Subcultural engagement for the 21st Century...
Barbelith is a new kind of community (find out more)...
You can login or register.

Underground > Conversation >

Arrrghhh fuck.

Page: (1)2

10:25 / 13.01.03

Damn it. I thought I was a shoo in for a place on a research degree course as I have a senior lecturer on my side. But I'm not, no place is forthcoming (because apparently my lack of an MA is a serious problem, and my proposal wasn't good enough - too journalistic), and I've wasted an entire fucking year by dropping out of an MA course. Fuuck. Fuckety fuck.

Nothing anyone can do to help, it's my own stupid fault. But I wanted to vent.

STOATIE LIEKS CHOCOLATE MILK

10:28 / 13.01.03

Sorry to hear that. That sucks shit.

10:35 / 13.01.03

Thanks, man. But I've no one to blame but myself. Of course, having really no idea how to write a PhD proposal didn't help much... but I really thought, as I had someone who really wanted me on board, that I'd get a place. It's my second refusal, too - nobody loves me.

Not sure what to do now - OU courses to fill the gaping wound this whole thing has left, then maybe teacher training. Gah.

11:13 / 13.01.03

I'm really sorry to hear that - rejection sucks, nicht wahr?

But I think it's worth saying what you already know: it is entirely possible to go back to it later - no one will think any the less of you for having taken some time out (and it certainly helps you focus on what you really want to do with your research, I find, even if the spirit is sometimes more willing than the flesh). I took three years out before I went back, and it hasn't made any difference to me, apart from my being perhaps a mite slower off the starting blocks... there's absolutely no reason why you can't have another pop at it, rewrite your proposal until it meets whatever criteria the institution wants, etc. Maybe it would be worth considering trying to get a place on a research-based MA programme? This would help solve the 'no MA but want to research *now*' problem. And don't worry about wasting a year - nothing's ever entirely wasted, and your subject isn't going to evaporate...

So. Courage.

11:32 / 13.01.03

Danke, KCC. I know...you're very correct. I just feel like this year is a write-off, because I'll have to wait til next September to start an MA. I feel like the white rabbit. And there are other issues surrounding this whole thing, too.

However, I reckon, I'm going to use this year to write - fiction, and work on my PhD proposal. Next year, I'll apply for the PhD with the souped-up proposal, and apply for a Cultural Studies MA as a fallback position.

Thanks, folks. Talking it through in my own head, writing on here, and listening to what you had to say, KCC, has helped clarify things rather. Much appreciated, you know...

Less searchable M0rd4nt

20:38 / 13.01.03

That's rough on you, Chol, but it sounds like you're approaching this in a really constructive way.

OU courses are very well thought-of in academia, according to Lurid. (I'm planning to start one myself come September.) Good luck.

The Return Of Rothkoid

21:57 / 13.01.03

Hugs, chol. I don't know what else to say other than that.

Goodness Gracious Meme

22:12 / 13.01.03

Grr. That sounds tough, but you seem to be handling it well, and to have a constructive plan. Good for you.

And to second what KKC said about postgrad work, in my experience. Especially with the more cult. studs end of it, age is not an issue at all. I did my MA when I was 23, and with a couple of other people, was definitely the baby of the course, the majority were late 20s to early 30s, with alot of time 'out', and having other perspectives was really useful to them in their work, and was valued by the department. (I went to Goldsmiths', and alot of the arts/humanites/social science depts there deliberately choose postgrad applicants to create a mix of backgrounds, culture *and* ages)

Good luck.

09:31 / 14.01.03

Thanks, everyone...really. Stuff'll be alright. Just a bit of a shock. I really appreciate all the kind words...

11:00 / 14.01.03

All I can offer is hugs - I was sure you was going to get on this course, but I don't know how these things work so I don't know how to offer constructive advice. It must be a real blow.

11:08 / 14.01.03

OU courses are very well thought-of in academia, according to Lurid. (I'm planning to start one myself come September.)

True, but that's because you need to be seriously commited to them, far more so than standard university courses. Think very, very carefully about how many you're going to sign yourself up for.

11:22 / 14.01.03

It's too late for undergraduate OU courses this year (the plan was to stock up my knowledge of and qualifications in curriculum subjects so that I could take teacher training after my PhD, assuming i ever get to do a PhD) - and you're only allowed to do 120 points per year anyway, so an MA takes at least two years, I think. But you are very correct - I tried the OU before, and you do have to be quite a bit more disciplined than for normal university courses. I gave up that time.

