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horrid hypersigil

 
  

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Tamayyurt
22:55 / 30.08.01
For the past 7 months I've been working with Thoth on creating a working hypersigil system. (seeing as how that bastard grant morrison brought it up and then never followed up.) So far they've all worked.
Ok, on Tues. I wrote a little, story STORY (not magic story!!!) about a kid who kills this cat. It was meaningless. Just for school with no intent! Um, the next day I go and run over a cat! So my question is how do I turn it off? Or, now that I've blurred the ficital world and the real world, there's no going back? And if that's the case...how do I write a story without doing horrible damage to me and my friends? I mean, they can't all have happy endings. There has to be drama!
thanks
 
 
Warewullf
07:22 / 31.08.01
Or more importantly, how did you do this in the first place?!
 
 
RiffRaff
10:59 / 31.08.01
Don't use generic characters, and don't do bad things to characters based in any way on yourself or people you like. If you must write a greek tragedy, base the hero on someone you hate.

You could also, perhaps, create servitors of recurring characters, and then whatever you write about would be directed at the servitor instead of yourself or whoever the character was based on.

And I second Warewulf's question!

--Riff
 
 
rizla mission
13:35 / 31.08.01
(naive)
Or why not make the best of it and write as many nice, happy stories as you possibly can?
 
 
Tamayyurt
14:38 / 31.08.01
ok, after grant mentioned hypersigils (in, what, October?) I tried to figure out how to do them. Looking in chaos matrix, and Phil Hine's site, and asked you Barbies and ... nothing. Basically, NOBODY knew! So I was like, "Fuck it! This is chaos magic right? I'll just make it up!" So I built a shrine to thoth (the Egyptian god of scribes and magic) burned incense and started write stories about us talking. I did my first real hypersigil. I was a story about some guy traveling around the world all expenses paid all he has to do in return is have sex with his sugar mama! It worked and let me tell you there was no way this couldn't have been magic! ON the trip I kept seeing thoth...a wall painting of him in a Belgian zoo the ibis hotel in Amsterdam... My next hypersigil, was to meet a nonspecific chick with very specific qualities. That happened. She's my girlfriend now now with summer and laziness and enjoying the fruits of my arcane abilities I haven't really written anything until of course school started. and I had to write this inane little story and even that came true.

"If you must write a greek tragedy, base the hero on someone you hate."
*I don't really hate anybody and even if I did I wouldn't want them to get run over!

"Or why not make the best of it and write as many nice, happy stories as you possibly can?"
*I thought of this too but, eventually that would suck
 
 
Tamayyurt
14:44 / 31.08.01
quote: how did you do this in the first place?!

besides the divine backing of thoth I treat the characters like voodoo dolls. But not the poor cat I swear!
 
 
Ria
15:34 / 31.08.01
if writing fiction really does affect reality to this extent that it will sure affect what I will have happen to my characters. I always base my protagonist on myself... or the same version of myself.
 
 
Wyrd
15:45 / 31.08.01
quote:Originally posted by impulsivelad:
And if that's the case...how do I write a story without doing horrible damage to me and my friends? I mean, they can't all have happy endings. There has to be drama!


Glad to hear that you had such great results with the hypersigil.

However, I suspect your recent result could indicate you are being taught a specific lesson regarding the use of your hypersigil.

My guess is that you need to go back to Thoth and re-negotiate the parameters of your hypersigil. And if you didn't set any down in the first place (tsk, tsk), well, now you're getting a poke in the ribs to remind you.

As you say, you don't want *everything* you write to attempt to come in reality (I think Mr. Morrison also learned this lesson the very hard way). If that's the case, then there has to be something you consciously do to turn the effect off when you write a story that's meant to be just a story. Good luck!
 
 
Ria
15:45 / 31.08.01
since posting I have had an idea... if magical stories work and I guess have worked for a long time this will have had some effect on human culture. if consciously or unconsciously people have used narrative in this way.
 
 
RiffRaff
18:32 / 31.08.01
Hot damn, I gotta get me some of this. Time to go research Thoth!
 
 
Mordant Carnival
18:41 / 31.08.01
Who else is good apart from Thoth? I thought of Odin, what with the whole runes thing and all, but me and the Norse pantheon are Not Talking at present. (Don't ask.)
 
