09.10.07
Gotterdammerung was MASSIVE. Not just in length- it actually felt properly epic this time (despite being, with the exception of the last act, the least "epic" part of all- it's all soap-opera chicanery and human treachery, really). It was like- have you ever played chess on acid? Even if you're shit (which you probably are if you're off your tits) every single move feels like it's of such great significance. It was like that.

The only real problem was the lack of John Tomlinson (for which you can blame Wagner, really, as he didn't write Wotan into this one). Everyone else was awesome, and this time Brunnhilde's sacrifice actually seemed like it MEANT something rather than just being some sixth-former's idea of what would BE REALLY COOL (Phyllida Lloyd's "suicide bomber" ending of the ENO production, I'm looking at you).

As an experience, it's kind of weird to think it's all over now. Watching the whole cycle over the space of a few days, as intended, is an entirely different experience from watching them all a few months apart. The narrative flows more easily, all the momentum built up is still there in the background when Gunther and Guthrun are doing their whole "Dangerous Liasons" bit, which otherwise could seem a bit self-absorbed, homely and meaningless. When you know the people they're talking about (Siegfried and Brunnhilde) about as well as you can know someone who's on stage, BECAUSE YOU'VE BEEN WATCHING THEM INTENTLY IN THE LAST COUPLE OF DAYS, it all seems charged with so much more import.

Also good, given the argument a friend and I had been having in the interval as to whether the cycle ends with the end of the world (a more traditional Ragnarok, and the way most Wagner buffs interpret it) or simply the end of the rule of men by Gods, was many of the cast coming on (following the destruction of Valhalla and the drowning of Hagen by the Rhinemaidens) in casual work-clothes- humanity freed from the shackles of the Gods. (Not sure if that's what they were getting at, but it was how I read it).

Yeah, fucking beautiful.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
23:20 / 12.10.07
C'mon, guys, I'm still on a major comedown from this shit...

someone else must have an opinion on the Ring Cycle, surely?
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
23:13 / 14.10.07
Saturday night I went to, as part of the ROH's Wagner Festival, a series of what could probably be called B-Sides and Rareties. This included Die Hochzeit, which the motherfucker wrote when he was 19, and a piano-and-three-voices rendition of the unfinished Siegfrieds Tod (unfinished largely because he figured the backstory was a bit too much and he may as well start from the beginning).

The best bit, however, was the Wesendonck Lieder- music he wrote for a sequence of poems written by Mathilde Wesendonck- which were, well, really FUCKING BEAUTIFUL, especially Im Treibhaus, which had me close to tears.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
21:39 / 22.12.07
Went to Parsifal last night... it was fucking great (four rows back from the stage... wow, this time I could not only see their faces, I could see their mouths move).

I've never seen Parsifal before, and other than the basic outline of the story I had no idea what to expect. Musically, it was excellent- a LOT of massed choruses (which you don't get in the Ring), thematically- bit of a weird one.

Wagner-haters often seem to use Parsifal as being the nastiest of his operas. I don't get that, really. An anti-Semite he may have been, but there's nothing in Klingsor (or Kundry, for that matter) to suggest Jewishness, really. Klingsor WAS fundamentally evil, which is why he couldn't join the Grail Knights, which does, admittedly, go against the whole redemptive message of the story- but unless you take it as a given that evil=Jewish, it doesn't work when read as an anti-Semitic text. There are none of the traditional stereotypes invoked, and redemption for all is the message. Klingsor's basically your run-of-the-mill bad guy (except Darth Vader never castrated himself to gain wisdom).

But then, the Grail Knights are all basically wankers until Parsifal turns up (in fact, they're wankers WHEN he turns up, and only sort it out when he's fucked off and come back)- and they're equally as stupid as he, the "pure fool" is, given that it hasn't occurred to any of them that Kundry, being the only female outside of Klingsor's castle, is the same woman who led Amfortas to his ruin. I mean, who else did they think it could have been?

It's also interesting that the Nazis pretty much banned Parsifal through non-performance, while loving his other stuff, because its message of pacifism and redemption didn't sit well with them.

Sir John Tomlinson was fucking excellent, but the thing I learned about getting the expensive seats (these fuckers were the best part of two hundred quid each!) was that the interval conversation is a lot funnier, and a lot more facepalmworthy.

Interval one-

"Well, the staging's all wrong. Parsifal looks like a WORKMAN!!!"

Interval two-

"There was definitely some 'equal opportunities employment' going on with the Flowermaidens". (There were about 25 flowermaidens on stage. TWO of them weren't white. My personal guess as to why they were in the front row, having heard them all sing, is that they were employed BECAUSE THEY HAD THE BEST VOICES, and were therefore the best equipped to take the two leading voice roles among that paricular chorus. But maybe I'm just mad. Incidentally, they didn't comment on the fact that Willard White was singing one of the main roles... ah, perhaps it was because he was the bad guy).

...nobody's even going to click on this, are they?
 
 
Mon Oncle Ignatius
08:06 / 23.12.07
I clicked.

(OK, so I'd already heard about Parsifal offline, but what the hell; a click is a click.)
 
  
Add Your Reply