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Altruism and individual charity

 
 
Ganesh
09:22 / 01.05.03
I'm aware that this is something we've discussed before on Barbelith but, in light of the recent debates and my own consequent rereading of shamefully-neglected social psychology textbooks, I feel it's a topic worth reopening. More personally, since moving to London, I've noticed shifts in my own patterns of charitable giving, and have given this some thought.

In recent years, it's been the prevailing view amongst social psychologists that there is no such thing as true altruism, either between animals or human beings. 'The Selfish Gene' encouraged us to view ourselves not as individual organisms but as ongoing reserves of genetic data which we work to preserve at all costs - thus, the majority of acts which appear altruistic are, in a twisty, convoluted way, actually self-serving (or self-DNA-serving), either by ensuring one's children's/relatives' survival or by contributing to the strength of the social group, and thus indirectly increasing the likelihood of one's own survival.

I broadly agree with this analysis, but can see it contains some holes...

Another prime motivator to be altruistic is the sense of well-being (or freedom from guilt) associated with giving - and securing one's notional self-image as a 'good, kind person'. This is reflected in my own attitude towards beggars and begging, particularly since moving to London and, specifically, Vauxhall. Now, Vauxhall is where 'The Big Issue' is based, so there're usually several individuals clustered around the Underground entrances every morning and evening. In the last few months, I've taken to giving my change (coppers and silver generally, occasionally pound coins, no notes) to one particular chap. I don't really stop to talk, but he recognises me and always says hello, 'have a good night' and so on. He looks to be in his forties, isn't especially attractive or amusing, doesn't have a baby or a dog.

Nothing particularly startling there, then. Why do I give regularly (and I do turn out my pockets to him most days) to this one individual? I'm not sure, but I think it's connected to that 'feeling of well-being' and relates to the way he consistently demonstrates gratitude. He doesn't do that thing of grabbing the coins, muttering something and immediately looking over my shoulder for the next one; he always appears genuinely thankful, even if I've handed him a pittance.

It's pretty clear, then, that my 'pattern of individual charity' is not needs-based (I don't think this one guy's especially needier than anyone else) and isn't even particularly predicated on the beggar as an individual. I don't give much thought to what he's like as a person; all I'm concerned with, really, is that I get that momentary warm, fuzzy 'good, kind person' glow off him. I don't give wodges of cash to anonymous charities, so my giving pattern is largely self-serving, psychologically-speaking.

So... two semi-linked points for discussion:

1) Does true altruism exist?

and

2) What's the basis of your pattern of individual charity?
 
 
Ganesh
09:34 / 01.05.03
(Oh yeah, and I know 'beggar' is a slightly iffy term to use - but I couldn't immediately think of a suitable alternative. Hope it doesn't distract from the issues at hand.)
 
 
Smoothly
09:45 / 01.05.03
My pattern of individual charity is much like yours Ganesh - the people I pass on a regular basis getting any low denomination silver coins I have to hand, or, more usually, cigarettes. Over time I have developed a certain bond with particular familiar faces, who clearly appreciate their regular 9.15 Benson.
I too derive some satisfaction from this, but I'm not sure that that casts any doubt on whether it is a truly altruistic act. I don't, for instance, believe that I make these donations because it feels good to be charitable. After all, if I was doing it in order to feel good about myself, it wouldn't make me feel good about myself. If you see what I mean.
 
 
Ganesh
09:53 / 01.05.03
On what basis do you decide who gets a cigarette, then? Are there particular patterns to your donating?
 
 
cal
09:55 / 01.05.03
this is "a" test
 
 
Smoothly
10:05 / 01.05.03
I think it's largely due to familiarity, the same basis that dictates who gets a nod or a smile in my local pub. Like yours, it's not a particularly needs-based system, in fact it's not much of a system at all. I wonder if in fact they are for me more acts of sociability more than charity.
 
 
Sax
10:07 / 01.05.03
I generally give a quid at random to whoever's asking, but probably only once an outing into the city centre where I work.

There is one thing that niggles, though, and it's probably just my tolerance levels falling as my age increases. There are about three guys in their 20s who work the same area of the city and always ask for "two pounds to get the train to Leeds". I've observed them on a few occaisons and they use the same line on everyone and it's pretty evident that they don't need money to get to Leeds. I've given cash to them before and probably will again, but personally I reckon they should be a bit more straight with people. I'd be much happier if someone said: "I need two quid for food/drugs/booze/porn" than an obvious lie. But that's just me being a crusty old git.

