BARBELITH underground
 

Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.


Talking bout my generation

 
 
Cat Chant
14:27 / 28.09.03
Can anyone think of any songs about family relationships - particularly parent-child? If not, why not - does pop music represent a self-sufficient child/young person's universe in which parents don't figure? If so, what sorts of parent-child relationships are talked about in what genres of music? What genres are likely or unlikely to talk about the generation previous to (or after) the singer's? I have a lingering suspicion that country & western is a likely bet, but that may be because of my sister's taste in C&W tending towards the novelty song ("I'm My Own Grandpa", "A Boy Named Sue", both of which are about father-son relationships).

I'm just thinking about this because someone pointed out to me that Morrissey never wrote many (any?) songs about parents, which is true, but somehow unexpected, maybe because they seem to be an unspoken presence in so many of his songs, from "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out" (which is to some extent about parent-child relationships) to "Cemetery Gates".
 
 
Cat Chant
14:35 / 28.09.03
Ooh, I just thought of two: that one by Billie that went "Because we want to! Because we want to!" (parents as failing to understand the self-evidently reasonable nature of childrens' habits and desires); and Bronski Beat's "Smalltown Boy" (parents throwing gay child out of house).

Also, there is a baby in "Coming Around Again" (little more than scenery signifying domestic drudgery)
 
 
The Falcon
16:15 / 28.09.03
'Papa, Don't Preach'?

A lot of 'University' by Throwing Muses is a maternal paean.

And there's that Mum & Dad band, although I've not heard them.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
22:23 / 28.09.03
New Model Army have kind of a family obsession- especially "Heroes", which is all about reaching that stage where you realise your parents aren't superhuman and it's time for you to come into your own. ("And we love you now, but we hate you still/And you hate us now, but you love us still"")
 
 
Jack Denfeld
03:30 / 29.09.03
Didn't the notorious B.I.G. have a song with a line "I love it when you call me big poppa"
 
 
bio k9
04:51 / 29.09.03
Harry Chapin's Cat's in the Cradle and John Lennon's Mother are the two that spring to my mind.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
07:24 / 29.09.03
There’s a really good reggae track called ‘Father and Dreadlocks’ by Charlie Ace that fits the bill for this. It’s about a Rasta going home to his parents and trying to explain why he’s swapped his suit for sandals and dreads. The lyrics are mostly a dialogue between parents and son:

“My son what is your plan for the future?”

“I plan to serve Jah for ever and ever. I plan to use my education to defend human rights, equality and justice throughout the universe.”

“My son my son, what are we going to tell the people around the neighbourhood?”

“Said Ma, tell them the Power of Jah is moving on y’a”
 
 
foot long subbacultcha
08:09 / 29.09.03
Nirvana's Serve the Servants and Weezer's Slob are a couple on this subject that grabbed me.
 
 
Cat Chant
11:57 / 29.09.03
Thanks, everyone!

Could I ask people to give a little more information about the songs they mention? This is partly to avoid this turning into a straightforward list thread, but partly just for my benefit, because I am so hugely musically ignorant that I have heard precisely one of the songs mentioned in this thread that I didn't list ('Papa Don't Preach').
 
 
40%
13:53 / 29.09.03

Marillion's 'Brave' album is a lot to do with family relationships, especially 'Runaway Girl'.
 
 
Jack Fear
14:13 / 29.09.03
The parent/child relationship has been hugely important in rock music since its beginnings—perhaps because rock'n'roll was the first music aimed primarily at teenagers: earlier pop musics shot for an adult audience, or at least an audience of independent means. Rock was different in that it was consciously a music of teenage rebellion, and the parental presence is (subtextually, at least) never far away, inasmuch as it is the primary thing against which to rebel. The familiar theme is "Parents just don't understand."

A familiar early theme is that of the parents limiting the offsrping's access to an automobile.