 
Tuna Ghost: Pratt knot hero
18:58 / 31.08.01
quote:Originally posted by Mordant Carnival:
Who else is good apart from Thoth? I thought of Odin, what with the whole runes thing and all, but me and the Norse pantheon are Not Talking at present. (Don't ask.)


Quotes like these are why I love this place.
 
 
Lothar Tuppan
09:08 / 01.09.01
quote:Originally posted by Mordant Carnival:
Who else is good apart from Thoth? I thought of Odin, what with the whole runes thing and all, but me and the Norse pantheon are Not Talking at present. (Don't ask.)


Ganesh is also a lord of scribes. Uses his severed tusk as a pen.
 
 
Ierne
09:08 / 01.09.01
MC: How are you with the Celtic vibe? I've often had good luck with Manannan Mac Lír.

My personal favorite, however, is his brother Bran the Blessed.

[ 01-09-2001: Message edited by: Ierne ]
 
 
Tamayyurt
22:55 / 01.09.01
Ganesh is cool. I love that fat fuck

Wyrd, what exactly do you mean by "parameters of your hypersigil"? Like, an on and off switch? How would I go about doing this?

I was wondering if any of you have tried coming up with a way of doing hypersigils? what'd you come up with? What were the results?
 
 
Tucker Tripp
08:36 / 02.09.01
Great thread, very illuminating. Do you think that Ganesh would work as well as Thoth? Could they be combined?
 
 
Lionheart
15:08 / 02.09.01
Write a story about how a kid's writings come true and how how he draws a light switch. and if he pushes the "on" part of the light switch then the stories become reality, and if he pushes "off" part of the light switch then the stories remain just stories.
 
 
Wyrd
19:45 / 02.09.01
quote:Originally posted by impulsivelad:
Ganesh is cool. I love that fat fuck


Yes, he's a wonderful God. His big festival (Ganesh Chaturthi) has only just finished.

quote:Wyrd, what exactly do you mean by "parameters of your hypersigil"? Like, an on and off switch? How would I go about doing this?

What were the ins and outs of the hypersigil that you set up in agreement with Thoth?

If it just was "whatever I write I want to happen in reality", then I suggest you add a couple of riders to the original intent!

That means that you'd do something (some conscious trigger, mantra, eye-blinking exercise, etc.) when you don't want something you write to manifest itself in reality. How you do that is up to you, and Thoth.

It sounds like you've had a fine run with the hypersigil, it might be time to pull it apart and create a new one.

quote:I was wondering if any of you have tried coming up with a way of doing hypersigils? what'd you come up with? What were the results?

I've never set my mind to creating one, I'm afraid.
 
 
Rage
22:27 / 02.09.01
Wow. I suddenly feel honored to have met you in the corperation location known as Pembroke Mall.
 
 
fukphace
05:21 / 03.09.01
What the hell are hypersigils??? Where can I read about these? They sound super cool.

hey.
 
 
Warewullf
06:59 / 03.09.01
This is fascinating! I've GOT to try this!
 
 
Mordant Carnival
16:02 / 03.09.01
Yeah. It has to be done.


I'm thinking of chumming up to one or other of the Nine Muses on this- not sure which one though. Calliope, maybe. (Although... how epic do I really want my life to get?)


BTW- here's a link for those of you who want to know what the fuck I'm on about this time: http://muses.calligrafix.co.uk/muses.html
 
 
FutureBoy
00:55 / 04.09.01
hey Imp. go read my post and tell me how your cat killing spell could be upgraded for people?
 
 
Merman vs Vampire
19:25 / 04.09.01
This is fascinating. I've encountered something similar in the last few years. I was working on a THC fueled action adventure comedy project where I visualized supermodel Heidi Klum as the hot chick. Then a short time after I ran into her on the subway one Saturday morning. She started talking to me out of the blue- talk about the universe throwing me a bone! But like an asshead I let her get away- and she was all into my shit too. The same thing happened the next year- I was working on another project- this time visualizing Owen Wilson as the lead in another wacky THC fueled narrative and I ran into him downtown having lunch. In both cases I wasn't thinking in terms of writing myself as the main character- it was just me getting high and writing.

