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How do you identify?

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13:05 / 15.05.03

Lazy bum.

(oooh sounds like a medical complaint!)

Besides the above I know what you mean about them being a bit ill fitting. It always annoys me when you meet knew people and they say "so what do you do?" like it's a defining part of you. Of course I might just be bitter because I have a boring job.

pointless and uncalled for

13:33 / 15.05.03

I try never to label myself. I have in the past but it tends to lead to being self-limiting.

I find labels, especially self-applied ones, sell people far to short.

As said in Fight Club "You are not your job,......."

To me people are so far different from each other that they each require a unique label. I find the face is quite good for this. But then, I am a photographer so visual labels mean more to me.

13:33 / 15.05.03

Well, I'm Asian, but I don't go around thinking "I'm Asian" all the time, only when people talk about Cho Chan (for example), and I do have this horrible idea for a self-exploitative Cindy Sherman --> <-- Suzy Wong thingy that I'm going straight to hell for... which leads me to, go ahead and stamp ASSHOLE on my face, but I identify mainly as an artist. If by label you mean a kind of key or organizing principle? Also as a depressive, sad to say.

13:43 / 15.05.03

Lately any word that describes me in the 'I am' sense has started to give me an icky feeling.

So, by label, I mean, what words do you feel *comfortable* using to describe yourself? So I think we're on the same page...

13:43 / 15.05.03

As I've said elsewhere, I really dislike labels. That seems to be a pretty common attitude hereabouts.

13:48 / 15.05.03

Yes, but people do use them - 'I am a (insert gender here)', 'I am a (insert job here)', 'I am a (insert hobby here)', 'I am (insert sexual preference here'), 'I am (insert religious denomination here') and a lot of people do use them quite cheerfully. And labels, as has been evidenced plenty of times on Barbelith before, can be big elongated things as particular to the person as the beard on their face. And a lot of people have a few self-descriptions that they are happy with... I'm not exactly sure what I am getting at here, other than i thought it would be interesting to encourage people to sit down and go "I can quite happily think "I am a..."', and then analyse that...

There's a thing about forced labels, ones that society insists you take on, like 'I am British', for instance. But also ones you'll happily take on, like 'I am a guitar player' or something, you know... and the ones that are kind of in-between.

pointless and uncalled for

13:50 / 15.05.03

I'll resort to "photographer" then, for that is what I am, first and formost. Beyond that nothing else seems to need to be said.

13:58 / 15.05.03

"I am a writer" always did give me hives. Of course, I don't write anymore... problem solved! I think that "I'm an artist" works for me because it's about how I go through the world... it has more to do with my outlook than my output?

14:00 / 15.05.03

Oh, I know! Because I mean it to describe myself psychologically, not professionally.

Won't hog the thread no more.

14:02 / 15.05.03

Nooo, hog away. I think this is kind of the point.

14:11 / 15.05.03

Over on the label-lovin' Cross + Flame, I described myself as a Gay Agnostic Psychiatrist (as in 'mind the...'). These are probably the most 'mainstream' spheres within which I describe myself. In more rarefied arenas, those labels break down further (for example, 'psychiatrist' can be subdivided into psychiatric grade, speciality, workplace, etc., and 'gay' along fetish lines).

I seem to remember good ol' Russell T Davies, when receiving flak for 'Bob and Rose', opining that we need more labels - at least fifty million more. I'd go with that.

14:14 / 15.05.03

I've also gotten quite down on being labelled of late- another one squirming with discomfort when asked "what do you do?". For a while I was quite happy to be referred to as "a journalist" but I'm not now- feel people will have a load of assumptions about me as a result, which (I hope) don't fit with me.
An idea I've come across when reading some stuff about NLP is that people behave, to an extent, according to the labels and identifications they've picked up. Someone with a strong identification as "a writer", for instance, will tend to read differently from someone else. Maybe that's true...but yeah, whether or not you feel comfortable with other people knowing you use that label or using it as a professional label is another matter.
Anyway -to answer your question- ehhhh...labels I'm happy with about myself: male, Scottish, ...can't think of too many

14:24 / 15.05.03

I'm a white-Northern-atheistic-journalist-married-father-to-be-cat-owning-Kerouac-reading-Smiths-fan-also-into-
Orbital-writer-working-class-no-scratch-that-middle-class-surely-with-the-job-I-do-homeowning-got-a-car-but
-it's-a-crap-one-hedonistic-quiet-nights-in-likes-Buffy-hates-Star-Trek-oh-except-old-Star-Trek-reads-comics
-reads-literature-used-to-be-in-a-band-in-fact-it's-still-going-rock-climbing-keep-fit-fanatic. Except I don't go to the gym much.

