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Stop looking at me!!!

11:25 / 09.10.03

OK.
I catch myself staring at people-(WOMEN)cause they look hot. Occasionally I glance at a dude cause I have to-
no, I MUST look at him because he's looking at me! And I won't stop looking-STARING-not until that punk ass muthafucka looks the other way! YEAH-I WIN!
Is this a hollow victory? Sometimes I look the other way-did I just get Punk'D (ala ashton kutcher)...
what is the freakin deal-I definately am NOT gonna walk around with my head down.

11:39 / 09.10.03

yeah.. i think that looking thing is a power struggle.

if you are free to look at anyone you like, you are more powerful than someone who isnt. that, and the fact that you are OBVIOUSLY sizing them up for a fight, something which noone can turn away from and feel strong.

think dogs barking; when you stop staring them out, they get calm. think silverback gorrillas; no one in their gang looks them in the eye without backing the stares up with a physical challenge.

we are just less aggressive these days, i reckon.

well, some folks are.

"watchoo lookin at, dick'ed?"

11:59 / 09.10.03

I find a lot of change looking at the ground as I walk. It's a whole different game depending on where you are. Some places are more threatening/scary than others. Here in Adelaide, South Australia you can pretty much look at anyone, stare them down and WIN without much fear of a knife attack but in Asia I always get the feeling that I'm gonna lose and die so I look at the ground and find a lot of (worthless) small change. In England I found that everyone else is so busy trying not to appear interested in who/what you are or look like that nobody even notices if you are staring at them or not. Unless they do in which case you might be in for one of those few truly scary moments in your life. I had a few of those, made me feel like a real foreigner when, caught out looking at someone (or even the car they are driving), they suddenly charge up to you and shout, punk styley, into your face.

I'll always stare at hot looking women though, they don't tend to scream at one, just treat one with the ignore one deserves.

11:59 / 09.10.03

It's funny looking at people on the tube. Sometimes I find myself staring at the person opposite in rapt awe (drugged induced - or just plain pissed). I either get embarrassed and look away for invading their personal space, or just smile until they look away.

My teacher friend told me about the whole staring thing as a power struggle thing, and it is true, there is power in staring someone down. The trick is to be determined from the off, and if need be to widen your eyes slightly so that more of the whites of your eyes are showing - apparently.

12:23 / 09.10.03

I recall from my teenage years, being stared out (not at, OUT) by other blokes of a similar age. This is was usual the precursor to a challenge ("what you screwing at?")if you didn't look away. This, in turn, was possibly a precurosr to a kicking, depending on how big they were/how many of their mates they had with them. Defintely a challenge thing, for young blokes. Bu so what, why not look away? If someone's penis is so tiny that they're going to have won some sort or victory by staring at me, they're welcome to it.

I think the reason nobody looks or talks even in London is they're too frightened of having a big conversation with potential loonies. Same in any big city, I think you set your personal space boundaries higher, out of fear. Not so in small towns. I found this in Santa Cruz (people saying hello on the street), as opposed to San Francisco (normal big city blinkers on).

12:38 / 09.10.03

I am not sure I can break down the difference between survival instinct and mating ritual, only because mating is survival of the species. However, if someone is staring me down I find it more of a power struggle too. After all, most of the time it's just some guy disecting my body parts with his eyes, to which I will most assuredly break his little spell with some half sneer and abrasive comment.

Other than that, it could just be curiousity....watching people is entertaining. I used to do it every morning at sitting on the cornor of Yonge&Wellesley until they put up a Starbucks. But it was just generally accepted that if you sat there, you were just people-watching and no one would bother you. Otherwise, in Toronto, one does not look directly at another person unless it is for sex or to target them for a crime. At least that is the ongoing theory on the street. If they stop you to talk briefly....fucking run like hell.

12:39 / 09.10.03

Oh yes. the "looney" factor is the biggie! Not just in London... worldwide. The number of times I have been singled out by the village loon is uncountable. I have that approachable look about me and I get them all, wherever I am. They all want to tell me their life story and, quite frankly, I'm often not that intetersested.

I still maintain that the loons in Britain are nastier than those in Australia though. Never, here, have I had one screech his car to a halt in front of me just so he could jump out, run around to be standing almost on my feet and call me a cunt to my face (with accompanying spittle) for no apparent reason. I was just walking home from Wolverton Tescos with my shopping for Chrissakes.