At the begining of this summer I got a job working on a 3 issue miniseries that comes out next year from Image comics. It's my friends story but he brought me onboard to amp shit up. So i threw myself into it- trying to make it good. Funny thing is, at the end of the first issue the main character kills himself (only to come back in the 2nd issue). As a consequence I have been in a much more volatile emotional state and I can't help but feel that the content is responsible for this.

So after reading impulsivelad's bang my way around the world post, I'm very interested in making an attempt at creating my life through writing. I've preformed a few pujas to Ganesha in the last year so I think I'll try to use him. But I am an absolute boob about all this chaos magic stuff. I've tried some sigils but so far none of them have worked. The only real practice I have is doing yoga and the occasional pranayama.

So let me get this straight- I construct an alter, ask so and so for their aid, and commence writing? Is that it? Should I learn how to do banishing before this? I just wanna make sure I got all the pieces before I begin

thanks
 
 
Tamayyurt
15:41 / 05.09.01
hey, Rage.

Um, FutureBoy... dude, I feel bad about killing a cat let alone a human... fucking him up on the other had sounds cool.

And yeah, Merman vs Vampire, That's pretty much how I did it. I'm good with regular sigils too. but from your story you seem to have an inherent talent for hypersigils. What comic do you write? How about some free PR? And careful cause the last comic writer to have a fictional avatar got a collapsed lung and some sort of infection! Of curse, then he got X-MEN sooo...

[ 05-09-2001: Message edited by: impulsivelad ]
 
 
grant
16:43 / 05.09.01
I missed PATricky in his Ganesh suit at Burning Man, but the image he made was pretty intense. Weird that that would coincide with the holiday.

Not specific scribes, but: Eleggua is a divine translator, as is Hermes. Words are their business. As is travel (in my mind, the journey of a good fiction counts, too).
 
 
Tamayyurt
19:53 / 05.09.01
Tell me more about Eleggua, grant? I mean, I'm used to thinking of him as the gate keeper between here and the, um, invisible world. And yeah I know people invoke him when they invoke Dambala W. so that he can translate his hissing into some human language.
Hmmmm, but as a writer? I can so see me smoking a cigar, spraying rum through my teeth onto my computer, and banging out a wicked story

Please, more of Eleggua in his translator role

[ 05-09-2001: Message edited by: impulsivelad ]
 
 
grant
16:59 / 06.09.01
I got turned onto that by Henry Louis Gates Jr.'s The Signifying Monkey.
He relates Eleggua's function as translator and trickster to black language games like "signifyin'" (making tall tales) and "playing the dozens" (swapping fantastic insults).
An example: "Your sister is so easy, she walks around with a matress strapped to her back."
To lose the game is to take the words literally rather than figuratively, and actually get angry rather than playing with language.

There's also a relationship between Eleggua and Ifa, the orisha of divination, but I can't quite remember it.
According to
this article, the cowries are called "Elegba's shells," and are distinct from Ifa's palm nuts. Hmm.

This Dahomean page has more on Eleggua and communication - in the sense of a message bearer, mainly.
 
 
Mordant Carnival
17:08 / 06.09.01
Damn, there's some cool godforms in this thread!

But none of them entirely suit my purposes. I think I'm going to have to invent one instead.
 
 
grant
17:16 / 06.09.01
From that second page:

quote:Because Eshu is the messenger, in orisha rituals (today performed from Nigeria to Rio to Montreal) one must "feed" or call him first, before any other gods are invoked. For the Fon people, the primacy of Eshu (whom they call Legba) comes about through his linguistic ability, his proficiency at communicating. In the beginning, Mawu, the female aspect of Mawu-Lisa, the androgynous high god of the Fon, gives her seven children different realms to rule--earth, sea, animals--and gives them a language separate from her own. But she allows Legba, her youngest and most spoiled child, to remain with her and to act as a relayer of information to her children.