And that's only the fucking half of it.

14:30 / 15.05.03

Exactly my type.

Regrettable Juvenilia

14:35 / 15.05.03

I think a few people may be being a teeny weeny bit disingenuous here, even if its accidental. Sure, labels bad, "all these labels be trying to pull us in like spiders in a web" as the RZA helpfully said. But surely we all occasionally use certain shorthands to describe different aspects of our identity? And the exact words we use may be important to us to a greater or lesser extent. For instance, I identify as male, but am keener on 'boy' than 'man' for a variety of reasons. I identify as heterosexual, but I try to avoid the word 'straight' wherever possible, again for different reasons ranging from the political to linguistic aesthetics...

Whisky Priestess

14:45 / 15.05.03

I am terribly terribly bad at asking people the question I most hate to be asked myself, i.e. what do you do? I hate being asked it because what I do for money (a series of low-grade admin and bar jobs) is totally unrepresentative of what I do them in order to be able to do - i.e. write and act without starving in the gutter.

But equally, I am not happy calling myself an actor/writer because I am not yet a professional (although I very occasionally get paid for both) in either field. Plus, anyone can call themselves a writer, if they write - it's too easy a label to adopt. It's getting other people to call you a writer and pay you for writing that's the hard part. And I assume that if I were to answer the "what do you do" question with Writer/Actor the questioner would assume that I was professional and that's not fair to the professionals.

I really feel very strongly that professional recognition/remuneration is fundamental to being able to be a writer/actor/artist/ whatever (because it's a sign that your work is taken seriously by someone other than your friends) rather than being a plumber/accountant/skivvy/waitress who writes. But I realise a lot of people don't think of it that way.

As for labels other than professional ones, I don't mind much. White, feamle, het, English (which I prefer to British, because it's more accurate). But the job label really is the important one because whatever you say you do, (unless you follow it up with "But I'm also a champion sufer in my spare time") people will subconsciously assume that that is your purpose and function in life. They shouldn't, but they do ...

15:43 / 15.05.03

I remember reading a piece by Neil Tennant, of Pet Shop Boys infamy, where he spoke out in defence of hate.

And I'd have to agree with one thing he said, which is it is easier to define yourself negatively. I have a whole host of things which I define myself with by virtue of NOT being them; right wing, conventionally religious, etc etc.

But I find it harder to be able to say I am x, y, or z. I identify myself through my notness, I think.

16:28 / 15.05.03

Yergh, I don't want anyone to think that I would ever answer "I'm an artist" if I was asked what I did. Even though I'm not very high on professionalism!

16:51 / 15.05.03

"spot"

Our Lady of The Two Towers

17:04 / 15.05.03

I go through periods of disdaining labels and then not minding them, taking on labels that are false just to mess with/irritate people. At the moment I'm a queer non-op transexual transvestite.

With tulips and ice-cream.

Though not together.

17:16 / 15.05.03

Following with this identification through notness idea, it seems like we even reject the labels, we're closest too. Hmm... I wrote a bit about this in the Magick Forum a while back. I don't really identify with the term "Magician" even though this is probably my biggest interest and sucker-up of time/activities - it doens't seem appropriate for what I do, really. Person Interested in My Process (or Pimp as someone suggested) seemed more accurate, as I'm not up all night summoning demons or getting possessed by hideous entities from beyond the void (I wouldn't rule either of those 2 activites out though, just not on a week night)

Phil Hine: "Our sense of self is drawn from the "solid" buildings of consensus reality.. yet our sense of being a unique individual comes from the little ways we resist complete total assimilation into these structures".

17:31 / 15.05.03

Definitely agree about even the labels which we might seem most likely to take being ones which we refuse to take up.

I think there's something interesting to be said about the difference between a label and a description... but that could be what I've been getting at the whole time, who knows?

gotham island fae

17:54 / 15.05.03

SOME of the identifiers I have attached, removed and re-attached over time: straight, lesbian, bi, queer, Christian, agnostic, gnostic, pagan, wizard, pothead, drunk, actor, artist, bookworm, white, male, female, boy, man, misandrist, Trekkie, comic-book fanboy, soda-jerk, server, administrative assistant, mad monkey-god of chaos, good listener, lover, friend, weird uncle, brother, and son.