Eddie Cochrane, "Summertime Blues"
Well, my mom and poppa told me, 'Son you've got to earn some money
If you wanna use the car to go riding next Sunday'
I didn't go to work, i told the boss I was sick—
'Now you can't use the car because you didn't work a lick'

See also the girl in the Beach Boys song, who'll have "Fun, Fun, Fun" 'til her daddy takes her T-Bird away.

The Coasters' "Yakkety Yak" is in the voice of a parent laying down the law as regards chores ("Take out the papers and the trash/or you won't get no spending cash") and behavior ("Don't you give me no dirty looks," as well as the refrain's basso "Don't talk back.") Chuck Berry told his folks to "go away, leave me alone/and anyway I'm almost grown."

A lot of the weepy ballads of the 50s and 60s had parental disapproval as the primary force keeping the young lovers apart.

A little later on: Roger Waters of Pink Floyd has made an entire career out of his conflicted feelings towards his absent father and overbearing mother. (See most of The Wall). Ditto John Lennon ("Julia," with the Beatles: "Mother," solo), who also addressd the generation divide from the other side, speaking as father to a young son ("Beautiful Boy," most obviously; also "Watching the Wheels").

Once you get out of your teens—and in post-1960s rock, when the music, arguably, had become more mature—family ties are a two-edged sword: they provide continuity and stability, but can also be paralyzing. When Bruce Springsteen sings about New Jersey with that mixture of nostalgia and disgust—aware of the shabby parochialism, but man, what great memories—he's singing about family. He explicitly addresses his father in "Walk Like a Man," from Tunnel Of Love, where he recognizes both the necessity and the sadness of having to separate oneself from one's parents (in thiscase, by his father's death) in order to enter into full maturity. More emblematic is "My Hometown," from Born In the USA, where the narrator watches the economic decline of his hometown, but starts a family there anyway, perpetuating the cycle: at the end, he tells his son as hi own father had told him, "This is your hometown."

Steve Earle traces family histories in "Copperhead Road" (a three-generation outlaw saga, beginning with the lines "My name's John Lee Pettimore / same as my daddy and his daddy before"), "Johnny Come Lately" (how grandma and grandpa met dring the London blitz), and "Ellis Unit One" (where the narrator becomes a prison guard, "just like my Daddy and my uncles did.") Earle also sketches his family ralationships in "The Other Kind" ("I am the apple of my momma's eye / and I am my father's worst fears realized") among many other songs.

Kate Bush's large and loving family is ever-present in her songs: see especially "The Fog" (couching the inevitable detachment of oneelf from one's parents in the metaphor of a swimming lesson: "Is this love ... big enough to let go of me?")

In the 90s, grunge tracked family relationships in the context of abuse or neglect: Pearl Jam's "Jeremy," for instance, or, even more directly, "Daughter" (with a line that seems to encapsulate many a family relationship, "she holds the hand that holds her down"): broken family is alsothe subtext of many a Nirvana song, as noted above: to that list, add "Had A Dad" and whatever that one is with the chorus "Grandma,take me home"—the title is "Sliver," I think.

This is tip-of-the-iceberg stuff. What I think we've learned here is that Morrissey is, for better or worse, not a microcosm for pop music in general.
 
 
illmatic
15:15 / 29.09.03
Didn't the notorious B.I.G. have a song with a line "I love it when you call me big poppa"

I think B.I.G. might have had his beey-atch (sorry)in mind when he said that. Perhaps more appropriate is "putting five carats in my baby girl's ear" from Juicy or even, "If a nigga even tries to bogart, have his momma singing 'It's so hard' " (Gimme the loot).


And there's always Tupac.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
16:21 / 29.09.03
There's 'In Denial' off of the Pet Shop Boys 'Nightlife' album which is all about the relationship between a daughter (Kylie Minogue) and her father (Neil) who is trying to hide/admit to her that he's gay.