13:34 / 09.10.03

Fuck, that's a bit harsh. I do feel a weird national pride thing on knowing we have the world's most unpleasent loons, though. Yay! Go England!

14:26 / 09.10.03

My job involves standing on a street all day and sizing them up until they give me money (and no, I'm not a panhandler. They're a step up from me. I'm actually getting paid by the hour.)
I think this is a big problem.
The money look.
The "If you look me in the eye I'm going to ask you for money, and since you're an eye looker I'm going to be the seventeenth person who's done that to you today" that I observe in the homeless/pedestrian dance.
(I don't really apply to this dance, since I'm in uniform and I generally wait for them to ask me some dumb touristy question like "How long is the all day tour?" before I hit them up for their hard earned cash)
So money has a lot to do with it, but since I'm working, I generally have money on the brain (when I'm not thinking about space or comics or politics and kind of getting that dreamy I'm standing here but you could steal my shoes and I really wouldn't notice right now look about me, which in all honesty is most of the time).
Money aside looking is not just a mating thing or a dominance thing. It's also a sharing thing. A mutual exchange of recognition. A solid strike against existentialism. The, I HONESTLY BELIEVE that you are an important sentiant human being much like myself, thing.
This is most important, because I get in my moods where everyone about becomes these fictionalizations that are merely extensions of myself. There is little more megalomaniacal or lonely.
But the right eye contact shatters it like glass.
It's horribly shocking and quite magical. Happens on average about two times daily (in my 6 hour street time shift) and it Shakes the world to it's foundations every time.

14:34 / 09.10.03

you gotta get the eyes right, man. you have to keep your head up and your back straight. you gotta look TOUGH, especially when you're a girl alone somewhere you maybe shouldn't be late at night. make eye contact but DO NOT STARE. jaw up, out, eyes half lidded, casual, calm. I'm not scared of you, bitch. I could take you all on, but I'm minding my business, see? maybe I keep a gun in my bag. knives in my pockets, razorblades in my mouth. I'm a little crazy, I'll suck your eyeballs right out.

I sometimes enjoy staring down my cats. yah, they know who's boss.

14:39 / 09.10.03

OK so my life IS just weird!

I always thought it was just me but HOPED these things were universal but Sir Tropical Downbeat Illmatic's response has now made me feel singled out for the nastiness of the world. Great.

15:01 / 09.10.03

As my dear old mum used to say: "What's up with you? Too nice to be looked at?"

15:03 / 09.10.03

next level,
yes, looking away is probably the best option-like I said before,
I've done it enough times to be sure.
but now comes the comedy.
the same cat who's staring back at me with the I KIll U MAN intensity
can be disarmed with a simple nod to the affirmative (up or down you take your pick)especially here in L.A
I find that pretty funny-we some lonely bastards in this world.
As far as the fairer sex,I'd say 90% of the time my dumbfounded gaze is met with indifference-but there's that other 10% or so that will check me out too like-'hey big boy,why don't ya come sweep me off my feet sometime' or something like that...

We're The Great Old Ones Now

15:07 / 09.10.03

There's some very interesting stuff about the signals we use to communicate - including eye contact and so on. One of the uses is to demonstrate that you're not barking mad. Staring fixedly or not making eye-contact enough in conversation will rapidly cause people to worry that you're

1) not paying attention
2) rude
3) losing your marbles

in roughly that order.

Garfinkel and his work on Ethnomethodology is a place to start if you're interested.

15:08 / 09.10.03

So if you stare meaningfully at ten women in the street, one of them will fall at your feet? Wow. Some super-power you've got there. How many call the police?

15:16 / 09.10.03

People watching can be so much fun! And there's always some bits of the city, where you can watch people, and some will smile back... especially busking. Making eye contact leads to more money, and some fun conversations...

If I'm in an incredibly good mood/high on coffee/or other things, I can't help but walk around smiling at people... I guess I'm a loonie every once in a while, but somebody has to be...

15:17 / 09.10.03

Living in London I'm well practised in making no eye contact whatsoever, to the extent that I find it hard to muster even when called for. On the street I'll generally break eye contact the moment I'm aware of it. It's really quite a surprise to learn that this means that I'm bottom of the league in some primative staring competition. But if you're all playing, you could collect some easy points off me. Come and find me. Really, I'm a pushover.