As to the "What do you do?" question/response, I always qualify the asking with "To pay bills or to sing my soul?" The reaction to that clarification determines how much inner truth the questor receives.

And I have never even thought about calling myself a writer, though I do so incessantly.

gotham island fae

18:15 / 15.05.03

Oh. And I forgot feminist.

Less searchable M0rd4nt

18:49 / 15.05.03

Career:

Falied is my favourite word at the moment. Failed electronics engineer. Failed writer. Failed this, failed that, failed the other. It hurt like hell for a while, then I just said it often enough and I realised it didn't mean anything. To make ends meet I've washed bogs, worked tills, soldered, checked for shorts and dry joints, put pendants on chains, swept streets, reamed knuckles (no, really)... loads of stuff. The only thing I've ever done consistantly is write. I've done that since I was three. It may never have got me a job but it's kept me out of care, and later kept me out of the looneybin.

Gender:
Still not entirely happy with female, but not really male either. Or neuter. Always liked that quote from Carwash: "More man than you'll ever be, more woman than you'll ever have." Not sure that's me, but it's what I shoot for.

R/ships: I've been with Lurid Archive for six years. Diggin' it. He likes Star Wars more than me, but apart from that we get on okay.

18:52 / 15.05.03

Unfortunately Xoc's callous labelling of you in the Photos thread has rather stayed with me Fraeter Fae. That would be in the "soul singing" category I suppose.

19:02 / 15.05.03

I've been with Lurid Archive for six years. Diggin' it. He likes Star Wars more than me, but apart from that we get on okay.

Ohhhkaaayyy!?! Ohhhhkkkaaayyyy!?!?!?!?!?! I think we can do better than that.

Solitaire Rose as Tom Servo

19:12 / 15.05.03

I am as my e-mail and all of my ex girlfriends call me:

A Lousy Rat Bastard.

gotham island fae

19:25 / 15.05.03

Unfortunately Xoc's callous labelling of you in the Photos thread has rather stayed with me Fraeter Fae.

Now, now, HIR, I never once mentioned dom...

And from Lurid Archive's wonderful veiled reference, another addition...

Transylvanian.

19:48 / 15.05.03

I identify with a magnifying glass, field guide, killing jar and scalpel.

Conversely, I identify most commonly as a tabloid poet (vocation) and as a Taoist Gnostic (religion).

He likes Star Wars more than me, but apart from that we get on okay.

Geez, if I liked any movie more than my wife I wouldn't let on.

My Mom Thinks I'm Cool

01:29 / 16.05.03

when I saw this thread, the first thing I thought was "I'm a Jerk!" so I guess that's what's going on in my subconcious right now.

When someone asks "what do you do?" I never even think of my job or my degree. I acquired a prison pen-pal a while back and in the process of getting to know her in over 50 letters have still not explained my job or my schooling. They seem to have nothing to do with me. I know what you mean about feeling nervous claiming "writer". I don't know about getting paid but I'd definitely like to write something that was a)meaninful and b)read by more than just me, before I claim Writerness.

How about totem animals? As in "I'm a scorpion dreaming"?

"Bisexual" seems like a stupid thing to have a word for.
"What do you not like to have sex with?"
"Uh, nothing?"
"Right, we have a word for that then."

Howabout "bisexual with a weakness for women"?

02:51 / 16.05.03

Oy. Lots of labels for me...

Bisexual (as in: gender isn't the first thing I look at when deciding how much of what sort of intimacy I want to share with a person), switch, with a fondness for genderfuck.

I identify as "mostly female" and the body matches that pretty well (hourglass figure with broad shoulders and a tendency to put on an unfeminine amount of muscle if I lift weights; I do get mistaken for male on occasion even in San Francisco).

Scientist, by profession and temperment...
Magician rather than witch.

02:53 / 16.05.03

And working on "old fart" - at least by the average age here...

03:54 / 16.05.03

Someone just sent me an email asking 'what do you do?'. I just rambled on about how I plan lots and lots of trips, some
of which I actually get to take, read a lot of fiction, play the violin, try and learn Spanish, ride my bike around, play with the cat, and spend too much time in front of the computer.

If someone asked me in person, I would probably be at more of a loss at what to say... Feel the White Flame! (sorry. someone had to say it.)

04:55 / 16.05.03

S.P.Y.P.U.N.K.

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