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... >0< ... for mod!

  
 
—| x |—
20:10 / 14.06.03
Hello. After an appropriate think about it I’ve decided that I would like to step up and take on a bit more responsibility wrt this community. What I mean is that I would like to volunteer to take on some moderation duties so long as this is acceptable to the members of this community and if there is a need for additional moderators. I’d like to moderate in the Headshop, since I am quite active there, and/or take on moderation duties in the Magick as this is a forum that gets the second most attention from me.

Now, I’ve noticed that the Headshop has seven mods and that the Magick has five. However, it seems to me that most (or all?) mods in the Headshop are based in the UK, and so, my being based in AB, Canada means that I am often active in the community when these other people are sleeping: I could easily take care of moderation requests during periods when it is likely that these other mods are unavailable.

As well, I feel (in spite of a few isolated incidents) that I am (mostly) a reasonable and fair member of this community, and have been present here as a member for close to two and a half years. In other words, I have what I think to be a reasonable “feel” for the dynamics of this community, its members, and some sense of the overall direction and purpose of Barbelith in itself.

So, there ya’ have it. I’d like to enlarge my role in this community if it is appropriate and reasonable to do so. So what do people figure?
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
21:57 / 14.06.03
As an FYI, in the Head Shop, Wembley is based outside the UK (she was in the Americas, and then Finland, I think - not sure where she is now), Mister Disco is based in Australia, as will Award-Winning Slash Writer Deva be later this year. Of the administrators, who can also vote on mod actions, at least one is based in the US.

There are probably three questions here:

1) Should people be encouraged to put themselves forward for mods (Ops! Ops!)

2) Do we need more moderators in the Head Shop/the Magick?

3) Should >0< be made a moderator?

I don't have an opinion on (1), although I can see (a) that arch-democrats might see the current system of appointment by fiat as unrepresentative. On the other hand, (b) it's Tom's dollar, and a process in which Mods are selected or deselected by mass approval might be cumbersome in the extreme.

On (2), I don't think that the Head Shop is actually in need of more moderators. The distributive system means that there is an equation between number of moderators and ease of change-making, and the calibration in the HS is, I would suggest, probably about right. I'm not so sure about the Magick - however, as an administrator I have noticed that the number of requests for moderation in the Magick is fairly low and it seems to be cycling pretty well.

So....I'm not sure there is a need for more moderators (2), which is handy in a sense because it saves having to address (3), which I think would be awkward. I will, however, say that >0< would be a controversial appointment (which is not necessarily to say a bad one - I'd rather that we didn't move on to personal qualities unless absolutely necessary) in both the Head Shop and the Magic. However, a desire to help is a good and laudable thing, and the Conversation in particular has a low active mod to traffic ratio. This *might* be a useful place for more modding...

As for how to go about the process - well, I'm not sure. I have my doubts about the advisability of a full & frank discussion of >0<'s qualities in open field - it might be difficult for him and for others. If Tom feels that there is a case for more moderators, then I might suggest that he contacts the moderators of the threads in question and asks whom they would nominate (willingness to serve would be a factor here), and those likely fellows then be asked if they fancy mods.
 
 
Kit-Cat Club
22:15 / 14.06.03
Perhaps it might be worth waiting until Tom and Cal have introduced the exciting and scary-sounding (but undefined) innovations Tom keeps dangling in front of us? They might not have anything to do with moderation - but then again, they might...
 
 
Spatula Clarke
22:33 / 14.06.03
Agreed. I'm also not aware of any real need for more mods in those particular fora. I'd say that the best time to put yourself forward as a possible mod is if there's ever a recognised problem with actions not going through fast enough or Tom decides to shuffle mods on a semi-regular basis (as was originally planned).
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
12:56 / 15.06.03
In the interests of transparency, I have just moved for the above post to be deleted. Partly because it is threadrot, being an attack on me rather than an attempt to discuss how mod powers should be assigned, but primarily because Andrew, having very nearly closed Barbelith down, having stalked Tom and having been uniquely excluded from Barbelith, does not get to discuss how we administrate it.

For more, see here and here.

On words from above:

Right. Here you go. The way Barbelith is moderated is supposed to stop any individual moderator having absolute power over anything - and as such represents a kind of weird oligarchy or sharing of power rather than the kind of beneficient despotism of most other boards. The paradigm is a new one though - even though we've been using it for over a year now, it's not well-known outside these walls (at least not yet) so I appreciate that it's probably a shock for newcomers. At the moment - yes - there is the slight risk of cliques arising in moderators who can then do what they want around the board. I don't think it happens that much - if at all - but I appreciate that it could.