Pulp's 'A Little Soul', off of the 'This is Hardcore' album, mainly about how crap the real-life Jarvis' dad was as a father and how the Jarvis in the song is following in his footsteps.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
16:22 / 29.09.03
Oh, and Suede's 'Daddy's Speeding' off of 'Dog Man Star' is a very moving warning against parents driving too quickly when their kids are in the car, though we can imagine that they'd extend that to driving at all times.
 
 
Foust is SO authentic
16:36 / 29.09.03
My Front Porch Looking In by Lonestar is about a father's unabashed love for his children and wife. Happy, happy stuff.
 
 
Not Here Still
17:31 / 29.09.03
There's always Fight Tes... sorry, I mean Father and Son by Cat Stevens.
 
 
at the scarwash
18:29 / 29.09.03
In "Lemon Incest," Serge Gainsbourg inverts the usual rock formula of using pedophiliac/incestuous terms of endearment for one's snookums (baby, honey-child, sweet little girl, etc.) by singing an very nearly sexual duet with his (then) 13-year old daughter, Charlotte. Despite the creepy set-up, and the repeated "Inceste de citron," it really is lyrically nothing more than a very sweet song about a father and daughters' affection for one another.
 
 
grant
20:12 / 29.09.03
There should probably be a line drawn between songs about parents, like "Boogie Chillun" by John Lee Hooker ("I heard Papa tell Mama, 'You let that boy boogie woogie. It's in him and it's got to come out!'") and songs about children, like "Silver Spoon" by Harry Chapin. You know the one. Cat's in the cradle and the silver spoon, Little Boy Blue and the Man in the Moon...

One of my friends at work has lately gotten obsessed with "Sons Of" by Jacques Brel. Judy Collins did a version. It's a parenthood song that's also an anti-war song, sort of. Of the parenthood genre there's a substantial subgenre of mourning-for-dead-kids songs. There's also a subgenre of "let's settle down and make babies" songs. I can't think of any offhand, but I'm pretty sure Sinatra did some suburban family fantasies in his "Love and Marriage" phase. The only one that comes to mind, though, is the maudlin "The Single Man" -- which is a post-divorce song, one which doesn't mention kids explicitly. ("Once was a time/ I can't remember when/ this house was filled/ with love, but then again... it might have been/ imagination's plan/ to help along/ a single man.") Hearing it, one gets the distinct impression that the narrator wants to mention the kids, but can't quite bear to. It's the pause between "filled" and "with love."

I've always been drawn to the kind of anti-generation gap posture of Jonathan Richman and the Modern Lovers. "Dignified (And Old)" is a love song about setting down roots and, presumably, having grandkids (although I'd have to hear it again to make sure they're specifically mentioned). "Old World" is more about parents than kids, but still anti-generation-gap:
Well the old world may be dead
Our parents can't understand
But I still love my parents
And I still love the old world
Oh, I had a New York girlfriend
And she couldn't understand how I could
Still love my parents and still love the old world
 
 
Locust No longer
21:57 / 01.10.03
Probably one of the best songs of last year was Iron and Wine's "Upward over the Mountain" and it's all about the parent-child relationship. Nearly makes me cry everytime I hear it.
 
 
Ganesh
23:18 / 01.10.03
Off the top of my head, Kate Bush's 'Mother Stands For Comfort', Morrissey's 'Used To Be A Sweet Boy' and, erm, the Spice Girls' 'Mama'.

I agree, though, that parental presence is generally somewhat shadowy in the background of Moz's stuff.
 
 
William Sack
08:31 / 02.10.03
There's a song/poem by Linton Kwesi Johnson called "Sonny's Lettah" which takes the form of a man's letter from prison to his mother back in Jamaica. He apologises to her for letting her down: he had promised to look out for his little brother, but despite this the boy got arrested. I wouldn't say that it's "about" family relationships, it's more of a protest song (it's subtitled "Anti-sus poem" refering to the police stop and search powers that led to countless black men being targeted by the police). But I think the family aspect does add something to the protest element - injustice tends to affect more than just the direct victim of it.