Regrettable Juvenilia

11:46 / 14.01.03

Yeah, I don't really have any constructive advice either, except that I know from job-hunting experiences how discouraging it can be to get turned down when you wanted x or y and thought there was a good chance it was in the bag - can make you want to run away from yr own plans/amitions for some time. But don't let the bastichs grind you down! And hugs. And non-alcoholic beverages of choice.

12:03 / 14.01.03

One thing I'd say is that you can learn a lot from this kind of rejection. Ok, that sounds crap and getting accepted is always better but when I've had proposals rejected it has made me think about how to write them. Presumably you'll write a better (more likely to be succesful) proposal next time. And as everyone has said, taking a year out isn't the end of the world.

12:41 / 14.01.03

Thing is, the proposal was read by a senior member of staff, who seemed to think my acceptance was virtually certain, and who wanted to supervise my work. Ze said that the next step would be an interview. And all that meant I didn't really prepare myself for failure, even though i'd been rejected be another dept. already. I will rework the whole thing, of course, taking into account what the head of the department said. Just a bit peeved, because I know I can do it, and I truly believe I'm ready.

Thanks, everyone - hugs and kind words most appreciated.

Goodness Gracious Meme

12:56 / 14.01.03

Don't know what area you're planning on working in, but wondered if this might be of use:

The London Consortium is a birbeck-based cult studs. research institute who offer 1year MRes and Phd courses. The faculty looks pretty hot and their way of working sounds interesting...

14:55 / 14.01.03

Wow - sounds really interesting. I am likely to end up in a cultural studies department somewhere - I want to research slash fan fiction. Thanks loads for the link, bip!

16:10 / 14.01.03

Sorry Chol.

I've just failed to get a decent postdoc proposal together, and now can't apply 'till next January and even if I get it, it won't start 'till sept 2004! In the meantime, I have almost 2 years of McJob to look forward to. It sucks, but believe me, it's par for the course. It won't affect you long term. There's an old Chinese saying which roughly translates as, Don't mind going slow, so long as you keep going. This is my current mantra, and maybe it shd be yours too!

Goodness Gracious Meme

17:37 / 14.01.03

Actually, Chol, you could use the time to *really* shop around and check out as many departments/possible supervisors as possible. Even if you end up opting for the same place, it'll mean you do it with more conviction, having checked out all the options...

I did alot of this for my MA and definitely ended up in the right place, am really glad I made the effort.

Oh and rereading that faculty list, I'll be dead jealous if you end up there. Parveen Adams! Laura Mulvey! But if you do go there, please punch Philip Dodd on the nose for me. Cheers...

19:05 / 14.01.03

Yeah, shopping around is definitely on the cards now... I am trying to be philosophical about the whole thing. Thanks everyone, for being so sweet...

20:45 / 14.01.03

The Force is strong in you, Chol...

20:53 / 14.01.03

I love that! Thank you so much, Persephone...

17:49 / 15.01.03

I just posted my library card and NUS card back to college, as per their instructions. It really feels like handing over my gun and badge. Sigh.

However, depending on the status of my writing, I've decided to apply for some May-start OU MA courses. Which might go some way to compensate for my lack of an actual MA.

19:36 / 15.01.03

Thing is, the proposal was read by a senior member of staff, who seemed to think my acceptance was virtually certain, and who wanted to supervise my work. Ze said that the next step would be an interview. And all that meant I didn't really prepare myself for failure, even though i'd been rejected be another dept.

You may have just been unlucky. Its entirely plausible and all too common. If thats the case, then the only way to win is to keep playing. (Remind me I should never gamble).

Its also possible that your friendly member of staff isn't that clued up with regards to proposal quality. I couldn't say, not knowing them, but it is possible. Even if they are smart and senior. In which case you should get second opinions.

Anyway, good luck with the OU.

19:52 / 15.01.03

Ze is a senior staff member who has long experience of taking on PhD students in the Anthropology Department, and should be fairly clued up about proposals. Ze was in my corner from the start, but already had hir quota of Anth. PhD students, so couldn't take me on in that department. However, ze just moved part-time to the Cult. Studs. dept. and was willing to supervise me there. But the Head of Department scuppered my lovely plans in that direction. I guess I will just try and try again...

Thanks, all.

