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Suicide, death, the soul and eternity ...

06:00 / 10.01.03

Need some advice and maybe a little magickal aid. A friend committed suicide by hanging on Monday, and we only discovered him on Wednesday. His wife is taking it badly and is blaming herself. To make a long story short ... is there any way that I can do a ritual, blessing, whatever to guide his spirit to a better place (as I've heard that comitting suicide is very bad karma/you immediately go to hell/etc. etc. etc.) and a protection for her and her shildren to help them through the loss.

The mourning period is essential, and I'm not trying to make it all better ... I just want to give a totally depressed, feel-like-giving-up-and-dying friend something to cling to that isn't dark.

Love & light
Shadow

14:40 / 10.01.03

Be there for them. I think that's the most important thing. Give them your shoulder to lean on or cry on or whatever.

Finding the right words in situations like this is very difficult. From my experience, actions are more effective than reassuring words, at least early on when the grieving are too shocked to really listen. Just be there.

Get them involved in your ritual. Pray with them (and I don't mean "pray" in the traditional religious sense, necessarily). Maybe ask them what they think might help the lost soul find it's way.

They need time to grieve and rage and feel guilty and confused before moving on. Helping the living come to terms with what happened may be the best way to help the deceased find peace as well.

Share a good laugh with everyone too, as hard as that may be, whenever possible.

There isn't really a universal instruction manual to deal with these kinds of things, is there? Hope some of this helped. Good luck, and all the best to you and them.

15:17 / 10.01.03

Sincere Condolences.

I know plenty about survivors' guilt. It isn't her fault, she didn't tie the knot. It probably won't help to hear it, though.
My God is Odin - god of hanged men. Hanging was used as a sacraficial method to him. His day is Woden's Day.

Hel [spell'd thus] is the Name of Loki's halfdead daughter who presides over the realm of the dead. Don't start worrying just because Christians misunderstood all those years ago. It seems he had his sights set on a better place, rather than the "waitng room of the soul".

Christ! I've wanted to go often enough. All that stopped me were three little words:
"what happens next?"

Odin is a psychopomp, conveyor of the dead. It seems your friend put himself into a most suitable pair of hands. I'll have a word.

Nietzsch E. Coyote

19:43 / 10.01.03

So will I. Although I may owe ol' one eye a favor for it.

23:56 / 10.01.03

Difficult situation.
Besides the human/pshychological aspects for the survivors (which is very important), there's the matter of the lost soul. I've "worked" with spirits/souls of death people more than i'd like to admit, but never with a suicidal. Some dead-by-accident, though.
Ussually they take more time to digest the idea of being death... and a lot is depending on his personal beliefs. Try to find his soul/spirit in the dreaming/astral, and try to talk with him. He'll probably have a lot of unfinished business, guilt, and messages for the living. Dealing with the recently dead is a lot like dealing with the living... requires a lot of pshychology.
On another vein, perhaps some offerings and an altar to a "good death" god? Or summoning an angel to guide him to eternity?
Good luck.

07:27 / 13.01.03

Hi,

Thanks for the advice. Anything from the 'others' that you guys were going to talk about?

About going to the astral and talking to him ... well, I have no experience in that field, which leaves me up the creek without a paddle.

There is a lot of contributing factors that makes this particular case difficult to deal with. Don't want to go into too much detail on an open forum though.

Another disturbing development is that his 5 year old son is talking about hanging himself or killing himself by other means to be with his dad. To be honest, this is a little disconcerting, because the children have been told that he's died of a heart attack. So, hearing his son talking about hanging himself, is waving huge red flags. Any idea of how to deal with this (I know this isn't magic in nature, but thought to keep all related stuff in the same thread).

Thanks a million for the advice so far.

Shadow

09:31 / 13.01.03

I would strongly advise finding a decent shaman to do this work. Someone who comes recommended, who seems down-to-earth, someone you can trust. Most practitioners will be used to psychopomp work, and will be able to locate the spirit and guide it on to wherever it's supposed to be. Put simply, shamanic methodology is uniquely adapted for this task. A lot of them will also have counselling skills, and be adept ritual storytellers from the years they've spent recounting their journeys. An accomplished shaman may well use their Otherworld experience to bring peace to the family in this manner, and they should also be able to work with the son and what seems to be his unhealthy tie to his father.

00:05 / 14.01.03

Shadow, I'm very sorry to hear about your friend's suicide. It's hard enough dealing with death, but suicide is difficult to cope with.

I can only tell you what I've experienced with this one, having journeyed to a spot where a lot of people were committing suicide (some places seem to attract this). The impression I got from the one suicide I talked to was a kind of aimless directionlessness. He had been so focused on the act, that the aftermath kind of took him by surprise. He had not taken into account that there might be something else beyond this existence. However, that was his experience, others might deal with it differently. My experiences in talking to deceased people indicate that all of them do deal with it differently.

Regarding rituals, you might want to check out Starhawk's Pagan Book of Living and Dying which specifically deals with rituals around death which I seem to remember as containing very useful, and well-written, suggestions around this very difficult subject.

Your love and support for your friend and her family will be of immense help, and just being there will do a lot. Grief is a wild and scary ride for those not experiencing it directly, and often people try to step back from it, but do your best to hang in and accept the tears and heartache, and allow the people to find a way to cope. I think that will help the person who killed himself too.

Good luck and lots of strength to you and the family.

May Charon ferry his soul safely to its next destination.

00:08 / 14.01.03

Oh, I just rememberd the LifeRites group who operate out of the UK - about which I've only heard good things. They specifically design rites of passage for births, deaths, etc., and the site might give you some good ideas or links to other resources.

23:21 / 16.01.03

So sorry to hear that. Death is extremely difficult and suicide brings so many other questions/issues along with it for those attached to the deceased. If you're really close to these people then just try to be there for them, give support, call them when you can. Maybe let the son know that he needs to stay here to take care of mom. And when things settle down a bit, after a few months, strongly encourage therapy of some sort (and don't discourage medication if necessary, just make sure it's in combination with therapy). Find a good psychologist with a warm heart so your friend can just open up and work through her own issues surrounding this trauma. Having someone totally unattached and anonymous to confide in can be of enormous value.