In the future (at some point) people may start to be able to vote in moderators in an actually democratic fashion, which should make things slightly more interesting and should stop that cliquiness emerging...
 
 
Ganesh
13:58 / 15.06.03
I'm not sure that anyone has ever proposed that Barbelith is a "democratic system", nor that it aspire to be one. Let's wait for Tom's take on this, hmm?
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
16:22 / 15.06.03
This thread also has some interesting stuff on the role of moderation, and stepping down/churning mods.
 
 
—| x |—
19:07 / 15.06.03
Hmm, I’m not sure what’s happened here: why is there a bunch of bold text that seem to be quotes all assembled by Haus regarding the Knowledge—especially if Knowledge’s original message to this thread has been deleted? This seems to not have much to do with the topic of this thread. Perhaps it should be deleted as well?

“1) Should people be encouraged to put themselves forward for mods?”

I think this question is slightly ill-formed. It seems to me that many of the mods volunteered themselves for the position. The difference, then, between that and my volunteering is clearly that others volunteered in response to a request of need for moderators whereas I have volunteered without such a request. This is why I clearly say I am volunteering “if there is a need for additional moderators.” If there isn’t, then fine.

Now, more as an aside but still something I’d like to address:

“I am not sure that an open discussion of *anybody's* qualities as a potential moderator would not cause discomfort to the person being discussed and to the participants in the discussion.”

Wrt me personally, it seems that there have been a few occasions were my “qualities” have been in open discussion (although not wrt being a mod specifically (actually, it was about being “mod,” but not “a mod” but “the mod”—but you get what I mean!))—I’m pretty used to this and not so put off or made to be too uncomfortable by it. Of course, this isn’t a license or invitation to begin yet another discussion on my “qualities,” but merely an observation and report on such a matter as it relates to me specifically.

Anyway, as far as I’m concerned, my volunteering for moderation duties isn’t about any “power grab” or secret “Ops” or such nonsense. I am simply trying to offer my services in light of the fact that, other than my contributions via posts, I am unable to help out this community in any other manner—and I’d like to. I can’t donate to the board via PayPal ‘cause I’m terminally broke, but I can donate my time. However, and again, if there isn’t a need for my time to be put to use via moderation duties, then there is no need for me to become a moderator. It’s pretty simple, really.

So, if the Conversation really does need another moderator, then I’d be happy to lend a hand there—even if it wasn’t my choice of where I’d like to moderate. If it doesn’t, then, and again, I have no "bad feelings" about not being appointed to moderation duties.

Thank you.

PS: It was also merely a good laugh for me to call this thread “… >0< … for mod!” because I am already “mod”!
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
04:26 / 16.06.03
"Ops" in my post above being, of course, a reference to IRC, rather than SAS.
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
16:27 / 17.06.03
I don't have much of a problem with 'Chrome' being a moderator, though I would have more of a problem with Laila being a mod, if she's still around. At the risk of bringing up old arguments, is the ...>0<... suit still available to at least three people whenever they want to post anything, at least one of whom believes ze can smell paedophiles? If that were so then I would be most uncomfortable about the suit having moderating abilities. However, based on the remarks about Hitler in the last big thread ...>0<... was involved with I wonder whether other people may not want 'that kind of person' moderating.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
16:33 / 17.06.03
Hang on, hang on...

>0< is formerly modthree, and is available to one person, that person being Canadian. He's not, to my knowledge, involved at all with the Bendt Chromeo, RRM or Laila suits, on a suit-sharing level.

That's right, isn't it, >0
  
 
Eloi Tsabaoth
17:00 / 17.06.03
It's the >>s. That's what is causing the confusion.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
17:33 / 17.06.03
Ah, I see....yes, that makes sense. They also keep turning things into meaningless HTML. As, in fact, they have to my post above, so the end of it is missing.
 
 
—| x |—
18:43 / 17.06.03
">Biznuth<," eh?--very nice!

Sorry about the html wack-stuff, but I've no problems with it myself!

And yes, I've no connection with any of the Greenland crew (why are there people who think this?) or Hitler: I drink milk, eat meat, enjoy whole wheat toast, and don't have anything against people simply because they come from Jewish blood.

As well, this suit is used by me and only me, and yes, I am the m3 to g-o-d-o-g!
 
 
Our Lady of The Two Towers
14:55 / 18.06.03
So what is Chrome's ID this hour then?
 
 
Less searchable M0rd4nt
17:21 / 18.06.03
I'm confused. I recently saw the ID 60p06 and assumed that was mod/godog too, but I thought when that you change your suit the name change affects yr past posts? As mod's still represented as ...>0<... , who's 60p06? Do we have a doppleganger problem again? Or what? Help! BRANE go melty!
 
