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IP Blockage

 
 
Hieronymus
17:56 / 30.07.03
Last night I found my Barbelith accessed curbed by a blocking of my IP address. After asking Tom about it, he indicated that blocking of certain IPs were necessary for new persons who were trolling and being genuinely abrasive. After which, he quickly and kindly reset my membership on the board so I could post. Tom's the proverbial bomb.

So how rampant is this right now? And is there any way that warnings can be given out that IP addresses will be blocked?
 
 
Linus Dunce
19:04 / 30.07.03
With many ISPs offering free trials, wouldn't a notice defeat the object?
 
 
*
03:58 / 31.07.03
I had the same problem. It wasn't too much of a bother for me, although I'm sure Tom was inundated with requests/queries/death threats from trolls.

But as for the trolling problem, maybe it's because I'm a relative newbie and it's always taken care of by the mods before I even see it, but I never see any trollage. The system looks to be working quite well.

Maybe the great modgods are doing their job too well, in that if the rest of us mortals are never aware there's a problem, we'll be less understanding when drastic measures like mass IP blocks have to be taken. At any rate I'm grateful for the service Tom and the modgods provide in keeping the board free of that inevitable rabble whose only goal in life is to annoy and prevent intelligent discussion. I'm willing to put up with an occasional IP block if Tom is willing to take the trouble to reinstate me and soothe my neurotic fears that I somehow offended someone irreparably, e.g. by engaging in wanton aging gothic lolita bashing possibly.
 
 
Tom Coates
15:29 / 31.07.03
Yeah - the IP banning thing is far from ideal, and I might turn it off now. Basically I've been forced to stop all new registrations for the moment while I reconsider our position in this matter. Having Andrew and his ilk on the board is just as destructive as it always has been and I'm not prepared to let it continue. I have various plans at the moment about how to deal with this problem more seriously. More on them as I find ways of articulating them...
 
 
pointless and uncalled for
18:27 / 31.07.03
On the subject of registrations, I notice that we are at high numbers of registered users again. I would suggest that this is another time to erase long dormant, low usage suits again. If a suit has barely been used and not in some time, I don't think it would constitute a great loss to the owner to have to re-register should they choose to return. This should combat certain activity that has been common to trolls in the past, such as creating a stash of suits for later usage.
 
 
Matthew Fluxington
21:55 / 31.07.03
It should be known that Qalyn, aka The Q, has had his IP blocked too. Qalyn's one of the good guys, please let him back in.
 
 
Sax
05:56 / 01.08.03
The rampant name changing probably hasn't done much to help either.

Apart from Sam Vega, who's okay by me.
 
 
Tom Coates
06:17 / 01.08.03
I've stopped the IP blocking on that particular ISP now, but I don't have time to contact everyone who was affected by it. If you know of people who have been blocked recently in America, could you e-mail them and let them know they should be able to get back in again...
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
10:01 / 01.08.03
Could somebody- preferably not Tom, because I assume he has his hands full right now- explain to me, in very simple terms this whole IP blocking thing? Is it like if someone's on Freeserve and is blocked, everyone else on FS is too, or just those in the locale? Or does it work some totally other way? I'm just curious.

BTW- if it's overly complicated, don't bust a gut.
 
 
Tom Coates
10:42 / 01.08.03
Right. When you come online, your ISP gives you an IP address - IP being internet protocol. This is a unique identifier assigned to you, normally for the length of your session online, but sometimes its stable over time. Each ISP has a range of IP addresses that it is able to allocate to its customers.

Every single thing you do online basically involves that IP address. Every time you request a web page, image, file to be downloaded to your computer, you send your current IP address, time, the browser you are using etc. etc. etc. to the server with the file on it. This is inbuilt to the architecture of the internet and has been since its beginnings...