22:28 / 16.01.03

Cho, babe: all will be well. What everyone has said is true. It will do you the world of good to have some time off and write fiction: I have done barely any work on my PhD the last 18 months and the fanfiction has taught me more than any formal academic stuff could, about how I work, how I think, and how to finish lengthy projects.

And when you've done that - come to Leeds/Gauda Prime! We'll be happy to have you, and our house prices are relatively low.

Nietzsch E. Coyote

04:52 / 17.01.03

Sorry to hear about what happens but it sounds like you know how to deal with it. Good luck. Sounds like departmental politics had something to do with your being scuppered.

Can someone please tell me what an OU Course is? I don't know and I am speedily approaching the time when I will need to know.

05:52 / 17.01.03

I believe it is a course at the Open University (i.e. big possibilities for distance learning). Believe me, I'd love to teach there - I'm so much better in cyberspace than IRL!

Nonsense Deva, Gauda Prime is a hole, and that's an Objective Scientific Fact. 'Cos I was there for a while. There was this terrible incident when a murderer wheeled a corpse through the city centre in a wheel barrow and no one bothered him. Stay in Laahndan Chol, it's safer even if the beer's not so cheap.

And yes, the politics between sociology / anthropology and cultural studies are quite tense at the moment, as you can tell from the fact I just gratuitously had a go at Deva. ;-) Ze could be after my job, and ze's not even a scientist. Disgusting. This country's going down the tubes, I tell ya.

11:08 / 17.01.03

Leeds is receiving consideration, as are various other departments, but I'll probably end up staying in London one way or another (fortunately, the price of beer is neither here nor there, seeing as alcohol doesn't agree with me). Thank you, everyone, for being so sweet and helpful - I've recovered from the disappointment quite well, I think. I plan to stock up my reserves of cultural studies knowledge with the Open University courses, and try again for the start of the next academic year.

Goodness Gracious Meme

15:02 / 17.01.03

< off topic rambling, but I couldn't let it lie >
Gauda Prime is *not* a hole. Bill, you are a fool.

It's a grand place, I spent many happy weeks there pretending I wasn't signed up to being stuck in fucking Essex for three years. Great atmosphere and some of the best clubs and pubs in existence, back then. And sure that still holds. And spookily enough, met someone last night who'd studied there and got to reminisce about it for the first time in ages, much fun had recalling one of the Best Clubs Ever, a Gauda Prime institution.

< end of off topic rambing >

And was my second choice for an MA.

But while we're being academically partisan (cult stud and soc/anthro academics, situated and biased? whatever next

), have you considered Goldsmiths?

Its cultural studies/sociology/anthropology/media & comms./art history depts all contribute to their cult. studs MAs and research seminars, giving you access to a real range and some amazing people. I'd thoroughly recommend it as an intellectual/social atmosphere, I found it a really inspiring place to study/work/hang out/live. And made several of my closest friends there. My year there really was one of the best of my life.

< wooden spoon >

Oh, and it's a shame you can't ask the much-missed Bluestocking which is better, Gauda or Goldsmiths, as I know ze'd pick Goldsmiths every time! Ze knows the score.

And yes, the politics between sociology / anthropology and cultural studies are quite tense at the moment.

Well, that's understandable, contrasting cultural studies' validation of its non-scientific basis in with Soc/Anthro's denial/defensive determination that it *is* Science. (Methinks theres a bit too much protesting...)

Hey, I think i've just perfomed the Deva/Bill double spike. Yay me!

Goodness Gracious Meme

16:49 / 17.01.03

don't take my word for it, see for yourself.

Ok. stopped now.

00:06 / 19.01.03

There was this terrible incident when a murderer wheeled a corpse through the city centre in a wheel barrow and no one bothered him.

Um, would you bother him? I sure as hell wouldn't. I'm not even sure someone thats wheeling a dead body through the town center can be bothered. Thats some whole other shit.

08:53 / 23.01.03

Ooh, interesting. I just found out that it is common practice in this cult. studs. dept. to get pretty much everyone to rewrite their proposal. Which puts things in an entirely different light... am now likely to resubmit my proposal this year, and don't feel nearly so demoralised...

11:34 / 23.01.03

Scratch that. The MA thing is still a problem for the head of department. I'm too tired for all this...

11:55 / 23.01.03

Um, would you bother him?

Hmmm.... now that you mention it, no, prolly not!

Page: (1)2