For me it's not about fear, or the struggle for some strange sort of power; it's about respect. And it's the way we cope with co-existing in a big crowded city, isn't it? We mind our own business. Making sustained, univited eye-contact with strangers is just socially inept. Christ, a child of 4 has worked that out.

15:19 / 09.10.03

A few weeks after the "FUCK YOU C*NT" while walking quietly back from Tescos with my shopping episode, previously mentioned, came the time when, also wandering quietly back to the house from Tesco's with shopping in hand, a bunch of about 6-7 "youths" walking in the opposite direction took great pleasure in one of their male number deciding, for no apparent reason, to, at the exact moment of out paths intersecting, jump face first into my path whilst screaming extremely loudly "WAAHHHHHHHHHHHH" about 6 inches from my nose. Scared the shit out of me.

I'm not coming back to England, it's a scary place!

15:19 / 09.10.03

Bit concerned by the apparent attitude (and if I have got this wrong I apologise) expressed by some posters in this thread that's OK to stare at people if you fancy them... don't you think this behaviour may very well make them extremely uncomfortable? It seems to me that being constantly stared at might very well make a person feel a little harassed or bothered, and I don't think it's really appropriate to make other people feel intimidated or uncomfortable for whatever reason.

OK, maybe I am over-reacting a little, and most staring may well go un-noticed by the staree... but a stare is different to a glance or a look, much more obvious and aggressive.

I think I am just very uncomfortable with all this laddish stuff about 'hot women' and being too afraid to stare at other men in case they think you fancy them or something awful like that, shock horror. Why the need to emphasise that here of all places? No one here gives a toss how het you are.

16:05 / 09.10.03

Kit-Cat Club, I don't know if you are in England or not, but the point you raise is valid, and, from the perspective of one who came from as far away as it is possible to be without being on the way back from the other direction around the globe, the girls in the UK are just BIZARRE in their dress sense. I've been "gagging" to share this perspective with someone ever since I encountered it. This really freaked me out!

From the end of January until the beginning of August this year I came to live in England, in a small village about 15 minutes cycle ride north of Milton Keynes, New Bradwell if that means anything to you, a few minutes walk from Wolveron (which at least has it's own train station to lend credibility to the location).

Just walking to the local Co-op around the corner was fraught with danger. Believe me, I'm no pervy predator but even in the midst of winter the girls wear bugger all. In summer it's just downright ODD. As a naiive Australian it was impossible NOT to stare. I've been back in Oz about 2 months now and have not seen as much flesh as I encountered over there on any given suposedly boring walk around the block to the local chinese takeaway. It didn't seem to matter if the female in question was 12 or 60, the object of the exercise seemed to be to flash as much firm, or wrinkly, flesh as one could legally get away with. If I managed to travel all the way to the major centre of Milton Keynes Shopping centre it just got stranger and stranger. When I managed to get as far as London the same thing happened but the look got more gothy. What I would call fetish wear is "normal" there.

British girls just don't wear enough clothes NOT to get stared at by a foreigner like myself. In a way I feel safer being here at home in Adelaide. It's obviously just a cultural thing in my case, don't get me wrong. I have no need to label myself as het.

I was just, well... stunned!

16:08 / 09.10.03

"Any more for the last train to Dangerous Territory? Last call for the final train to Dangerous Territory!"

16:12 / 09.10.03

Making sustained, univited eye-contact with strangers is just socially inept.

oh.
right.

ill just shut my socially inept eyes, shall i? thus spake smoothly weaving, and all that?

when someone is staruing you out, it can be necessary to stare back. maybe you are trying to avoid upsetting someone, but you have to be careful, there are folks out there for whom the words "i dont want any trouble" mean "kick my ass please, i want it".

eye contact is on a case by case with me.

and as for the opposite sex...
i follow the two-count, double-glance rule. it probably has a better name. when you catch someones eye, look away. count two, and then look back, with a smile or what ever your best face is. if they are looking back as well, chances are they like you.

staring is a bit much. disconcerting, even.

16:18 / 09.10.03

mumu;
you should go to Perth,WA and see cottesloe beach and all the bars on the strip there. same for scarborough beach.

like the british girls, but with a lot more of that bikini top thing going on.

it is pretty damn hot over there, though.

20:26 / 09.10.03

...away from the staring a girls and the uncomfortableness potential there for the subjects, my brother visited England twice last year, and never has he had so many 'tough guys' trying to fight him and stare at him nastily.