NOW - for the most part there is no way of associating an IP address with a person, because each time you go online you might get assigned a different one by your ISP. But you can work on the principle that an individual person will - for the most part - use the same IP range, because that's all that's available to their ISP. You can easily identify the ISP someone uses if you know their IP address when they've posted, and Barbelith records IP addresses for precisely this reason (just like almost all other community sites) - so that if you have significant problems with abuse/spamming/denial-of-service-attacks etc you can contact ISPs directly and get them to act. The ISP themselves will have details about which IP address was assigned to which account-holder at any given moment - this is information that they use to combat spammers. They are very uncomfortable (quiet rightly) about giving that information out - recognising that being able to associate an IP address directly with a credit card and a person's name and address could be profoundly worrying if in the hands of marketeers or governments...

On Barbelith, on several occasions, we've been forced to block whole IP ranges in order to stop the board disintegrating under attacks from trolls (where attack is defined even as simply as a recurrent and unwelcome reassertion of presence that tends to derail the communities attempts at normal operation).

So - basically what happens is this - when there is a notable problem with a troll on Barbelith (and the number of trolls is very low, although they may have a number of suits and are very vocal with them) - I look up their IP address to find out which ISP they're connecting with. I then to a search to find out if any other user names have posted with the same IP address recently - which normally means that they're the same real-life user connecting under different names. Then I check the IP range and see how many users have connected via that range. If that figure seems relatively low, then I block that ISP from Barbelith completely.

In principle this means that no one from that ISP can ever post on Barbelith again (until I relax that restriction), but in practice Cal and I built in a back-door which means that we can allow individual users access to the board even if their IP address is in the problematic range. At the moment it's up to me to choose who gets that approval or not - and I use several criteria which are: has the user posted regularly beforehand (if so and they're not a troll, then they get access), if they have not posted regularly then they can't be using a free e-mail address, because these can so easily be gotten hold of, and are ideal for protecting your privacy. Often I ask people if they have an academic institution e-mail address or a work e-mail address that they'd be prepared to provide instead. If they can do that, and confirm their membership in an appropriate way, then they can get entry even if they haven't posted much before. These criteria are revised on the fly every so often depending on whether or not a problem emerges...

The recent problems have been the result of a particularly difficult user whose IP range I banned without realising the impact it would have on the rest of the board's users on the East Coast of the States... Apologies to everyone - I've now taken off the restriction and instituted a 'no new users' policy until we can fix this issue more appropriately...
 
 
STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK
11:30 / 01.08.03
Thanks, Tom... (again, many times over)
 
 
8===>Q: alyn
12:19 / 01.08.03
Thanks, Tom.
 
 
Helmschmied
13:25 / 01.08.03
I'll have to throw in an additional "thanks Tom" :-) I always wondered how the whole IP thing worked.

Just as a note....I'm in the Toronto area...not the east coast of the US.
 
 
iconoplast
20:19 / 01.08.03
Could something similar be done with a combination of blocking new users from an IP range, and deleting certain user accounts?
 
 
iconoplast
20:22 / 01.08.03
(Oh. And thank's, Tom)
 
 
Tom Coates
21:00 / 01.08.03
Could you expand on that a little?
 
 
straylight
03:13 / 02.08.03
Just chiming in with another thank you - and I wanted to note that I too am not on the East Coast, but the far western US. I use earthlink, though, so I assume it's just so universal that I would have gotten blocked anyway (if that sentence even made sense...)
 
 
iconoplast
23:57 / 02.08.03
Well, if there's a case of trolling, instead of Banning a block of IPs from logging in, would it be easier or harder to ban that range of IPs from creating new usenames, and delete the username(s) that prompted the action, as opposed to banning the IPs from logging in, then allowing individual users access despite the ban?

I guess this wouldn't work that well if they've made themselves a slew of identities beforehand, though...
 
 
Spatula Clarke
13:39 / 03.08.03
I think in this case it's the slew of identities that's part of the problem, but that seems like a good idea if any similar action's needed in future.
 
 
Who's your Tzaddi?
21:21 / 04.08.03
As one of the blocked posters on the, erm, "east coast", I am wondering if someone could point out the offender so I won't take it so personal?

(...hope its not him...)
 
 
Spatula Clarke
22:25 / 04.08.03
If you don't think it's you then it's not. I don't think it takes a huge amount of effort to figure out who's causing the problems that have led to this - all you have to do is take a peek at some of the other threads in this forum and recent ones in Conversation.
 
  
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