So Legba knows all the languages known to his brothers, and he knows the language Mawu speaks, too. Legba is Mawu's linguist. If one of the brothers wishes to speak, he must give the message to Legba, for none knows any longer how to address himself to Mawu-Lisa. That is why Legba is everywhere.
As the hermetic linguist, then, Legba knows the cosmic language as well as the earthly language. This is why humans must ritually acknowledge him before any other god. In our monotheisms, God's information is distant, except for the occasional prophet, and the rest of us are lost in babble and books. But Legba is always traversing that region of babble, and embodies the hope and the peril of a more open channel: hope, because he allows us to speak with the gods and for them to speak with us; and peril, because he tends to play tricks with the information he has, to keep us perpetually aware that he oversees the network of exchange. His nickname is Aflakete, which means "I have tricked you."


quote:There is a Yoruba prayer that goes:

Eshu, do not undo me,
Do not falsify the words of my mouth
Do not misguide the movements of my feet.
You who translate yesterday's words
Into novel utterances,
Do not undo me.
 
 
RiffRaff
18:15 / 06.09.01
quoteamn, there's some cool godforms in this thread!
But none of them entirely suit my purposes. I think I'm going to have to invent one instead.


Well, what about Destiny from Sandman? He's got a great big book and everything that's in it is real...
 
 
Mordant Carnival
18:56 / 06.09.01
quote:Originally posted by RiffRaff:


Well, what about Destiny from Sandman? He's got a great big book and everything that's in it is real...


Already thought of him. But he's kind'v severe, and I'm trying to alter my future so having a bloke turn up with my destiny graven in stone (metaphorically) would definately be a bit of a downer.

And let's face it: his clothes just aren't as cool as the rest of the Endless's.
 
 
Kabakhu
20:56 / 06.09.01
I suggest you purchase a ring, and use this as your "Hypersigil Ring" so that only the stories you write while wearing that ring come tue.
Take it off while doing school work, heh, poor cat.

K
 
 
Merman vs Vampire
00:26 / 07.09.01
Impulsivelad

As far as comics. I did a couple of books for redneck publisher London Night Studios: this post apocalptic romp called Skid Roze. My intent was to do a David Lynchian Road Warrior- quirky but balls out. This was with Jacen Burrows who drew Warren Ellis' Dark Blue.

Then last year I wrote a story in WEird War Tales one shot published by Vertigo where I worked with current Hellblazer artist Marcelo Frusin. It's a little Vietnam ditty where I got to pay homage to Apocalypse Now. Check it out- I'd love to hear what you (or anyone else) think(s). I got to be on the same page as Garth Ennis and Jim Lee; that was pretty cool in a cheezyball fanboy way. The book also features the final work of my dear departed friend Edvin Biukovic, artist of Grendel and Human Target. Those pages are pure grace- check it out.

As far as my new shit, I'll post something over in the comics section when we announce the book. Probably some time this fall

I first met Grant and Millar in 96 at the San Diego comicon. More than anyone, Grant is responsible for my wanting to do comics. I can't remember how many times during an acid trip I'd take a gander at Arkham Asylum or Kid Eternity. Meeting someone who has had that much impact on you- its an amazing thing. That first time Grant was visibly shaken - this was right after the hospital episode and when DC had announced he was working on JLA. I talked to him that year- gave him some smoke- and did the same thing the next year. The next year he was mega fucked up and having hot flashes- but he remembered me! Then the year after that I smoked some grass with him in his hotel room- it was fantastic synchronicity- true greatness. It's funny cause now Grant remembers me for this sticker on his computer that says Comic Books Rock, when in fact I didn't send it to him- instead I sent him a sticker for my friend's psycadelic cult t-shirt company. I saw Grant only once at the hotel lobby this year at San Diego and he was so much more powerful and centered than any of the 4 other times I've seen him. He is always in tune and ready to unleash- seeing him cast a spell on DisinfoCon is something I will never forget.

You give me great confidence to go forward and attempt a hypersigil. I'll let the board know how it goes.

miles
 
 
Mr Tricks
18:16 / 07.09.01
Well... the Mission to Bring Ganesh to Burningman was EPIC... the unfolding there of was a many fold lesson as Ganesh Himself pushed more & more pieces together... freebies poured in left & right.

Manafesting him in Costume form on the Playa was another epic journey... from which I'm still recovering.
I'm still attempting to intergrate this whole process into the mundane context of my day to day world & the quiet quest for a new home & expanded means of Artistic expression & lifestyle...

Can anyone elaborate on the time & Dates of the Ganesh-Purjah... I find it very interesting that it seems to coinside with the Burningman time-period...
 
  

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