It seemed every time he left the flat, someone would try and stare him down or challenge him to a fight... especially in Leeds, which he described as being quite scary... maybe it was just him...

09:19 / 10.10.03

I barely even look at people when I pass them in the street, let alone stare at them. My intention is usually just to get from one place to another as quickly as possible, and I try not to let the existence of people stop me from doing this. I find it extremely irritating when random strangers speak to me in the street (or shout at me, take photos of me, attempt to hug me, throw stones at me, etc), and expect if I noticed people staring at me, I would also find that unpleasant. Think I better move back to the countryside where passing people is a rarity!

At a club it would be different - I would probably be there with the intention of interacting with people, and staring is just another way of interacting.

10:53 / 10.10.03

I find that if you keep smiling it can make a world of differance. You can stare as much as you like at everyone and you just look happily curious rather than just plain nosy or aggresive. Occasionally someone even smiles back! Though more out of instinct than genuine warmth I feel! Of course it's probobly makes a differance that I'm tiny female and blonde too!

Tryphena Absent

11:36 / 10.10.03

I don't look at people's faces when I'm walking down the street in London if it's a weekday. That's just sensible, I hate being looked at when I'm trying to be anonymous and get home as quickly as possible. I think anyone who does look at commuters is an appalling human being and should leave them the hell alone unless they're talking about the state of trains in which case it's acceptable.

Regrettable Juvenilia

11:55 / 10.10.03

The other day, I was downstairs on the number 73 bus and this ridiculous hot boyish girl sat down opposite me. So I started checking her out - let's be fair, I couldn't really help myself, we've all done it. Then she starts staring back at me like "hey, big boy, daddy fat sacks!" Then I start to worry that maybe she's not a boyish girl, she's a girlish boy! So I stop looking at him/her and go back to reading 1602. Then I look up again and the weirdo is staring at me! So I pull my best "ugh, I am disgusted" face to let her/him know I'm not interested. I even spit on the ground, which I hear the fucking Nazis in Whitehall are trying to ban. So anyway, then the freak leans over and slaps me! What a bitch! Now, my personal code of honour, which is based on a subtle blend of the Samurai Code and my understanding of the work of Frank Miller, says that if someone steps to you, you should smack them down so that people don't lose their respect for you. What else could I do in this Catch 22 situation? I broke her fucking nose.

Still, it was probably better than rejection.

Tryphena Absent

12:15 / 10.10.03

Flyboy that is foul, I can't believe you were reading 1602 when people could see you. No wonder she slapped you!

12:56 / 10.10.03

Surely a bit of letching (or checking out other people to put it more pleasantly) is something that we all do? Especially in bars, clubs, whatever. I just think most of us are aware of it’s possibly unpleasant consequences for the recipient if we do it in a very overt way or aggressive way (Cue Vic Reeves impression, rubbing thighs). I can see how women get sick of this approach. I’ve noticed some older men (my Dad and the Dad of one of my friends) doing this to female friends, completely unaware that they were doing it, in a way that made me cringe, I didn’t know who to feel sorry/embarrassed for. I’ve never noticed anyone glance back in a way that indicated they found me attractive (maybe like once in my life) but I’ve had a few looks that said “piss off, you’re a twat”.

Regrettable Juvenilia

13:09 / 10.10.03

Well you're obviously a lot less sexy than nowthink, aren't you Illmatic?

13:14 / 10.10.03

Maybe me and him can scan in pictues with our tops off and you can all vote on it? How about that?

13:17 / 10.10.03

here is a little anecdote,
I've never had any really negative experiences with staring at women
(I know, I'm a bum---can't help it)
but there was this one time-this drunk mexican cat was across the street from me,I wasn't looking at him but I spit on the ground in his direction due to a buildup of mucus not out of disrespect.
anyway-he flagged me down you know, like he totally calls me out on some old battle royale type ish-(mind you I was a lot younger and dumber,)so I crossed the street to talk to him.

I had smacked the shit out of him couple of times before I realized he was either drunk or high, right? very unfortunate. I don't think I hurt him too bad he was probly too fucked up to really notice,
but if I would have just kept it moving you know-

13:21 / 10.10.03

hey,don't sleep on the stare technique with women fellas,
like I said-most of the time it won't work but sometimes-
oh yeah, and I am too sexy for this message board,
no doubt..

13:22 / 10.10.03

Did you hit him with a plank, perchance?