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Little Britain

 
  

Page: 12(3)

 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
08:22 / 25.11.05
True, although they _did_ steal his phone. I quite like that it was ambiguous whether they actually wanted to in the first place, or whether Mark's supine panic in the face of young people of a different social class created an opportunity too tempting to resist.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
08:38 / 25.11.05
Yeah, much like the second pair of youths you get sixty quid off him! "That seems rather steep, but I'm sure there are... administrative costs at your end." Faced with Mark, what possible option is there but to demand, "Now ask for it again, but this time in the voice of a lady"?
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
09:18 / 25.11.05
I think I see what you're getting at, but alternatively the Kumars at no. 42 and Matt Lucas playing Daffyd? Or the 'check please!' man, who's nothing to do with being Asian, and say David Walliams as Royal Correspondant Peter Andre?

Well, Legba has already done a neat job of discussing the different relationships to stereotying that LB and Syal/Bhaskar/Wadia etc have.

Another distinction is that the GGM stuff works on two levels, in that there are points of explicitly speaking to the community it's lampooning. There's the odd Hindi catchphrase, for example, jokes that only 'we' get.

GGM does a wonderful job of being at the same time generally funny and speaking to its community. The writers/performers are clear that they want to be on TV/recognised as a good comedy show, not 'the Asian comedy show', but there's also plenty of stuff in there that is written for their mothers/cousins etc

The 'check please guy' is a perfect example. There's the 'terrible chat ups by man who thinks he's super suave' general laugh. Then thee's the styling, which references/lampoons some very specific Indian male presentations. So, actually, it *does* have a subcultural element to it.

Now, Daffyd may work on this level (and in fact, was on in the gay pub I was in last night, which would suggest that for some, it does), but that's a single character, and I'm dubious that the identifications that are going on there translate into a more connected view of Vicky Pollard/Bubbles and Desiree.

See also Flyboy's point about queasiness re VP dovetailing with 'chav'
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
09:23 / 25.11.05
Also, went to see Goodness Gracious Me do their live show a couple of years ago. Went with my family, which was interesting in itself, as there isn't another comedy show we'd all want to see together.

Saw it in Croydon, the audience was about 75% Asian. Convince me that when Lucas and Walliams tour, the audiences are full of people who form the basis for their characters. Oh, and as Flowers says, a little bit of 'blackface' for no apparent reason...

And that's alot of what squicks me about LB. It's two white middle-class men who do a fair amount of grotesque humour based around gender and working class stereotypes.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
09:35 / 25.11.05
Yeah - I think you can see one sketch as offensive without assuming that all the sketches are offensive, or offensive in the same way. I don't think that it's enitrely fair of Johann Hari to call Matt Lucas closeted or conflicted for not talking about being gay in interviews without at least considering that one of his main comedy characters is all about the gayness. It's not a get out of jail free card, but it's certainly worth taking on board. But, again, there isn't anything like that going on with Vicky Pollard.
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
10:17 / 25.11.05
When I first saw Vicky Pollard, I did think it was very funny, mainly because it totally nailed a very specific (and where I live, very prominent) stereotype.

When I first saw Vicky Pollard, I thought she was a very funny character too. She was, as Hari notes, a fantastic comedic exaggeration of teenage inarticulacy. Alot of the humour was a about this, and about her total lack of boundaries/social skills. Ie, funny character traits rather than what she's become, which is a means to cheap, class-based laughs.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
10:49 / 25.11.05
Could you give an example of when this happened because looking back at her in the first season I think it was always somewhat class-based, she dropped out of school, tried to get served in a pub, went to prison, had a baby, aren't these the stereotypes of what working class girls do? (It's interesting the titles for s.2 and s.3 show her with six or seven kids, but they've never done a sketch of her with her children)
 
 
All Acting Regiment
11:09 / 25.11.05
I think it was always somewhat class-based, she dropped out of school, tried to get served in a pub, went to prison, had a baby, aren't these the stereotypes of what working class girls do?

Yes, although all teenagers try to get served in pubs so I'm not entirely sure that that particular scene was as much about class as the others. I agree, though- Pollard has always been a class-based sketch.

I think the satire in Peter Kay was a lot better, simply for being a lot gentler. Partly it took the mickey out of people from Bolton, but it also laughed at students. As well, the comedy was based on personalities and characters you could like or at least feel sorry for.

How does this compare to that animated series, Bromwell(?) High?
 
 
Spaniel
11:12 / 25.11.05
Peter Kay clearly feels a great deal of affection for his characters.
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
11:14 / 25.11.05
There's definitely a difference between gentle mockery and sneering.
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
11:25 / 25.11.05
Fair do's. Yes, she was always class-based, which was pretty annoying, but her appeal wasn't only class-based in the way I see as being now.

Haven't got any LB so I'm vague, but I'm thinking of sketches where she's trying to chat up someone else's boyfriend by basically sitting on him and thrusting/spinning around him on rollar skates/not understanding the word no/not seeing a situation for what it is.