As for those "let's settle down and have kids" songs grant was refering to, a friend of mine actually emailed me one the other day. It's called "20 Tiny Fingers, 20 Tiny Toes" and is a twee little song from the 50s (I think) about the delights of having twins. As the prospective father of twins myself, a little bit of twee is fine by me.

I'm sure that there's a fair amount of C&W stuff that fits the bill. It's not a genre that I know a great deal about, but there is of course Tammy's D.I.V.O.R.C.E which is all about not using the D-word in front of "little J.O.E." I think there's a Hank Williams song called something like "My Son Calls Another Man Daddy" as well.
 
 
Gypsy Lantern
09:20 / 02.10.03
(threadrot)

D.I.V.O.R.C.E always puts me in mind of a nefarious organisation of Nashville criminal masterminds, like S.P.E.C.T.R.E or something.

(/threadrot)
 
 
Ganesh
09:34 / 02.10.03
D.I.V.O.R.C.E always puts me in mind of a nefarious organisation of Nashville criminal masterminds, like S.P.E.C.T.R.E or something.

While engaging in counterterroristic manoevres with their arch-enemies, D.I.S.C.O...
 
 
telyn
13:34 / 02.10.03
I think Smog did a song called Cold Blooded Old Times about being a young kid and seeing his dad beat up his mum. There's also Faithless' Bring My Family Back which has more about a family break-up and repercussions.
 
 
frownland
12:52 / 03.10.03
Jack: "Had A Dad" was Jane's Addiction, but those words do appear in Nirvana's "Serve the Servants"
 
 
grant
13:58 / 03.10.03
Two songs about kids missing their parents:
"Papa Was a Rolling Stone." (by the Temptations)
"House of the Rising Sun." (blues traditional, made famous by The Animals)

Two songs along similar lines, only more like, "my parents couldn't do much, but they did the best they could":
"Gypsies, Tramps and Thieves" (by Cher)
"Papa Was a Rodeo" (by the Magnetic Fields)

There's a lot about race and class mixed in with all four of them, with the last being more ironic commentary on the conventions.

This sub-genre is interesting in that it's not based on rebellion, but on a kind of yearning -- similar to the romantic yearning in syrupy ballads from the 50s. There's a divide between the parents and the kids that can't quite be crossed, and this causes pain. It's possible to read "Papa Was a Rolling Stone" as a kind of snarky answer to something like The Ronettes' "Be My Baby" -- the narrator seems to say, "If only I could have been your baby..." and meaning it literally.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
14:13 / 03.10.03
And of course, the one that always makes me cry is Nick Cave's:

Oh father, tell me, are you weeping?
Your face, it seems wet to touch
Well then, I'm so sorry, father
I never thought I'd hurt you so much


The Weeping Song.
 
 
Jack Fear
16:46 / 03.10.03
Oh, God yes, Cave. And of course from the same album you've got "The Good Son," where he uses the Biblical parable of the prodigal son as as template for a complex family situation—a man who feels shut out by the parents he adores...

The good son walks into the field
He is a tiller, he has a tiller’s hands
But down in his heart now
He lays down queer plans
Against his brother and against his family
Yet he worships his brother
And he worships his mother
But it’s his father, he says, is an unfair man
...

The good son has sat and often wept
Beneath a malign star by which he’s kept
And the night-time in which he’s wrapped
Speaks of good and speaks of evil
And he calls to his mother
And he calls to his father
But they are deaf in the shadows of his brother’s truancy

...

And he curses his mother
And he curses his father
And he curses his virtue like an unclean thing
The good son...


The responsible child finds himself envious of the fuck-up, and resenting his parents even as he loves them. It's the kind of thing that happens in families all the time, of course—which is why he's able to make it so dramatic.

Funny: although I was, for the most part, unimpressed with Cave's No More Shall We Part, there are a couple of moments when the singer calls out to his absent parents (notably on "We Came Along This Road" and "Oh My Lord")—moments which I find terribly moving.
 
  
Add Your Reply