And I had a crisis last night as well. There was a Big Issue seller outside the theatre in Leeds and I genuinely honestly had no change less than £20 which, unfortunately, I wasn't going to give because that was my beer money. Okay, I should have given the £20. But I wanted a beer. Sue me. I told her I'd buy one on the way out which I'm sure is a line she gets several dozen times a night, but I honestly genuinely meant it. On the way out I even had my quid ready, but she wasn't there.

So, to answer the questions - my individual charity is pretty random and depends on what kind of mood I'm in. And I'm sure there's a lot of "ah, good karma for me! And it only cost a quid!" about it, too.

Still, it's better than burning tramps while they sleep. Surely.
 
 
Ganesh
23:00 / 01.05.03
Oh yeah, Sax; I'm absolutely not trying to say individual charity is void or meaningless because it's motivated by factors other than unalloyed concern for the needs of the recipient - and more than Princess Diana's HIV or land-mine work meant nothing because it was psychologically rather self-serving. I guess I'm just poking and prodding at our individual patterns of donation, and trying to identify common factors.
 
 
Sax
11:32 / 02.05.03
Here's another question: If you saw an obviously hungry homeless person in the street and s/he asked you for, say a couple of quid, and you offered to buy them food but they said no, they'd rather have the money, what would you do?

This question based on a row a couple of friends once had in a pub about whether you should give money to homeless people if you think they're going to spend it on drugs/booze or something else that the giver doesn't necessarily agree with. Does the act of charity give you a say in how the charitable contribution is disposed of?
 
 
Lurid Archive
11:42 / 02.05.03
Does the act of charity give you a say in how the charitable contribution is disposed of?

To some extent, yes. I'd probably give the money anyway, but then a couple of quid seems far too small an amount to attach strings to, in my view. There is a genuine concern about causing harm by enabling a drug habit, say, but I am always suspicious of those who prioritise that aspect. It easily becomes an excuse for not giving.
 
 
Ganesh
11:58 / 02.05.03
Does the act of charity give you some say in how the charitable contribution is disposed of?

I guess so - which is perhaps why the '£2 for my train fare home' is more commonly heard than '£2 for a pack of 8-Ace'. At the very least, the giver has the option of witholding his charitable contribution if he disapproves of the way in which it might be spent - which, depending on the setting, doesn't hugely encourage honesty.

Would I give money to the food-refuser? Depends on all kinds of situational variables: what they looked like, their manner in asking, how 'grateful' or threatening they were, how much they were asking for, whether they'd initially asked simply for '£2' or '£2 to buy a sandwich' (in which case, I'd feel they were being dishonest with me, and probably not give 'em the cash).
 
 
Lurid Archive
12:03 / 02.05.03
Really? I don't think I resent being lied to in that context. Though I'd probably give the food refuser less in cash than I would have spent on food.

When I look at the body language of most beggars they seem to be pretty miserable to me and it seems perfectly understandable that they lie to get a bit extra. Partly, I don't resent giving money that will be spent on alcohol or drugs, though that may be careless of me.
 
 
Ganesh
12:08 / 02.05.03
Well, in principle, and weighing up all the variables, I probably don't mind being lied to too much either. In the situation itself, though, I know things can be different: I don't like feeling like a mug, and I don't like people lying to me, so that warm fuzzy 'helping a grateful person' glow would likely be overwhelmed by less pleasant 'someone's taking advantage of me' and I'd walk on.

Like I say, a lot hinges on how the encounter makes me feel...
 
 
Kit-Cat Club
12:09 / 02.05.03
I dunno. I actually gave quite a lot of money to one of the local beggars the other day - I know his name as I go past him quite often and he always talks to me, so perhaps I feel there's more of a connexion there than with someone I have never seen before - because he said he needed it to pay for electricity for heating in the place he's just moved into (showed me the electricity key). I know he was homeless a while ago - he's always ill, I've given him money for medicine in the past - just Lemsip and stuff - and have subsequently seen him drinking the stuff, so I believe he's pretty much on the level - but I wouldn't be especially bothered if he turned out to be buying food etc. with what I gave him. I suspect he's squatting with no means of support, as I still see him out and about, and yesterday he was out on the street in the rain etc. so he must be pretty desperate. I just hope that if he's got some sort of address he'll be able to start getting out of the bind he's in at the moment.

On the other hand, there's a bloke who begs regularly in Brasenose Lane, plays the harmonica, who shouts abuse at people who don't give him money, especially young men - he's clearly got an alcohol problem and is in need of help, probably more in need of help than my previous example, but I bet he gets less help because he's unapproachable and sometimes frightening, poor old bastard.
 
  
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