Cringe-making and funny, and an grotesque exaggeration of actual teenage traits - hopeless social skills, inarticulacy, making up languages with yr mates etc which I don't (or I guess didn't see) as being bound to class. Don't all teenagers have these?

Quite possibly I should have been more aware that they were binding them to a particular snobbish class portrait. I do however also think this angle has become far more pronounced and the character stuff in the character much less so.
 
 
Goodness Gracious Meme
11:40 / 25.11.05
Cringe-making and funny, the cringe being partly about recognising your own teenage madnesses as well as laughing at the grotesque. Eg thinking of that sketch, I remember feeling the 'who hasn't made a complete tit of themselves over someone they fancy/seen someone totally convinced that they're 'in there' with someone totally uninterested' the response pretty strongly. I don't think VP as she's played now has much of that left.
 
 
Cat Chant
11:51 / 25.11.05
Flowers asked: what is [Hari's] problem with Daffyd?

What I think Hari meant is that the humour in Daffyd has switched focus over the series. The joke started off being about a very specific subcultural phenomenon - the gay person whose sense of identity is absolutely bound up with their position as the target of homophobia. To me, that's an exaggeration of something I do see around - people who say, in effect, you can tell I'm REALLY gay because I have such a hard time, no-one would ever CHOOSE to be hated and reviled all the time, and if you do 'choose' to be gay you must just be a bi-curious dilettante because teh gay is all about TEH HATE. But as the show's progressed, the humour has become more about the fact that Daffyd is completely delusional: less and less about the way Daffyd constructs his identity, that is, and more and more about the idea that there is no homophobia anywhere, so that the implication becomes that anyone who sees homophobia is just making it up.

Some really interesting questions being raised on the relation of reception to meaning. I have the feeling, as I've said before, that something in LB actually constructs an 'implied audience' whose response is as documented on the messageboards, Richard Littlejohn's columns, etc. I don't think that that's the only way to read it, but I do think Hari's argument is quite convincing - that the show is responding to the way it's being read and subtly shifting the basis of its humour towards a less subversive discourse (as outlined with respect to Daffyd above).
 
 
Ex
14:41 / 25.11.05
In response to Deva, I haven't seen much of the series, but have noticed a difference between kinds of Dafydd sketch, and in part for me it's definitely about audience reception.
For instance, I liked an early sketch in which Dafydd went for an STD check-up despite never having had sex. To me, having been an LGBT officer in the middle of Wales, it seemed familiar enough to be funny - the gap between urban Gay Identity (safe-sex information everywhere, mandatory rubber trousers), and rural gay experience (most of my mates not getting a shag).
There was another gay bloke in the waiting room and they had a little commiseratory talk - 'I'm not too worried, but only takes one time, doesn't it?' Dafydd responding with a miserable: 'Yeah...'
I felt that it was a subcultural joke that a mainstream audience could get. The doctor and the other gay man were taking the process seriously, and although Dafydd was wildly misjudging things, nothing suggested that safe sex wasn't a big issue, or that STD checks aren't nerve-wracking.

The other style of Dafydd sketch I've seen, in which he manufactures an isolation which doesn't exist, seems different to me. It's a midly amusing premise that there's a gay Star Trek club meeting in every pub in Wales. But do the audience really know that there isn't? I used to have to drive for four hours to get to a gay pub. Do the audience know that many people's mothers don't suggest that their gay sons need a decent shag? If there's no audience understanding of homophobia, then the joke stops being amusing in two directions, and becomes a laugh at a whiny gay Welsh man.
I haven't watched the series in a while because my discomfort depleted my amusement, but I'm dissapointed if the joke has been stretched until it's entirely the latter kind.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
09:59 / 26.11.05
Watched the second episode of the new series. Even the new characters are tired on their second outing. I'll be giving up here then. As I turned the telly on this morning News 24 were just finishing an article which seemed to have two people in the studio defending 'Little Britain', I don't know whether that was because of the Incontinence Society complaint from earlier in the week or whether there's any greater discontent.
 
 
Char Aina
11:11 / 26.11.05
they've never done a sketch of her with her children

they have now.
i saw a sketch on a recently aired show wherein she gets a job as a phone sex operator and tells them to wait outside for the duration.
she had six, i believe.

i hadnt seen the show in a while and was initially comng here torail off, but i see now that every gripe i had has been adequately if not expertly outlined already.

i always felt it was almost a really funny show, but it has of late(i think we all know wherefore) lost all its mirth.

pah, and also meh.

i hope lucas and walliams can the show soon so they can progress.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
14:52 / 26.11.05
Yeah, typical that when I don't watch an episode straight away and say they haven't done something they then go and do it.
 
 
Our Lady Has Left the Building
14:16 / 18.12.05
The good news seems to be that the show was losing viewers fast (25% by episode three) so people are going around saying things like "Oh, the third series was always intended to be the last... best leave on a high before they outstay their welcome..." and so on. I may watch the South Bank Show profile on them to find out why they decided to swap the surreal humour of the first series for the racism, sexism, ageism etc of the rest of it.

Meanwhile, have a link to the worst anti-show site ever.
 
  

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