 
—| x |—
18:08 / 18.06.03
No, no--sorry about your melty brain. I am 6opo6 and I am ... >0< ... I have two (and only two suits). So, mostly I post from this suit, but occasionally I post from the godog suit. I think that the difference, for me, is that in this suit I will take more care to explain myself and engage in discussion, whereas with the godog I’ve taken to using this suit on (rare) occasions when I feel like posting more enigmatic messages that, while they might contain numerological, alchemical, or “magickal” linguistic formulations, I am not so interested in unfolding or discussing—messages left intentionally obscure and opaque because the “mystery” is an integral aspect of the meaning.

An aside, but related to my use of these two suits is the fact that the whole mod series/MODZILLA/el Zilcho/… >0< … is a persona developed from the godog suit, and is exclusively a result of my interaction and participation with this community. The godog (grey order disorder grey) persona is something that I created that predates my participation in this (or any online related) community by about seven years: it is the name of my “cult” of one, which I developed after spending a few years reading about magick—it is the name that encompasses my magickal pursuits, thoughts, workings, etc..

What is interesting for me in this nowadays is that I am no longer able to clearly distinguish which of the two suits is “superiour” in a hierarchical sense. That is, it used to be clear that the “mod” suit was like a subset of the godog, but these days it seems that the “mod” in me is more vast than the godog. But I suppose this is more of interest to me than it is to other people!
 
 
We're The Great Old Ones Now
08:11 / 19.06.03
I thought we had a ban on multiple suits now? I considered re-registering with a new identity for my return to Barbelith, but actually, it was too much fuss. And I'd still have to be Nick to moderate.
 
 
—| x |—
08:23 / 19.06.03
A ban?! That seems a pretty strong word for Litherland.

It seemed to me more like an agreement, and not necessarily a binding one; rather, one that can be violated upon the discretion of the individual with respect to his or her intent, use, and function of secondary suit. Moreover, I've had these two suits since close to the dawn of the latest era. As well, I've been more or less up front about it several times over the last year or so.
 
 
ONLY NICE THINGS
09:20 / 19.06.03
We do have a ban, basically, but it's one thatr *can* be honoured in the breach. for example, I have two suits, one registered when I was locked out of the first in a boardquake, and asked Tom to kill the spare; he reolied that it's not a huge deal if it just happens that you have more than one suit circumstantially; I use it sometimes when I am out and about and forget the poassword for my main suit. Likewise, since Mod3's two suits are both possessed of a clear owner, and have not yet been used to get around banning, masquerade as a new poster, or any of the other things you can do with a multiple suit, it doesn't sound like a particular problem. If Nick returned with a new identity but continued to use the Nick suit...well, I don't know, If he was only using "Nick" to moderate then I don't see what the problem would be, except that we would have an invisible and potentially unaccountable moderator and he would not be able to help to encourage his forumn or fora...on the other hand, he could perhaps notify Tom of the situation and see what he thought.

So, Mod having two suits registered, as long as both of those suits are identified asbelonging to the saem person and neityher is misused, is, by my guess, probably not a huge deal. If one of those suits became a moderator, things get a bit more complicated, as it means that the other suit could theoretcially propose a moderation to its own thread posts and then >0< could log back in as the moderator and immediately OK it - a purely hypothetical situation, of course.

I don't think "ban" is a strong word for Litherland, though. A number of things have been banned in the history of Barbelith, in order to allow the community to continue to function. In this case, for example, malicious use of multiple suits is very clearly banned, and will continue to be so until further notice. The circumstances under which this ban was levelled where such that the continued existence of the board was under threat, and those circumstances were seen as justifying extreme mneasures. One does not have complete freedom of speech or action on Barbelith, although I think everything that can be done to maximise both is and will be done.
 
 
cusm
22:17 / 19.06.03
Well, digressions aside, having another magick mod couldn't hurt and I think he's certainly good for the job. I'm all for putting modivated people to work. Though all the same there's no pressing need, either. So, take as you will.
 
 
Regrettable Juvenilia
09:52 / 23.07.03
How's this working out so far for everyone?
 
 
Jack Denfeld
10:30 / 24.07.03
The moderator thing? Going ok so far. Haven't had a whole lot to do really in my sector, The Switchboard. Everyone's pretty coherant, on topic, and I guess in general it's not exactly the Wild West of Barbelith. The most I've really done so far is add some really generic summaries for some topics which didn't have any, my feeling being that if the summary wasn't done by the creator of the topic, then I should just keep it really simple for people to know what it was about and for them to be able to look it up by keywords later if they wanted to.
 
  
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